Thread: Bailey's 070 and 038

Originally Posted by Lakeside53

o.k. I'll bite....

Actually I don't approve of any Chinese (and Taiwan is "Chinese") or any other county, or a blatent copy of anything. Why don't these foreign rip-off artists just design make their own saw from scratch? It easy - 'cos it's hard to market a saw that isn't an obvious Stihl or Husky or whatever copy. Why don't they make them here - because they are within the reach of intellectual property law.

Taiwan actually has intellectual property law, unlike China, but it is not as stringent as U.S. law. The problem is all parts on the 038 and 070 have been made for well over 20 years now, and any patents are long gone. We would love to market OEM Stihl parts (or who ever makes them for Stihl), but obviously that is not in the cards. In any case, we are filling a demand that has developed due to the crazy increases in OEM part pricing and the fact that most European saw manufacturers will not allow direct marketing of parts on the internet. On the bright side, this will force manufacturers to come up with more ambitious designs to keep ahead of the curve (as Stihl has done!).

Is Baileys no longer a Stihl dealer in the US?

Originally Posted by Lakeside53

o.k. I'll bite....

Actually I don't approve of any Chinese (and Taiwan is "Chinese") or any other county, or a blatent copy of anything. Why don't these foreign rip-off artists just design make their own saw from scratch? It easy - 'cos it's hard to market a saw that isn't an obvious Stihl or Husky or whatever copy. Why don't they make them here - because they are within the reach of intellectual property law.

In this case I just don't see the value... Maybe someone will think it's fun to make up an entire saw, but in the end all you have is the saw that most of us wouldn't have bought in the first place. This has more to do with Baileys selling to the parts market than the actual saw kits.

From a earlier post:
Good thing there isn't any American Corporations involved with corporate espionage of foreign companies. They would never lobby behind closed doors to keep a product out of the US until they have the patent sewed up. Once they have the patent, they would certainly build the product in the US instead of exporting jobs.

Originally Posted by Grande Dog

From a earlier post:
Good thing there isn't any American Corporations involved with corporate espionage of foreign companies. They would never lobby behind closed doors to keep a product out of the US until they have the patent sewed up. Once they have the patent, they would certainly build the product in the US instead of exporting jobs.

A Deere John letter?

Originally Posted by PES+

Is Baileys no longer a Stihl dealer in the US?

We buy from the open market. If you have chainsaw parts and goods, we have a market for such goods. We buy from over 1,000 different vendors. Is Stihl in our vendor list? Maybe. Do we offer OEM Stihl parts? Maybe. Then again, we are always getting inventory from defunct Stihl dealers all the time. Would we like to market OEM Stihl products through our catalog and internet website? I think we all know that answer. Who knows, Chiristmas is coming!

I am pretty sure I still have some cases of " Stihl" snowmobile oil left stashed away

Originally Posted by Grande Dog

From a earlier post:
Good thing there isn't any American Corporations involved with corporate espionage of foreign companies. They would never lobby behind closed doors to keep a product out of the US until they have the patent sewed up. Once they have the patent, they would certainly build the product in the US instead of exporting jobs.

At least an American company has to make it look a lot different.... or step very carefully... Oh wait.. you're an American company...

It's not about "patents"; it about leaching off the work of others... "intellectual property" and market development doesn't come cheap and much of it should belong to those that spend the money to create it. I'm certainly not against competion and free enterprise.. but how far does foreign junk dumping into Amercia have to go before everyone is really pissed off? Sure there's protectionist companies trying whatever to gain an advantage, but with the likes of what your company is doing, how unreasonable is that?

Originally Posted by NBailey

We buy from the open market. If you have chainsaw parts and goods, we have a market for such goods. We buy from over 1,000 different vendors. Is Stihl in our vendor list? Maybe. Do we offer OEM Stihl parts? Maybe. Then again, we are always getting inventory from defunct Stihl dealers all the time. Would we like to market OEM Stihl products through our catalog and internet website? I think we all know that answer. Who knows, Chiristmas is coming!

What do you mean "maybe? Sure you offerstihl oem parts...I know guys that called your number and you offer to source pretty much everything. They were quoted MSRP so they didn't really see the point. I believe they were told you buy it "locally". Does it affect me? not, in the slightest.

Originally Posted by NBailey

Taiwan actually has intellectual property law, unlike China, but it is not as stringent as U.S. law. The problem is all parts on the 038 and 070 have been made for well over 20 years now, and any patents are long gone. We would love to market OEM Stihl parts (or who ever makes them for Stihl), but obviously that is not in the cards. In any case, we are filling a demand that has developed due to the crazy increases in OEM part pricing and the fact that most European saw manufacturers will not allow direct marketing of parts on the internet. On the bright side, this will force manufacturers to come up with more ambitious designs to keep ahead of the curve (as Stihl has done!).

The EPA, and European vibration regulations, is forcing the major design changes.. not the import of saw forgeries or parts, or not even competition between the big makers. I doubt Stihl and Husky would have gone the strato route had they not had their arm twisted.

Patents are not the issue you seem to think they are.. Stihl (for example) did not try to patent the 038 as a complete assembly and I doubt many of those parts were ever patented. In fact there is no patent protection on most parts for any one saw.

There are "design patents" and many other laws that can be used to protect blatant trademark and intellectual property infringement. For example.. among many other protections, Stihl has trademarked the "orange over gray" form of their pro saws. Anyone care to test that in court by bringing in an 038 look-alike?

The aftermarket autoparts makers have been plugging away for years, making just about everything the OEMs do.. but they don't offer a complete kit Ford Pinto.. bad example, but you get my drift...

Intellectual property would imply intellect.....

Does not compute for me

Even Ford who smashed countless online forums using that argument does not keep after market companies from offering parts for their vehicles

THAT is my beef

Originally Posted by Lakeside53

What do you mean "maybe? Sure you offerstihl oem parts...I know guys that called your number and you offer to source pretty much everything. They were quoted MSRP so they didn't really see the point. I believe they were told you buy it "locally". Does it affect me? not, in the slightest.

Andy, we are not trying to affect you, or the 1,000's of other Stihl dealers in North America. We are trying to supply our customer base with products they wish. 95% of the market is supplied by local dealers right now, but even as vast as the Stihl dealer network is, there are still some pretty big holes out there. Our strongest markets happen to be in dealership void areas. Also, many of our customers work long hours, in far away locations, and do not have the time to access dealerships during their business hours. They enjoy the ability to sit down and dial onto our website and securely order what they want, at any hour of the day.

There is no further EPA pending UNTIL a manufacturer releases a new product that would make further emission improvements feasible.

The EPA does not have anything to do with either vibration levels nor sound emissions......wrong agency mate

Originally Posted by PES+

There is no further EPA pending UNTIL a manufacturer releases a new product that would make further emission improvements feasible.

The EPA does not have anything to do with either vibration levels nor sound emissions......wrong agency mate

Not sure what you mean by your first statement. Right now were all heading to the 2010 regiualtions... and buring off credits.

Vibration : you misread my post... yes, different agencies. I'll go back and put in a comma for you..

Originally Posted by Lakeside53

Not sure what you mean by your first statement. Right now were all heading to the 2010 regiualtions... and buring off credits.

Vibration : you misread my post... yes, different agencies. I'll go back and put in a comma for you..

You might want to check for yourself the facts instead of listening to your sales wonk man.

There is no further clean up nor rules for 2010 in the USA

[QUOTE=NBailey;805546]. We are trying to supply our customer base with products they wish. 95% of the market is supplied by local dealers right now, but even as vast as the Stihl dealer network is, there are still some pretty big holes out there. QUOTE]

That part I agree with, and if Stihl won't do it, then someone will/has... I'm still not sure why Stihl doesn't do it themselves, to zip codes not covered by dealers, and if they sell to dealer covered zips, rebate some small part to local dealers. it's what I would do, but.. I'm not them.