Sharpening

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If one can improve sharpening, it just makes it all the more pleasurable each time the saw is used. I think I gave the Timberline a good effort to learn, sharpening a dozen or more times, refurbishing a chain and using it many times on a new Oregon chain.
-The Oregon, I believe, had a 10* angle, and the Timberline doesn't, so I cut wood, and it took a few sharpening to change that.
-Refurbishing the old chain showed some cutters a bit shorter. The Timberline did not allow me to increase depth of the hook as shown in the first pictures I posted.
-On the new chain, full chisel, I felt the carbide depth was too low, the cutter very sharp, but did not hold the edge as long as my hand sharpening. That is subjective of course. I sharpened the new chain five or six times before reverting back to hand filing.
At that point, I enjoyed hand filing over cranking, and better visibility of the cutter being sharpened.
Glad I tried the Timberline. The next person can now give it a go and come up with his own opinion.
 
I have used the sharpforce twice now - been too busy for much cutting with other work. My son used my saw over the weekend and ran a tank through the saw after my last sharpening to see what he thought. His feedback afterwards was that my right teeth were rounded (i.e. file motion is not straight) and my left teeth were more like 30 degrees than 25. He said the depth gauges were perfect though. He resharpened it for me (oregon guide) after the tankful.

I'll keep using it and see if I can improve.Good to get his feedback - my eyes aren't what they used to be.
 
cantoo said:
Sandhill, I usually use the oil from TSC but after wearing out a cheap bar last year in a few hours cutting I switched to some heavy Poulan oil that I had on hand. I just bought 2 jugs off the stickiest oil that Lazer makes. My stihl dealer says he thinks it is better than stihl oil. I haven't had a chance to try it out yet though. And I make sure that I ordered the better bars this time around. I also replace my drive sprockets more often.
Click to expand...
Ya, I also bought the Poulan oil ( I think it was on sale at TSC). It just seemed a bit heavier which works for me seeing as I cut mostly at moderate to warm outdoor temps.
 
rarefish383 said:
On oil. I have bars that are 40+ years old that saw 20+ years of commercial service, then me cutting firewood and milling with them for another 20 years. Most of our saws, in the 70's had automatic oilers, but they all had thumb pumps too. Dad would give anyone heck if they weren't constantly pumping. Always use a full tank of oil per tank of fuel. Back then I never heard of "Bar Oil". We just used the cheapest 10W30 oil we could get, by the case, at KMart. I still use 10W30 unless I catch a good sale. To put in perspective how much my saws still get used, I mix in 5 gallon batches, and use about 5 gallons a month. By the 80's we bought enough saws, pretty much all Homelites, that other dealers started sending us flyers on their products. Then I remember reading one manufacturers theory on using thick oil that would cling to the bar and lubricate longer, and an others claim that thin oil was better because it flew off the end of the bar, carrying heat off the the bar keeping it cooler. Both theories had a pile of scientific research to prove their side. We kept using 10W30, and now I have 40 year old bars, still in service. I adjust the chain so you can pick it up with 2 fingers, and the drivers come to the top of the bar groove, but not sagging off the bottom. I would rather run it a little loose than tight.

On filing, I still free hand with a chunk of an Oak stick stuck on the file for a handle. I rotate the file after every stroke, and every third or fourth stroke I tap the file across the chain to clean out the filings. I think the files last longer that way. A sharp chain will create less heat and aid in longer bar life. When you have to start leaning on the saw to cut you are creating a lot of heat. I can buck up an Oak log and hold the bar in bare hands when done. If the bar is so hot you can't touch it, you are not using enough oil, your chain is dull, or too tight. That bar won't last long.

Sharp chain, lots of oil, long bar life, Joe.
Click to expand...
I'm in full agreement of everything you said there.
Oil is way cheaper than replacing bars and chain too.
 
ive got a few for you we bought my dad a oregon 511ax sharpener yrs back and i've been playing with it for awhile now also have a carbide or diamond blade i bought for it anyway , can never get good and big chips, no matter how slow or fast i go impossible to sharpen without blueing the tooth.

also whether by machine or hand how do you make the hook larger?
 
skindaddy said:
ive got a few for you we bought my dad a oregon 511ax sharpener yrs back and i've been playing with it for awhile now also have a carbide or diamond blade i bought for it anyway , can never get good and big chips, no matter how slow or fast i go impossible to sharpen without blueing the tooth.
Click to expand...
Blueing the teeth usually means that you are pressing too hard on the wheel (best to use an intermittent tapping motion), or not dressing it.
Diamond wheels are only for carbide teeth, not for conventional chain, although, there are similar looking CBN wheels for conventional chain.
Lots of threads on grinding. Here are a few:

http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/511a-grinder-improvements-tweaks.197073/
http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/chain-grinding.290970/
http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/resinoid-grinder-wheels.256733/
http://www.arboristsite.com/communi...uy-an-oregon-511-or-something-similar.248403/
http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/best-bench-grinder-for-sharpening-chains.306129/

skindaddy said:
also whether by machine or hand how do you make the hook larger?
Click to expand...
Go deeper with the file or lower the wheel further than the manufacturer's specifications to get more 'hook'.

Philbert
 

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cbn was what i was trying to think of. got that.
also yes i have tried bumping, tapping, contstant ,. same results
with tapping it dont at first but by the 3rd, or 4th tap its hot enough it turns. i suppose if i took minutes per tooth i could succeed.

as far as hook by machine do you mean lower in height or lay motor on a lower angle as in column C in 2nd pic
 
skindaddy said:
as far as hook by machine do you mean lower in height or lay motor on a lower angle as in column C in 2nd pic
Click to expand...
Lower angle in column 'C', and take the wheel deeper, towards the tie straps.

I think that it helps to take a Mr. Miyagi ('Karate Kid') approach: start with a vision of what you what your cutters to look like, then figure out what grinder settings will get you there. Some guys keep a few links of brand new chain next to their grinder to use as a reference. You can also mount a well filed chain in your grinder vise, and try to 'copy' those angles.

Philbert
 
I get more hook going from 60 degrees to 55 degrees.
I set the chain up so the wheel just barely touches the tooth, then I go all the way around the chain with one tap per tooth, if that is not enough I adjust the chain into the wheel & go around again one tap per tooth however many times it takes to get it sharp,
then I go to the other side of the chain & do it all over again readjusting the chain into the wheel.
If your burning the cutter your either taking too much at a time or staying too long, just a ''tchick'' is all it takes.
 
Mad Professor said:
Fuzzy math, 11% off is $5.34/gal
Click to expand...
Way fuzzy math. I'm still waiting for my 11% rebate voucher to buy the oil at Menards. Only been 2 months since it was mailed? Un impressed w/that store. Bought gallon b&c oil with original coupon & watched chainsaw carver out front for a while. Only went back because the family owned store dint have, Lowes dint Have, Family Center lacked, Rural king dint have, Menards had it and promised 11% off voucher:buttkick:. Had to spend another 50 some odd cents for stamped envelope to mail it. I'm better off at Lowes with 10% off at register with military deduction.
Stay safe
 
skindaddy said:
cbn was what i was trying to think of. got that.
also yes i have tried bumping, tapping, contstant ,. same results
with tapping it dont at first but by the 3rd, or 4th tap its hot enough it turns. i suppose if i took minutes per tooth i could succeed.

as far as hook by machine do you mean lower in height or lay motor on a lower angle as in column C in 2nd pic
Click to expand...

My guess, if you're blueing teeth with a CBN wheel, is you are taking to much material off. I have CBN wheels and I find that what works best, probably with the vitrified wheels as well, is to just kiss the cutter. If you're running your chains to the point that they literally wont cut anymore, you may have to run a chain through the grinder twice just so you aren't trying to take off too much material in a single pass.

I don't let my chains get to dull, they are constantly being touched up with a file during the day. I can normally just lower the grinder head smoothly and slowly into and all the way down into the cutter. No tapping... no bouncing.

The thing about the CBN wheels is they remove material faster than a vitrified wheel. Try just hitting each tooth once or twice... The first touch half way through, second one to the stop.
 

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