Leaner technique

[northmanlogging]

Down here ( 50 miles south) Mills say they accept Cotton wood but at no value. Ive got a friend wants about 5 acres worth taken down.

I think the only place still running down there is Manke anyway, formark opened their new yard up, but its a little farther north then it used to be....

Anyway, it could be worth while to maybe have them trucked up north? Though in the end I don't give much of a percentage on Cotton timber, 10-15% or sometimes less... Need to make a certain amount per load or its just not worth it, even then its break even wages.

 

[Westboastfaller]

With the way you wrote it seemed like it was for $85 a day, I thought it couldn't be possible but then again some really love what they do & maybe it was.
Thansk

Right,I definitely have a passion for the act of cutting as many do and that has to be the ONLY reason to be in it. We have a saying and that is; "IF you are just here for the money you are going to get hurt.
As I say " the ACT" (activity) I like but there is a lot of BS that goes along with it that can really burn you out. BC is an acronym for 'Bring cash'. You will never get rich at it here. There is down time to think about. You have to buy & sell wood or have a tree company too. I just hooked up with a young climber. We did a job together this past weekend that went well. We are going 50/50 and eventually he can leave his job. Even if we hire other climbers for a while to get things rolling in the week. Of course we will be limited for a while as to what we can bid. The residential rates are dam good, much more than I could get as just a Faller, also in demand.

 

[Westboastfaller]

I think the only place still running down there is Manke anyway, formark opened their new yard up, but its a little farther north then it used to be....

Anyway, it could be worth while to maybe have them trucked up north? Though in the end I don't give much of a percentage on Cotton timber, 10-15% or sometimes less... Need to make a certain amount per load or its just not worth it, even then its break even wages.

We say here that " there are no stupid questions in industry " or The only stupid question is the question that was never asked" So excuse my ignorance and here it goes. What do you mean 280 ? 280 a load? I do have a friend that has three trucks and can't work his woodlot untill Jan 1 2017. It's a good time to do business with our low dollar. Import/export is a simple add on to your BN #

 

[bitzer]

280 per thousand. Thats the low end of the hardwood spectrum here. After cutting and trucking theres nothing left. Cutting/skidding your own timber you should get aleast 150 per mbf and trucking is about the same. If the landowner gets a cut of your 150 then you're not making much.

 

[Trx250r180]

The coos triangle works pretty good ,i tried to see if these would chair letting them go over slow and not chasing the back cut ,all it did was pull the guts out .Alders with a lean about 25-30 degrees .Did not think to take the pics till after the limbs were cleaned up .One of the trees did crack slightly doing this ,chasing it it would not have though ,it went over super slow .

 

[Westboastfaller]

Ok thanks, Google filed in the rest. Right so 83 cubic ft to 1000. S0 that's a cunit right?

2.8 cubic metres to the cunit
about 40 cubic metres per truck
15 cunits probably × 280 = $4200 + 25 % exchange. Maybe make three loads a day.
Ivor gets about 1200 per day running his truck. IDK...I'm starting to like free trade...lol Of course northman is in there.
Actually if they are grinding them then they would load you and pay you I figure. Not all have a $million grinder plus they break a lot and they need them for stump disposal.

*EDIT. No that's .83 of a cunit. So a cunit is 100 cubic ft or 1200 mbf

 

[Westboastfaller]

It would just be trucking, I would get my rate to cut it in cases, definitely some red tape to get through. The money definitely works with out a doubt.

 

[Westboastfaller]

280 per thousand. Thats the low end of the hardwood spectrum here. After cutting and trucking theres nothing left. Cutting/skidding your own timber you should get aleast 150 per mbf and trucking is about the same. If the landowner gets a cut of your 150 then you're not making much.

I don't mean to confuse you in regards to 'day job talk, 'Res work' Just to clarify, I would be Falling for the lanf clearing contractor and if, as it looks in the the case of Cottonwood, there isn't a market here so therefore unless the developer or private owner has a market then its just an expense to them just like grinding stumps. It is cheaper for the prime contractor to pay a little for you to get it off their plate I figure. It would have been figured in on their bid as an expense anyway.

 

[northmanlogging]

bitz is correct 280 per 1k board feet, about 5k per truck so $1400 yankee money a truck, truck gets 2-400 around heres depending on how far he's got to go, you loose about a thousand board feet per load if you use a self loader though.

So all said and done I can usually get a load a day in cotton timber, if its relatively clear to fall, not much limbing to speak of and fairly straight forward skidding. on average I can clear 600 a day with the cotton wood, not much but its keeping the bills paid lately.

with the evergreens they take some more work with the limbing and what not, and tend to be a little smaller dia so it takes more trees to make a load, my fat butt can get a load every 2 days or so, more in better wood i.e. taller less limbs, but then I only get 40-60% on those so it still ends up being around 600 a day or so, sometimes better... especially if there is cedar involved.

 

[northmanlogging]

the problem lately has been weather, between wind, rain, and no freeze it makes it hard to fall trees, then its hard to move logs...

Like I said earlier the next job is mostly Fir and Hemlock with a couple cedars and a maybe a big spruce and its on flat ground with short skids should be a little bit easier job... hell the next one is nearly identical... just bigger better wood.

 

[bitzer]

I don't mean to confuse you in regards to 'day job talk, 'Res work' Just to clarify, I would be Falling for the lanf clearing contractor and if, as it looks in the the case of Cottonwood, there isn't a market here so therefore unless the developer or private owner has a market then its just an expense to them just like grinding stumps. It is cheaper for the prime contractor to pay a little for you to get it off their plate I figure. It would have been figured in on their bid as an expense anyway.

I didn't mean you personally. I meant you as in any logger in general. I'm sure that on a clearing job like that the chipping is just expensed out as it would be here.

 

[Westboastfaller]

bitz is correct 280 per 1k board feet, about 5k per truck so $1400 yankee money a truck, truck gets 2-400 around heres depending on how far he's got to go, you loose about a thousand board feet per load if you use a self loader though.

So all said and done I can usually get a load a day in cotton timber, if its relatively clear to fall, not much limbing to speak of and fairly straight forward skidding. on average I can clear 600 a day with the cotton wood, not much but its keeping the bills paid lately.

with the evergreens they take some more work with the limbing and what not, and tend to be a little smaller dia so it takes more trees to make a load, my fat butt can get a load every 2 days or so, more in better wood i.e. taller less limbs, but then I only get 40-60% on those so it still ends up being around 600 a day or so, sometimes better... especially if there is cedar involved.

OK was thinking a cunit was 1000 mbf but it is 1200 or 100 cu ft. So add 200 more mbf X 15 cunits and that's $280 X 3 = $840 + my initial $ 4200 figure. = $5040.00.
What did you say, $5000, I concur, that was pretty close figuring

 

[bitzer]

OK was thinking a cunit was 1000 mbf but it is 1200 or 100 cubic. So add 200 more mbf X 15 cunits and that's $280 X 3 = $840 + my initial $ 4200 figure. = $5040.00.
What did you say, $5000, I concur, that was pretty close figuring

So when you guys bushel up there its not in board feet?

 

[Westboastfaller]

So when you guys bushel up there its not in board feet?

Everything here is in cubic meters,
The contract is bid on cubic meters.
They are on Turn-key and we bushel for job security and pride in probuction Falling not more money. If it's a tough job with lots of snags and cul they may bid it for each Faller on an average to cut 40 cubic metres per day. We know 40 cubic meters fills a HWY truck. In Alaska with Columbia helicopters the big scale was measured in cunits (1200 bf /100cu ft) When you bushel for your bid and you are the only cutter then you have to make that minimum on an average. If you are in chity wood as a crew, some won't even make the 40 cu metres but the next guy could get a rough calculation of 160 cu metres. We use cu ft with the smaller sticks and when we get 35 cu ft, that's a cubic metre. If I graded a 41ft and it's 14" and 10" at the top then that's a cu metres roughly.

 

[1270d]

My machine calculates everything in cubes. Our wood works out very close to 1 m³ per ton and I use 2.4 m³/cord as a conversion for scale.
The measurement reports are used mostly to make sure the wood that is cut is getting to market under our contracts, not someone else's.

 

[Skeans]

the problem lately has been weather, between wind, rain, and no freeze it makes it hard to fall trees, then its hard to move logs...

Like I said earlier the next job is mostly Fir and Hemlock with a couple cedars and a maybe a big spruce and its on flat ground with short skids should be a little bit easier job... hell the next one is nearly identical... just bigger better wood.

I know if we were on a job right now with how wet it is we'd be shut down its just too damn wet, it's a great time to get all the maintenance caught up and work on getting all the extra hydraulic pipes fixed up. If it keeps it up we'll all need row boat here soon, don't know about you guys but I'm sick of this rain.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

 

[bitzer]

Everything here is in cubic meters,
The contract is bid on cubic meters.
They are on Turn-key and we bushel for job security and pride in probuction Falling not more money. If it's a tough job with lots of snags and cul they may bid it for each Faller on an average to cut 40 cubic metres per day. We know 40 cubic meters fills a HWY truck. In Alaska with Columbia helicopters the big scale was measured in cunits (1200 bf /100cu ft) When you bushel for your bid and you are the only cutter then you have to make that minimum on an average. If you are in chity wood as a crew, some won't even make the 40 cu metres but the next guy could get a rough calculation of 160 cu metres. We use cu ft with the smaller sticks and when we get 35 cu ft, that's a cubic metre. If I graded a 41ft and it's 14" and 10" at the top then that's a cu metres roughly.

Yeah i guess why wouldn't it be metric? Guess I didn't really think that thru before i asked.

 

[Westboastfaller]

I'm a little bit young as I was twelve when the metric system came to Canadastan lol
I remember been in the mill at 18 and I bet you bf is still used today. Pounds ,ft & oz, are not going away anytime soon. I buy as many standard wrenches as I do metric. and I'd never say my **** is 30cm
because that would be a lie.. Ha-ha..you get the picture. Metric can break down better on a tape measure or calculator as In finish carpentry. Works well in Falling, I thought a cunit was metric and wonder why Alaska was using metric. It just sounds metric. It's just a 100 cubes though. I couldnt get my brain to think mbf and give a rough scale as I go? Just moving the 0 in you head I guess. IDK..