Husqvarna 440e VERY hard to pull start

[moogin]

Hello all,
I stumbled across this site after researching a problem I am having with my, new this season, Husq. 440 saw.
First off I want to state that this is the first saw I have owned, I have operated other saws on various occasions but never have owned one myself. This season I did some digging to find out what was a decent saw that offered enough power to handle clearing select trees from my property this spring/summer. I am fairly mechanical and feel fairly comfortable working on my own tools. With that said , let me outline the issue I am having...

So the saw ran perfectly for the first week or so, then after a long day of work on Friday I left my saw sitting over the weekend. When I came back to it Monday, the pull cord was extremely hard to pull. It felt very Jumpy and would catch, and then pull a small amount, catch again, and continue. I am able to get it started despite this, and when it does start it runs perfectly. I did some digging and found that someone mentioned that they were able to fix what appeared to be the same issue that I am having by removing the plug and giving the engine a few turns at that point, and replacing the plug. I removed the plug and the pull cord pulled as smoothly as ever with the plug OUT. after I replaced the plug, it went back to it's old, hard to pull ways. Tomorrow I am going to check the exhaust and see if its gummed up to the point where air cannot escape, which could be contributing to the compression issue I am having where I cannot seem to decompress the engine enough to turn it? Even when I use the little compression dimple/bubble it doesn't seem to have an effect on making it any easier to pull. Could this be an issue caused by not running premium fuel in my mix ( I didn't know until I read about maintaining my saw, oops! ) for 2 tanks? I also read that someone recommends using SeaFoam to try to clean out any fuel blockage problems in the engine. Sorry for this being so long, just trying to give an accurate description of my problem so I can try to fix it.
Thanks ahead of time, hope we can figure this out.

 

[fearofpavement]

Hmmm, if the saw pulls over easily with the plug out, but pulls hard and jerky with the plug in, this almost sounds normal to me. If you aren't very familiar with saws, I would have someone that is give it a try and offer an opinion as to whether the resistance you're feeling is abnormal. A saw should nearly hang from the pull cord with the compression. ie, if you pick it up by the rope it should slowly lower in a somewhat jerky fashion as the engine slowly turns over. The other potential issue would be hydraulic lock which is caused by liquid getting in the cylinder. If it pulls hard and you pull out the spark plug and pull it over it would shoot mix gas out the spark plug hole if that were the issue. (a lot of mix gas, not a few drops)

 

[SawGarage]

Moogin,

Keep in mind, you may be experiencing that the engine is BREAKING in, which will make compression stronger...

vapor-lock can happen too, when sitting in the HEAT...

Also, a 2 stroke has a compression stroke with EVERY revolution as well... decompression SHOULD relieve SOME of the 'feeling'..

starter retracting ok?
something interfering with the flywheel passing the coil?
garbage in the clutch area?
brake on?


IF you are around the central MA area, I can take a peek @ it for you...

send me a PM

Jay

 

[moogin]

hey fear thanks for the reply
i was expecting to get flamed somewhat since I am quite new to saws. I appreciate your helpful response haha.. I will most certainly ask a fellow who has been teaching me here and there what he thinks.
This is actually the thread that I found this site from, and the compression hypothesis I had
Stihl chainsaw almost locked up-? - TractorByNet.com
I just found it googling around.
Do you think I did any damage when I ran regular fuel in it instead of the premium that is recommended?
Nothing Shot out of the spark plug hole when I turned it over with no plug by the way...

 

[moogin]

Hey thanks for the reply, unfortunately I am in Maine I would most certainly take you up on that if I were a little closer..ok I feel like a fool right now but does my saw have a decompression valve on it? I haven't been using it if it does, damn it ... hope I haven't damaged this tool still plenty to learn

I can only rule out the last 2 things for certain as I cleaned the whole saw best I could and removed all garbage and made sure the brake was off... as for the other 2 points you raised I cannot say with certainty one way or the other

and fear: nothing came out of the spark plug hole when I turned the engine without the plug in

I do appreciate the responses, maybe what I am feeling is normal / engine breaking in .. although it seems awfully hard to pull. I just worry that I am doing damage to my saw by trying to start it in this state

 

[Anthony_Va.]

I would suggest getting a compression tester on it. May just be some good ole high compression and thats a good thing. Some saws are hard to pull. Give it a good solid jerk. Buckle up buttercup, lol.

 

[RBurtcher]

Welcome,
I'm sorry to say this but you basically have 2 options at this point. Deal with it as is and be happy with 1 jerky starting saw.

OR.

Hang around this place and own 5-10 more saws then you'll ever need.

 

[MtnHermit]

Tank Full?

I have a 435 which is essentially the same motor as a 440e. On a recent trail clearing project I started it at least a dozen times, but the last log it wouldn't start with the lukewarm engine. Tried again the next morning, it started but wouldn't run. Even though I checked the gas tank both places and it had a couple ounces of fuel, I concluded it was "out of gas"! There wasn't enough fuel to cover the large filter. My guess, it would run the tank dry but not start with a few ounces?

I didn't plan to use the saw again until late-May/June so I didn't want to fill the tank.

Long/short, Tank Full?

 

[MtnHermit]

Tomorrow I am going to check the exhaust and see if its gummed up to the point where air cannot escape,

Pull the spark screen, could be clogged. If it is, you're likely running rich or too much oil in the mix. Looks like this:

 

[moogin]

hey all thanks for the replies
i checked the screen mtnhermit and it all looked clear, it was still jerky to start but I ran it all day and it seems fine. maybe i need to just get used to it, which is perfectly OK in my book I just wanted to make sure that nothing was indeed wrong with the saw. I am learning every day and hope to find answers to many of my questions here on the forums. Thanks again I do appreciate you guys being gentle with the new guy ;D I love the saw and I could certainly see myself owning more saws then I need in the future. In the mean time I need to practice my wedge techniques.

Anyone have any thoughts on running premium vs regular in these saws?

consider my buttercup buckled ! umpkin2:

 

[fearofpavement]

These small saws do not have a rotating mass of any account such as a lawnmower's blade. Thus the ropes pull quite difficultly and jerky as you are feeling each compression stroke. Every revolution of the crank is a compression stroke unlike a four cycle engine which only compresses every other time. Tell you what, go to your nearest Homedespot or Lows type store and pull the rope on a few of their display models to see if they are similar. (make sure the switches are off...)

Now to answer some or your questions, the grade of fuel didn't hurt anything. Also, if the saw does have a compression release and you don't use it, that didn't hurt anything either. The main death of chainsaws is improperly mixed fuel. That accounts for probably 90% of two stroke engine deaths. The other 10% is a whole long list of things.

So: For long life make sure you have good fuel/oil and keep the chain sharp and your air filter clean.
Get and wear some protective gear (helmet, eye and hearing, chaps, footwear, gloves) Some of this you probably already have. It is worth the money to buy what you don't have.
Happy cutting!

 

[Denis Gionet]

My brand new 435 seized the piston due to running regular gas and/or the wrong kind of mix oil, although it was mixed to the correct ratio. Mistakes happen... sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug. Now as a precaution I won't use anything but premium gas and OEM (or equivalent) oil, until it's at least stable enough to trust. And these saws tend to be adjusted on the lean side for the Emissions control, so there's little room for error if running borderline gas. Gas is expensive when I fill the truck, yes, but not a gallon at a time for the good stuff. The repair shop had obviously adjusted the carb after replacing the piston/cylinder, as it doesn't run the same now as before, more rich and screams less. Just perfect now.

My 2 cents worth, hope it's well received.

 

[moogin]

This site is awesome, really glad I found it.
You guys are really helpful and are putting my mind at ease somewhat as a new saw owner / operator .
I think I may put the half gallon of mixed regular gas on the burn pile and refill with premium. Do oil/fuel mixes separate after sitting for a couple days and require remixing before filling the tank?

Gionet, how fast did the piston seize when you were running a bad mix? one tank full, 2, 5? Were there any warning signs ? Just trying to keep these in mind for the future. How bad did it hurt the wallet if you dont mind me asking. Also, I imagine just like other 2 stroke machines, they must be rebuilt from time to time, I should dig around in my manual to see if they mention anything like that. I would think it should last multiple years before needing a rebuild if treated properly..

Also I've been watching some videos online about sharpening my chains but I think I am going to take them and get them sharpened the first time to give me another week or so to learn how to sharpen them on my own. The saw is such a great tool and I have already made huge leaps in thinning out trees that were slowly overtaking my property. I want to continue learning about techniques/and saw maintenance so I can keep this baby running! I love it!

Thanks again, and feel free to drop any wisdom in here I am trying to soak it all up.

-

Wesley

 

[fearofpavement]

My brand new 435 seized the piston due to running regular gas and/or the wrong kind of mix oil, although it was mixed to the correct ratio. Mistakes happen... sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug. Now as a precaution I won't use anything but premium gas and OEM (or equivalent) oil, until it's at least stable enough to trust. And these saws tend to be adjusted on the lean side for the Emissions control, so there's little room for error if running borderline gas. Gas is expensive when I fill the truck, yes, but not a gallon at a time for the good stuff. The repair shop had obviously adjusted the carb after replacing the piston/cylinder, as it doesn't run the same now as before, more rich and screams less. Just perfect now.

My 2 cents worth, hope it's well received.

Almost guarantee your saw seized from running too lean and NOT from the "wrong kind" of mix oil. Some oils are better than others but any of them should prevent seizing.

 

[moogin]

hey so i have to confess something :taped:, when i first filled my saw i thought i had a 1gal container but when it was filled up it was 1.25 gallons and i only added the small oil container meant for 50:1 mixtures in 1 gallon of gas so i was running lean for 1 tank until I noticed. I added a little more oil and remixed. How badly did I hurt my engine :msp_sad:

 

[w8ye]

Just do let that happen again. I doubt you did any noticable harm to it.

 

[carrbear]

moogin check out http://www.arboristsite.com/stickies/148248.htm.
Its got some good info about chainsaws for you such as how to tune your carb richer than it was set from the factory. This will lessen the chance of having a lean piston seizure. You also need a tool you can buy off eBay - New & used electronics, cars, apparel, collectibles, sporting goods & more at low prices to adjust your carb. You might want to also think about using non-ethanol gas. http://www.arboristsite.com/chainsaw/197298.htm The alcohol in ethanol gas doesn't always do good things to small engines. If you don't have access to non-ethanol gas, walmart sells TRUFUEL 40:1 mix no ethanol fuel in their chainsaw section.

 

[SawTroll]

My brand new 435 seized the piston due to running regular gas and/or the wrong kind of mix oil, although it was mixed to the correct ratio. Mistakes happen... sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug. Now as a precaution I won't use anything but premium gas and OEM (or equivalent) oil, until it's at least stable enough to trust. And these saws tend to be adjusted on the lean side for the Emissions control, so there's little room for error if running borderline gas. Gas is expensive when I fill the truck, yes, but not a gallon at a time for the good stuff. The repair shop had obviously adjusted the carb after replacing the piston/cylinder, as it doesn't run the same now as before, more rich and screams less. Just perfect now.

My 2 cents worth, hope it's well received.

The dealer should of course have checked and adjusted any lean carb setting at the point of sale, but it too often doesn't happen, from what I read here - and of course not at "box stores".....

 

[redfisher]

Hello all,
I stumbled across this site after researching a problem I am having with my, new this season, Husq. 440 saw.
First off I want to state that this is the first saw I have owned, I have operated other saws on various occasions but never have owned one myself. This season I did some digging to find out what was a decent saw that offered enough power to handle clearing select trees from my property this spring/summer. I am fairly mechanical and feel fairly comfortable working on my own tools. With that said , let me outline the issue I am having...

So the saw ran perfectly for the first week or so, then after a long day of work on Friday I left my saw sitting over the weekend. When I came back to it Monday, the pull cord was extremely hard to pull. It felt very Jumpy and would catch, and then pull a small amount, catch again, and continue. I am able to get it started despite this, and when it does start it runs perfectly. I did some digging and found that someone mentioned that they were able to fix what appeared to be the same issue that I am having by removing the plug and giving the engine a few turns at that point, and replacing the plug. I removed the plug and the pull cord pulled as smoothly as ever with the plug OUT. after I replaced the plug, it went back to it's old, hard to pull ways. Tomorrow I am going to check the exhaust and see if its gummed up to the point where air cannot escape, which could be contributing to the compression issue I am having where I cannot seem to decompress the engine enough to turn it? Even when I use the little compression dimple/bubble it doesn't seem to have an effect on making it any easier to pull. Could this be an issue caused by not running premium fuel in my mix ( I didn't know until I read about maintaining my saw, oops! ) for 2 tanks? I also read that someone recommends using SeaFoam to try to clean out any fuel blockage problems in the engine. Sorry for this being so long, just trying to give an accurate description of my problem so I can try to fix it.
Thanks ahead of time, hope we can figure this out.

I own a 440 and readily admit there are times I am uttering obscenities at it. A few pointers... If you are cold starting the saw, step one is throw the red choke lever up, two is pump six times, three is pull the saw through about three times (and this is where you find it difficult to "ratchet through), then put the red choke lever to neutral position and pull vigorously. The saw May not start right away and may 'catch' and then quit a few times. Set it down and wait a few minutes . Often it will then start. If not, reprime.

 

[Buckets]

Hmmm, if the saw pulls over easily with the plug out, but pulls hard and jerky with the plug in, this almost sounds normal to me. If you aren't very familiar with saws, I would have someone that is give it a try and offer an opinion as to whether the resistance you're feeling is abnormal. A saw should nearly hang from the pull cord with the compression. ie, if you pick it up by the rope it should slowly lower in a somewhat jerky fashion as the engine slowly turns over. The other potential issue would be hydraulic lock which is caused by liquid getting in the cylinder. If it pulls hard and you pull out the spark plug and pull it over it would shoot mix gas out the spark plug hole if that were the issue. (a lot of mix gas, not a few drops)