Bailing out of a dead tree

[Ron_Brown]

I am removing branches at the 50 ft level from a dead tree.
I am tied in at a height of 65 ft in a neighboring live tree, 10-15 ft away.

Of course I am climbing the live tree and traversing over to the dead one to remove the limbs. My question is: how would you bail out of the dead tree if it were to begin to fail? I have free air to swing into, and would not hit the live tree if I bailed out.

Any input would be appreciated.
I am not a professional Arborist, but I am a very serious climber.
I am not using a chainsaw. I have had supervised climbs as well as reading "The Tree's Climbers Companion" and most of "Fundamentals of General Tree Work".
I have no intention of doing anything I would consider an unreasonable risk, and I am approaching this task properly eauipped and obeying all safety precautions I can think of.
Here's your chance to add more to my safety precautions, instead of just tell me i'm crazy.

Respectfully: Ron Brown

 

[dan kraus]

Make double sure none of the limbs you cut will fall across your line.

 

[Greg]

Bailing out?? Hopefully you won't need to, but you need to keep your climbing line (in the good tree) tight at all times so you don't have a freefall, just a swing. You also need to make sure you don't have a lanyard on the bad tree if you are worried that a cut might bring it down. Make sure you are aware at all times the way the dead tree may fall and where you will be in that picture -you don't want to be down in the lower or mid crown and have the top come down on you, you need to always work from and stay in the top so you won't take any smacks in the head (wear a helmet with chin strap!).
Dead trees are terrible to learn on, every one is different, and you can quickly find yourself in deep ???? if somthing goes bad. If the tree looks soo bad that just climbing it may bring it down I would not climb it --IT IS NOT WORTH IT. Traversing from tree to tree could also be extreemly dangerous, you are going to put a lot of stress on the dead tree --Check out some of the speedline equations on the ISA board --you will be shocked at how quickly 200lbs can turn into 1000lbs. If it is too weak to climb then it is probably too weak to traverse. Don't traverse- rapelling down into it is fine, but if you can't rapell into it or climb up it do not do it.
Good luck, and don't get in over your head.
Greg

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

Well; you can always walk away before you start...........

But, assuming; it has been assesed to be workable with care.............; and you wouldn't swing into any power lines.....

Fortify the weakness, minimize the swing, and don't let 2 powers cross!

i would try to plot the propsed failure of the limb or tree; and stay out of the way! Like not bo on the lean side! Then perhaps fortifying it against its lean; if it stands straight 3/1 it south; then pull it back straight with truck to the north. Don't hit these lines either with loads. If, it has lean; and you are going to be in it a while; put a come along in as tensioner for bracing. Start with the come-along fully extended (save 2 wraps for drum friction); and tighten line. Now through the day as weight comes off the lean side; you can tighten bracing up with come-a-long as tree stands up! This way the rigging forces and everything will have a lot less impact; all day, just not at the start when lines are tight!

Then, Plot your swing 'home' if their is a failure. First minimize horizontal diffrence between you and lifeline anchor. Then look for ways to buffer any swing. Like an extra line from an upper or lower anchor (or Groundie); that would slow down your swing across yard. Or, a line that would leave you hanging; in a "V"; betwenn to upper anchors, not hitting any trunks.

Then, don't let anything impact the tree or lines. And be totally aware; at any moment; that it could go sidewards.....................

And then, if that happens; i will...................

 

[Acer]

I'd seriously consider using a work platform. For most dead trees I quote for - unless I know that it has died suddenly and very recently - , I include hire of a platform. In most cases, my risk assessment tells me that the tree will be more likely to fail, and with little warning.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Last night at the Minnesota Arborist Guild meeting I was talking with a buddy about this exact situation. Cal is an experienced and very cautious climber. He has a dead cherry near his house that needs to come down. He has another tree nearby to tie into but needs to have a flipline in the dead tree to keep him from swinging away. Cal's concern is that he doesn't want to do a ride like Slim Pickens in "Dr. Strangelove".

A while ago, on the "other discussion forum" we hashed this subject pretty thoroughly. The best idea that came up was to use some kind of plastic ring between your saddle and the clip of your flip line. If the tree fails underneath the climber the plastic ring will break. Shower rings or the rings from backpacks would work. If the climber is only balancing, the ring wouldn't have to be too strong.

If there's two trees in the area you could double crotch or use a double sheave pulley for a redirect. The redi could be set on the end of a line with a throwline. A groundie could tend the amount of rope to shorten the pendulum.

Tom

 

[Oxman]

This thread belongs in the "Residential Tree Care" http://www.arboristsite.com//forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=3 forum. This is the Commercial Tree Care forum. You are not asking for advice. You are asking for instructions, so one of us won't get the money we deserve for our skill & experience.

Do not climb a dead tree. What part of "leave the job to a professional" don't you understand?

You say you have all the tools needed, yet you aren't even equipped with a chainsaw, the most basic & necessary tool for removals. With the handsaw in a tree 50-70' up, you will not be able to remove large diameter limbs. You will find yourself climbing out on limbs to get to smaller diameter wood to cut with the handsaw, when they should be cut low down with the appropriate tool.

Why no saw? Is it because you don't have one, or because you don't have the skills to operate it? Check the chainsaw owners manual, where it says, "Do not operate a chainsaw in a tree". Where did they find the reason for including that statement? In accident reports, of course.

Consider throwing a line into the treetop and shaking it like mad. Depending on how long it has been dead, and what kind of tree it is, the way it moves can be very revealing. The woods of different species of trees are as distinctive as babies in the neo-natal unit of a hospital.

Change the angle of pull when doing this type of inspection. Pull from the side to see if the tree will fall over. Pull from underneath to see if the top will break. Pull repeatedly to develop an occillation (shimmy) to build up your pulling power.

Sometimes we get the best information about a tree after we begin working on it. I like to limb from the bottom up while climbing, removing weight as soon as possible. A pole saw can aid in lessening weight above before advancing upward. I watch and feel the dynamics of the tree moving with me.

One thing we know, but cannot tell you, is how a weak tree acts, right before it breaks. A tree is talking to an operator who has worked on thousands of trees. Without speaking the language of the trees, it's attempt to communicate with you falls on deaf ears.

Without experience, subtle signals that clearly indicate the internal condition of defective wood cannot be interpreted.

You'll know you have the experience after wearing out a few pairs of spurs.

Sorry if the words sound severe. A smack up side the head might work better. Imagine how many times I've had this exact same discussion with hot dogs like you in the past 3 decades.

"What we have here is a failure to communicate"
---Cool Hand Luke

 

[coydog]

bad day, oxman?

 

[Oxman]

Thanks for the wake up slap. Sorry about going off.

 

[John Paul Sanborn]

Dang, And here I was agreeing with your rant!

 

[TheTreeSpyder]

a lil strong............ but especially like the part about the tree talking to you.............

 

[riggs]

Oxman that was poetry , just get off a bus from Philly?

If you got to ask how , better ask why first !

 

[Oxman]

I am removing branches at the 50 ft level from a dead tree.
I am tied in at a height of 65 ft in a neighboring live tree, 10-15 ft away.

Of course I am climbing the live tree and traversing over to the dead one to remove the limbs. My question is: how would you bail out of the dead tree if it were to begin to fail? I have free air to swing into, and would not hit the live tree if I bailed out.

Any input would be appreciated.
I am not a professional Arborist, but I am a very serious climber.
I am not using a chainsaw. I have had supervised climbs as well as reading "The Tree's Climbers Companion" and most of "Fundamentals of General Tree Work".
I have no intention of doing anything I would consider an unreasonable risk, and I am approaching this task properly eauipped and obeying all safety precautions I can think of.
Here's your chance to add more to my safety precautions, instead of just tell me i'm crazy.

Respectfully: Ron Brown

Looking back at this post 15 years later, in 2017, I see Ron Brown hasn't posted here since. Does this mean he died?

 

[661Joe]

I certainly hope not. Maybe he was smart and chose a different profession??