Are trees with hollow/rotten insides dangerous?

[Chemical man]

I have 40'-50' beech tree: a guess based on its height above my colonial houses' roof. The tree itself is about 20 feet from house. A few years ago I noticed ants living in it and a not so hard kick as the base of the tree caused it to cave in where I was kicking. Not a lot, but enough to make it concave. I treated for the ants using sevins. I know the ants weren't the cause rather a symptom of the problem, but I didn't want them moving into house. I noticed yesterday while cleaning up the yard that apparently something has burrowed into the opposite side of the tree that I was looking at. Sure enough its is quite hollow in the middle of the tree.

With all that said my question is how likely is it that this tree will need to go? It hasn't been dropping limbs or showing any signs of dying.

I'll put images up later if it would help.

 

[lone wolf]

I have 40'-50' beech tree: a guess based on its height above my colonial houses' roof. The tree itself is about 20 feet from house. A few years ago I noticed ants living in it and a not so hard kick as the base of the tree caused it to cave in where I was kicking. Not a lot, but enough to make it concave. I treated for the ants using sevins. I know the ants weren't the cause rather a symptom of the problem, but I didn't want them moving into house. I noticed yesterday while cleaning up the yard that apparently something has burrowed into the opposite side of the tree that I was looking at. Sure enough its is quite hollow in the middle of the tree.

With all that said my question is how likely is it that this tree will need to go? It hasn't been dropping limbs or showing any signs of dying. The pics will tell a lot more.

I'll put images up later if it would help.

We are on the internet so its hard to say but a lot depends on how much damage , the way the weight is leaning and overall condition of the top part too lots of factors.

 

[Chemical man]

Understood. Just was trying to get a feel for how certain I should have someone out to look/take care of it.

In any case here are a few picts of the situation (8,11,12). The tree in question is the beech next to the picnic table. The last picture (13) is a separate question. The bowed hickory tree again seems quite healthy the but bow unnerves me. Are trees this bent in any more danger of falling over or do their roots compensate?

 

[computeruser]

Without knowing more, it's hard to say. On a tree with a wide, open crown, located where it is exposed to the wind, my level of concern might be greater than some limited amount of hollowness on a straight tree that is growing in among others, without a huge canopy of its own to act as a sail. Beech are also notorious for internal rot and being hollow, and often do quite well in that condition for a long, long time. Do you have any sense of how much of an internal cavity you have in that tree? Might be time to go buy one of those cool fiberoptic camera things, since you now have a *justification* for the purchase!

On the subject of hollow trees being failure-prone, this guy was fine, apart from losing some upper limbs once the decay moved up, for >20 years in this state. But he was located in a place where the risk was limited to the fence or the odd passer-by. He rode out a lot of summer storms without any limb loss, when other more vigorous trees suffered catastrophic damage. It was only in the final year, when a couple 8" limbs broke off, that I finally removed the tree. So it is hard to say "if x% of interior is decayed, the tree is per se about to fail." This tree was hollow as a straw, but the outer material was about 3" thick toward the base and in first-rate condition, and apparently in this location, that was enough.



As for the leaning tree, I'd not worry about it much. Trees go where the light is, and a curved trunk didn't get that way (and that size) overnight. The root system surely has "compensated" for the relative imbalance of the tree.

 

[Chemical man]

Thanks for the replies and the food for though. That hickory's been through some good blows with Hurricane Irene and Sandy blowing past us and while it swayed something fierce it hasn't come down so figured it was strong, but just wigs me out cause it leans at my neighbour’s house and God forbid it fell on their house. The canopy of the beech isn't all the great compared to the sweet gum next to it so it is a bit sheltered.

 

[Raintree]

I would not be too concerned about this young beech.

Your hickory if it only has this lean is also fine.

 

[ATH]

I agree with others that I do not see anything in those pictures to be overly alarmed about...however it may well be worth having somebody come take a look. You are looking for somebody that you will hire for a consultation...NOT somebody who wants to bid on removing the tree. (perhaps whoever offers the consult may bid on the removal later...but make it clear that your preference is to keep the trees, you just need to know if they are well). The International Society of Arboriculture has a program called Tree Risk Assessment Qualification (or TRAQ). I would first look for a TRAQ Arborist. Not that others are incapable of assessing the tree...but if you don't know where else to start, that is a good place.

 

[Chemical man]

ATH thanks for the recommendation. I'd rather not loose the tree as it is great shade for house in the summer and shades the patio I just built last year.

 

[Woody912]

I have 40'-50' beech tree: a guess based on its height above my colonial houses' roof. The tree itself is about 20 feet from house. A few years ago I noticed ants living in it and a not so hard kick as the base of the tree caused it to cave in where I was kicking. Not a lot, but enough to make it concave. I treated for the ants using sevins. I know the ants weren't the cause rather a symptom of the problem, but I didn't want them moving into house. I noticed yesterday while cleaning up the yard that apparently something has burrowed into the opposite side of the tree that I was looking at. Sure enough its is quite hollow in the middle of the tree.

With all that said my question is how likely is it that this tree will need to go? It hasn't been dropping limbs or showing any signs of dying.

I'll put images up later if it would help.

All beeches are hollow and they all fall eventually but on a relative scale of 10 that is about a 2. Have a 4' diameter near one of my tree stands that I can see all the way thru and it keeps standing. I am certain that someone will claim to have seen a solid beech with a Sasquatch in the top carrying a rational woman and his unicorn tied at the bottom but I gotta see it

 

[Raintree]

All beeches are hollow...

Very bold statement.

 

[Woody912]

All beeches are hollow and they all fall eventually but on a relative scale of 10 that is about a 2. Have a 4' diameter near one of my tree stands that I can see all the way thru and it keeps standing. I am certain that someone will claim to have seen a solid beech with a Sasquatch in the top carrying a rational woman and his unicorn tied at the bottom but I gotta see it

About 35 yrs ago I did cut up a 4' diameter sycamore that was completely solid. Should have taken a pic because I have not seen a solid one of that size since

 

[mike515]

About 35 yrs ago I did cut up a 4' diameter sycamore that was completely solid. Should have taken a pic because I have not seen a solid one of that size since

Sycamores in my area are usually pretty solid...even the large ones. I can't tell you how many I've had to remove that I wished were hollow.

As far as the OP....count me as another vote to not really worry too much about those trees.

 

[treeseer]

Agree with all. A good arborist should be able to do a 10-20% reduction on the hickory and a 10% thinning/reduction on the beech so you feel better about them both for the long run, as they redirect their growth toward more stability.

 

[woodchuck357]

I know nothing about beech trees, alot of years have passed since I worked in areas where they grow, but I have cut thousands of Sycamores in Arkansas, Missouri, and Oklahoma, some over six feet dbh, and have only seen a handful that were hollow.

 

[ATH]

Interesting woodchuck. Curious, were the woodlands in that area heavily pastured 150-60 years ago? Probably 90% of the sycamore that I see over 4' in diameter, I could stand in... They are not falling over, but hollow as a bell. Same with most beech over 2' in diameter. Almost all of the woodlands around here were pastured pretty heavily for nearly a century. Most of that stopped in the 40's-50's. I am quite certain that the hollow trees were more related to the pasturing than some defect in the species...

Frankly, many of those trees in AR, MO, OK were big when the areas were settled...so probably didn't suffer the abuse for as long as trees in Indiana/Ohio and further east.

 

[Woody912]

Interesting woodchuck. Curious, were the woodlands in that area heavily pastured 150-60 years ago? Probably 90% of the sycamore that I see over 4' in diameter, I could stand in... They are not falling over, but hollow as a bell. Same with most beech over 2' in diameter. Almost all of the woodlands around here were pastured pretty heavily for nearly a century. Most of that stopped in the 40's-50's. I am quite certain that the hollow trees were more related to the pasturing than some defect in the species...

Frankly, many of those trees in AR, MO, OK were big when the areas were settled...so probably didn't suffer the abuse for as long as trees in Indiana/Ohio and further east.

Seems to me like the usual starting source for hollow beech trees is a broken limb/knot. Heartwood seems to have no resistance , maybe because they are frequently a suppressed tree and grow slowly anyway they cannot encapsulate the would quickly enough to heal?

 

[dboyd351]

See that beech in my avatar? It wasn't hollow at all. Tornado knocked it and 3 others over. All were 2-4 ft DBH and none were hollow.

 

[Knobby57]

Looks like beech blight . Started here about 25 years ago . It's only a matter of time before there are none left here . All of them seem to rot from one side . Look one direction they all look ok. Turn around and they are a mess .


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