Cleveland Pear Tree - Leaves look like fall

[Del_]

The turf if bright green.

I bet you've been putting down herbicide in your lawn fertilizer.

Trees are broad leaf weeds you know.

You might have some fire blight going on, too.

Nigh N can increase fire blight susceptibility.

 

[Avenger]

Hey Del_. We don't fertilize the lawn, we've just been getting lots of rain this year. I wouldn't be surprised if other issues are attacking the tree in the weakened state too though.

 

[Avenger]

Well, the leaves are starting to fall off now. This is just since Monday, so 2 days worth. Looks like we get one more late October style fall out of it.

 

[Del_]

That sure is a perfect looking lawn.

I call herbicide, again.

 

[Avenger]

Well if it has had anything put on it, it wasn't by us. I used some Roundup on some weeds against the house, but again we don't use fertilizer or anything on the lawn. If an herbicide was the cause, it would have to have been a neighbor killing the tree for some reason. I hope that wouldn't be the case.

 

[Del_]

Well if it has had anything put on it, it wasn't by us. I used some Roundup on some weeds against the house, but again we don't use fertilizer or anything on the lawn. If an herbicide was the cause, it would have to have been a neighbor killing the tree for some reason. I hope that wouldn't be the case.

I don't see a weed in that whole lawn and that doesn't happen by accident.

 

[Avenger]

There's no reason for me to lie about not doing anything to our lawn, and I don't know why you would suspect that. There are plenty of weeds in it, but you can't see them in this photo from the side. Much of the southeast corner is that small leafed clover, I don't know what it's called. The back lawn is absolutely full of dandelions. If I had put anything on the grass, I would have said so to help diagnose what's wrong with our tree, which is why I've posted here. I'm the only one who would lose by lying about putting stuff on our grass, which is also a ridiculous thing to lie about.

 

[Del_]

There's no reason for me to lie about not doing anything to our lawn, and I don't know why you would suspect that. There are plenty of weeds in it, but you can't see them in this photo from the side. Much of the southeast corner is that small leafed clover, I don't know what it's called. The back lawn is absolutely full of dandelions. If I had put anything on the grass, I would have said so to help diagnose what's wrong with our tree, which is why I've posted here. I'm the only one who would lose by lying about putting stuff on our grass, which is also a ridiculous thing to lie about.

None the less your tree seems to be showing signs of herbicide damage of the broad leaf killer type.

Are there underground gas lines in the area?

 

[jefflovstrom]

Yeah, something is going on there, I think Del maybe right,
You do know that the root system is in play, , I can not zoom in, but it looks like you are smothering that tree with that volcano,,
Sorry, Jeff

 

[jefflovstrom]

Is that a new driveway?
Jeff

 

[Avenger]

I'm not sure where the gas comes into the house. The water comes in from the road running at the far back of the picture I last posted. The electricity comes in from about where I was standing when I took the photo. Everything hooks up in the garage.

Is that a new driveway?
Jeff

No, it's as old as the house and tree. As for the volcano, I'm not sure what you're referring to. The mulch around the tree isn't against the trunk anymore (see earlier photos). I pulled everything (mulch, weed cloth, etc.) up and away from the trunk to see if it was girdled, and what's left is what you see. I have a local arbor company coming out soon to estimate tree removal costs, so I have just left the mulch pulled away in a ring so they can see the root system and offer their thoughts on the viability of the tree at this point. What you see around the trunk itself in the last photo is just dried mud and mulch residue that was on the trunk.

 

[Ax-man]

Can I jump in here. It has been a long ,long time since I have replied in this particular forum but this thread caught my attention for some reason. The roots look normal for a pear.

I have seen this disease in our area many times . Fire Blight , I know it is disease primarily affecting apple trees but it can hit pear .

I am not a practicing arborist anymore but if it is Fire Blight there isn't much you can do for the tree as it is already in the advanced stages . Just my 2cents worth. Sorry if I seem like the harbinger of bad news.

Those are some awesome pics of girdling roots. What tree species ??? English Walnut by chance??

 

[ATH]

Can I jump in here. It has been a long ,long time since I have replied in this particular forum but this thread caught my attention for some reason. The roots look normal for a pear.

I have seen this disease in our area many times . Fire Blight , I know it is disease primarily affecting apple trees but it can hit pear .

I am not a practicing arborist anymore but if it is Fire Blight there isn't much you can do for the tree as it is already in the advanced stages . Just my 2cents worth. Sorry if I seem like the harbinger of bad news.

Those are some awesome pics of girdling roots. What tree species ??? English Walnut by chance??

A) I agree there is probably some fireblight going on there...but I don't think that is the primary problem. The ends of the branches aren't "burnt looking" enough widespread all over the tree. I think there are some other vascular problems there.
B) You asking about the girdling root pics I posted? First is Red maple. Second (and 3rd) is Norway maple (the worst self-girdling species I have seen). That is a little odd looking bark...much lighter than normal now that you mention it.

 

[Ax-man]

I agree with you on the fire blight symptoms, it is odd but the symptoms aren't quite the same on a pear tree as they are on an apple. Fire Blight on pear seem to affect the whole tree for some reason, on apple trees it takes out individual limbs or part of limbs, it will eventually get the whole tree just at a slower rate than it does with pear. The brown leaves are showing up and this says to me that the tree is on the way out based on what I have seen in our area.

That Red Maple does have a very light colored bark, is it one of those cloned varieties?? walnut doesn't suffer from girdling roots but I had to ask. I seen the Norway pic and yes they are the worst girdling species, many fine specimens have died or are doing poorly because of that problem.

 

[ATH]

Yes....the red maple is a cultivar. Not sure which. In a row with 11 others all planted a little deep with a lot of mulch mounding over the years. All with girdling to various degrees.

I haven't seen walnut girdling roots either, but I suspect they will but the reason we don't see don't see it is that very few people plant B&B walnut so they aren't coming from the nursery deep and then getting planted even deeper. Further they aren't generally planted as an ornamental tree so they don't get the mulch mound piled on year after year.

 

[Del_]

Girdling roots are much more common in container grown trees than in B and B.

 

[ATH]

Yes...but many B&B started in a container as liner stock so that carries over. Any tree that was planted too deep has strong potential to have problems.

 

[Jason Douglas]

I see SGRs on B&Bs too, usually the typical maples we see them on. When all those main order roots are severed during harvesting, lateral roots remain and can start to grow tangentially against the trunk. Certainly less prevelent than containers and ATH is also correct about younger trees being started in pots as well.

In any event, this pear has a systemic problem and isnt worth putting any money into.

 

[Avenger]

Our pear tree is now nearly leafless. The tips of the limbs are still green, as are the buds if I scratch into them. But, more concerning to me now is that I've discovered 5-6 of these guys running around on the trunk:

I know this is a native ash borer, and it likes dying trees. So, it would make sense that it's on our pear. That said, we have about a 12-14 year old purple ash in our back yard that we have grown from a stick, and my wife and I love this tree. It's a beautiful tree, about 25-30 feet tall now and providing much needed shade to our back yard.

I checked this evening, and it does have half a dozen small round (not D shaped) BB sized holes that are not hollow, but filled with what looks like fine sawdust. All of these are 5+ feet up the trunk in the softer bark part. I remember seeing these small holes in few numbers over the years, but this is the first time I've seen the insect to go with it and put 2 and 2 together. It also has about a 4 inch long vertical wound where the bark has split and come away maybe an inch at the most in width that I can see. It's not a nasty looking wound, just noticeable if you're looking for it. It's dark now, but I can get a picture tomorrow if this would be of interest. Otherwise, our ash is just beautiful and healthy looking.

I suspect our pear tree is dead, but our ash tree is still healthy. Can I trouble you guys for what I need to be doing now to protect our ash tree? Are these native borers not a problem unless our ash tree were to be distressed, or do I need to be taking measures and treating these guys as if they were emerald ash borers?

Thanks all for all the replies and feedback. I can't overstate my gratitude for the help.

 

[Del_]

Our pear tree is now nearly leafless. The tips of the limbs are still green, as are the buds if I scratch into them. But, more concerning to me now is that I've discovered 5-6 of these guys running around on the trunk:

I know this is a native ash borer, and it likes dying trees. So, it would make sense that it's on our pear. That said, we have about a 12-14 year old purple ash in our back yard that we have grown from a stick, and my wife and I love this tree. It's a beautiful tree, about 25-30 feet tall now and providing much needed shade to our back yard.

I checked this evening, and it does have half a dozen small round (not D shaped) BB sized holes that are not hollow, but filled with what looks like fine sawdust. All of these are 5+ feet up the trunk in the softer bark part. I remember seeing these small holes in few numbers over the years, but this is the first time I've seen the insect to go with it and put 2 and 2 together. It also has about a 4 inch long vertical wound where the bark has split and come away maybe an inch at the most in width that I can see. It's not a nasty looking wound, just noticeable if you're looking for it. It's dark now, but I can get a picture tomorrow if this would be of interest. Otherwise, our ash is just beautiful and healthy looking.

I suspect our pear tree is dead, but our ash tree is still healthy. Can I trouble you guys for what I need to be doing now to protect our ash tree? Are these native borers not a problem unless our ash tree were to be distressed, or do I need to be taking measures and treating these guys as if they were emerald ash borers?

Thanks all for all the replies and feedback. I can't overstate my gratitude for the help.

Kiss your ash goodbye!