Leveraxe

[Haywire Haywood]

Maybe you guys need a list, put an * next to who has it now and the next guy copy the list into a new post and add his name. That way there's less confusion and you can always look back to the last list posted and see who's next in line and who has it now.

Ian

 

[lwalper]

Dollars are down, price is up -- 190 Euros = $300. Looks lik an interesting tool for that nice straight grained European maple, or whatever he was splitting. Can't imagine it being that easy in nice American Elm - that's what I burned all winter this year - clearing out the right of way under the power lines. That's got to be just about the stringiest stuff I've ever seen, but it sure burns nice.

 

[tatra805]

Was just thinking about this design.
Dont want to judge the axe, had no chance to try it but still a couple of points bother me..

1. Looks light: splitting is impact, so the more weight at the higher speed = the more splitting force. I am not sure how it all compares but a 10kg sledge hammer driven at say x speed has X force, how fast does a 1kg axe then has to go to generate the same force. AND thus the question if you can get to this speed by handsplitting with this axe.

Design can help but i am only wondering as i see a lot of old slow men splitting big wood and not turning out to be so slow just because they can raise their heavy hammer all day long at the same tempo. (while we young ones are out after 1 hour sprinting)

2. As already mentioned, the splitting demonstrated is questionable for big hardwood but looks nice for kindlings.

3. one of you posted somewhere on AS a kindling axe with assymetric design. I have a similar one, found in one of the barns when we bought the house so it can be easily over 50 years old. Principle is the same as a wood chisel, you remove a small part over the slope side of the axe while the vertical side is driving into the wood perfectly vertical. Looks as this new design is playing on this principle.

My point, if you want to split a round in half, you better drive with a symetrical wedge. (sledge hammer or splitting axe, does not matter) If you want to take a shaving of, go for a assymetrical design.


We have (no pictures found but i'll try to post one later) some splitting axes going around here with hinged ram-pieces in the wedge. If you hit the wood the first 3inch of the wedge split in the classic way and then the ram-pieces make contact and press the wood open.

What i saw about these is that they work till 16'' but all bigger you just stop the axe dead when these ram-pieces make contact and you get a smash in your arms.

So universal design is univeral. dedicated design may be optimal but only within its bandwidth.

 

[24d]

Nope, not yet

For some reason I can't send you a PM. I'll try to keep a check, if you get it I'll get my address to you somehow.

Later,

 

[Finland]

Try to THINK more

tatra 805
The idea of the design is not only to amuse somebody's eyes. The design is made strictly to perform totally different way comparing to the conventional axes. With the LEVERAXE we get exactly the same kinetic force than with any other axes. After that everything is different. When the blade of the LEVERAXE touches to the wood, it starts to bend, lean, turn, to the right because the blade is one-sided, the centre of gravity is on the right side of the striking line. This means, that the blade will make very fast movement fully automatically. It happens so fast that you cannot see it. At this fraction of a second it will spread the wood up to 8 centimeters (7,5) inches. After this action the blade stops on the block, it will NOT continue anywhere from the top of the block. So, by other words saying, we get the same kinetic force+ the LEVERAGE. Think what happens when you are using an iron bar. First you hit it close to a stone or something, then you TWIST to get the FORCE. This same happens FULLY AUTOMATICALLY when working with LEVERAXE. This unique tool has now been on the market over 2,5 years . There has not happened any accidences, not a single one.
I fully understand that this is not very easy to understand, it only took for million years until we got some improvement to the stone age axes. (wedge)
All the best from FINLAND

 

[tatra805]

@ Finland,

No offence intended!
I fully support all initiatives and different approaches on anything in life. I just want to see it working on a 20+'' oak round, splitting it in half with a couple of swings.
Probably 'not intended use' will come as an answer and that is exactly my point. In all honesty, it looks as the leveraxe would serve me much better than a classic axe for about 75% of the manual splitting I am doing.

But at the other side, it is not an MS361, it will not cure cancer, it just might be damn good in making firewood from small rounds..

But i am (going from the vids and feedback) still thinking that for the big stuff it will not bring a benefit over the classic way.

Look, i have split trees sawn to rounds of hardwood that would not break loose with 4 wedges fully blown in. (nice rounds not roots or Y splits or other junk) You need a lot of energy to have a 300kg round to split and i wonder how you are generating it with this light concept.

You might have a point when you would indicate a different splitting technique is to be applied with the leveraxe (going in a spiral around the round till you reach the middle) and maybe i would have to try this out and then conclude my classic axe is worthless in this and the leveraxe much bettter. BUT that does not change my point: using things for what they are intended.

From a commercial point i think the leveraxe will greatly serve all home splitters and it should become a succes.

About difficulty to understand things, Einstein once said it this way: If we would know what we are doing, it wouldnt be called research would it?

Please tell me more, I like to understand...

 

[Finland]

Understanding

@ Finland,

No offence intended!
I fully support all initiatives and different approaches on anything in life. I just want to see it working on a 20+'' oak round, splitting it in half with a couple of swings.
Probably 'not intended use' will come as an answer and that is exactly my point. In all honesty, it looks as the leveraxe would serve me much better than a classic axe for about 75% of the manual splitting I am doing.

But at the other side, it is not an MS361, it will not cure cancer, it just might be damn good in making firewood from small rounds..

But i am (going from the vids and feedback) still thinking that for the big stuff it will not bring a benefit over the classic way.

Look, i have split trees sawn to rounds of hardwood that would not break loose with 4 wedges fully blown in. (nice rounds not roots or Y splits or other junk) You need a lot of energy to have a 300kg round to split and i wonder how you are generating it with this light concept.

You might have a point when you would indicate a different splitting technique is to be applied with the leveraxe (going in a spiral around the round till you reach the middle) and maybe i would have to try this out and then conclude my classic axe is worthless in this and the leveraxe much bettter. BUT that does not change my point: using things for what they are intended.

From a commercial point i think the leveraxe will greatly serve all home splitters and it should become a succes.

About difficulty to understand things, Einstein once said it this way: If we would know what we are doing, it wouldnt be called research would it?

Please tell me more, I like to understand...

I can very clearly see that you do not quite understand this new way to split the wood.
-One very big difference be-tween the LEVERAXE and the conventional axe is that the LEVERAXE is very safe for the user.
-An other difference is that you know BEFORE every strike that the axeblade will stop on the block or slow down the speed so much that you can fully control the axe.
-You can take very small slices from the side of the block when needed to weeken the structure of the block. You will need this tecnique when there are a lot of brunches.
-With this tecnique you can leave the brunches as individual slpits.
-There is no need to divide in half the big blocks.
-You can split on the ground or on the rock the heavy blocks, because the axeblade does not penetrate throw the block.
-You have extra power with the LEVERAXE because the friction takes only a minimum part of the kinetic energy.
The axeblade penetrates to the block only five millimeters on its best.
-The LEVERAXE tecnique turns all the power to the left in a fraction of a second. You cannot see the split when it looses from the block.
-The split always flies to the left from the axeblade. With the conventional axe you never know where the split will fly, too often to your head.
-There has not happened any accidences with LEVERAXE.

I have watched the splittings in YOU TUBE. There are a lot of examples of the conventional ways of woodsplittings. My opinion is, that those examples are very workable, dangerous and oldfashioned. Splitting with LEVERAXE is much more effective, much faster, more fun, it will give you a lot of joy when you can split your firewood without the fear that you might hurt yourself.
By the way, do you fasten your seatbelt BEFORE or AFTER the accident???
With the LEVERAXE you do not have to worry about this, because the safety features are already built in to the axe, so that you cannot hurt yourself.
You can stay on your familiar way to make your firewood, but remember,that " MR.MURPHY" is a very patient "person" looking for the chanse that you will hit to your foot. This happens around 4500 times every year in Finland. I do not consider this very fun. Anyway.....
All the best from FINLAND
www.vipukirves.fi

 

[tatra805]

At Finland: We are discussing right? I am open for arguments and i can accept you like this tool but then the argument should be ' I like A better then B'

so here we go:

I can very clearly see that you do not quite understand this new way to split the wood.
-One very big difference be-tween the LEVERAXE and the conventional axe is that the LEVERAXE is very safe for the user.

I dont see a point here how that is related to my understanding. And in all honesty if i hit myself in the head with an axe, an leveraxe or a hammer it will hurt in each case.
I do see 1 thing, for a 8 year old both are equally dangerous. The point is an 8 year old is not (in general) supposed to split wood.

If i want it to be 100% safe i buy ready split wood.

-An other difference is that you know BEFORE every strike that the axeblade will stop on the block or slow down the speed so much that you can fully control the axe.

I do know that if i strike hard enough with my axe that the head will hit the ground in the radius that my arm + handle are describing. I can control this radius = arm, force = muscle.
IF i put my foot in this zone i do have the chance of hitting it, there you are right

If i wear a helmet when trying to walk through a wall i will hurt myself less. etc

-You can take very small slices from the side of the block when needed to weeken the structure of the block. You will need this tecnique when there are a lot of brunches.

Sorry, but here you are loosing the point a bit. I do want to weaken the structure of the block that much that it splits. point.

-With this tecnique you can leave the brunches as individual slpits.

tik-tak-tik-tak time is running. As with a conventional axe you are showing me alternative methods to solve the initial point: it does not split PITA pieces.

-There is no need to divide in half the big blocks.

And here we come to the point. I dont need kindlings, i need pieces as big as possible so they burn long time and i have less movements to make in splitting, hauling my wood to the house and filling up the stove. I do need to split the block in halve, 1/4 etc.

-You can split on the ground or on the rock the heavy blocks, because the axeblade does not penetrate throw the block.

I cannot split the heavy blocks, i can shave of pieces only. I dont care what is under the block. My splitting axe can hit rock or ground, by the time it traveled 25'' through the wood the speed is reduced enough not to split the rock or severely damage the head. Why? because in any case i can estimate and regulate the force i have to put in my swing.

-You have extra power with the LEVERAXE because the friction takes only a minimum part of the kinetic energy.

BUT you dont enter the wood more than 5mm ???? If we would be talking about trying to slice the wood as with a knive you would need your kinetic energy to move through the wood and avoid the friction as much as possible.

But as you stated already an axe is a wedge so you want friction, the more the better as friction in this case is the result of the wedge action and thus indicating the splitting forces (horizontal forces if you like)

+ you dont have more power. explain me how i can have more power????????? I put X energy in moving the head= swing, as the head of the leveraxe is lighter than an conventional axe i even have less power as gravity is helping me less. I only used a little less energy for the swing.

You are confusing the initial and reactional forces here. Even if the kinetic energy is the same, the friction is a result of the wedge action. You dont need wedge action you want to transfer your kinetic energy in a different force... point below


-The axeblade penetrates to the block only five millimeters on its best.

Point?

so where goes the kinetic energy... point below

-The LEVERAXE tecnique turns all the power to the left in a fraction of a second. You cannot see the split when it looses from the block.

I do understand this but now hold on a moment:
splitting in the middle:
total block weight: 30kg
half round: 15kg
You hit with a power of lets say 30kg

Calculate some inertia, friction etc but i still dont see why the right piece would also not be moved in oposite direction when the head pushes the left block away.


I do understand why left: on the left side is the small piece you are shaving off the round. So basically what you are doing is directing the lower kinetec energy (from a lighter tool dont forget) to 1 point so you concentrate your resulting power on the weakest part; being the small part of the block which you want to split off.

Congrats but the only difference with a normal symetrical axe is that you are using your power a little more efficient for all splits that are not centered in the middle of the round (round of 4'' or 39'' does not matter).
That way you are able to keep your tool lighter also, which takes away your advantage again...

If you would have taken a normal axe and grind the head assymetrical you would have reached the same + you would have more impact force as the head is x times heavier. Give it a try.

-The split always flies to the left from the axeblade. With the conventional axe you never know where the split will fly, too often to your head.

same as above but ok. except that, contrary of what you might think by now, till now nothing was flying to my head but rather splitting left-right in a proportion equal to the position on the crossline of the round by the head when it hits the wood.
dont think this is very understandable but if i hit in the middle it is a 50-50, if i hit on 1/3 it is 70-30 etc IF i use a symetrical head.

In case i use an assymetrical head it would also fly left, or right depending on shape of head.

-There has not happened any accidences with LEVERAXE.

How many hits compared to 4 000 000 years of axe??

I also do not consider 4500 accidents as something funny. But what i consider even worse are safety measures that are sold expensive but are ineffective. A false sense of security kills more than 4500 times a year, also in your country. Be Aware.

 

[Sprig]

I can very clearly see that you do not quite understand this new way to split the wood.
-One very big difference be-tween the LEVERAXE and the conventional axe is that the LEVERAXE is very safe for the user.
-An other difference is that you know BEFORE every strike that the axeblade will stop on the block or slow down the speed so much that you can fully control the axe.
-You can take very small slices from the side of the block when needed to weeken the structure of the block. You will need this tecnique when there are a lot of brunches.
-With this tecnique you can leave the brunches as individual slpits.
-There is no need to divide in half the big blocks.
-You can split on the ground or on the rock the heavy blocks, because the axeblade does not penetrate throw the block.
-You have extra power with the LEVERAXE because the friction takes only a minimum part of the kinetic energy.
The axeblade penetrates to the block only five millimeters on its best.
-The LEVERAXE tecnique turns all the power to the left in a fraction of a second. You cannot see the split when it looses from the block.
-The split always flies to the left from the axeblade. With the conventional axe you never know where the split will fly, too often to your head.
-There has not happened any accidences with LEVERAXE.

I have watched the splittings in YOU TUBE. There are a lot of examples of the conventional ways of woodsplittings. My opinion is, that those examples are very workable, dangerous and oldfashioned. Splitting with LEVERAXE is much more effective, much faster, more fun, it will give you a lot of joy when you can split your firewood without the fear that you might hurt yourself.
By the way, do you fasten your seatbelt BEFORE or AFTER the accident???
With the LEVERAXE you do not have to worry about this, because the safety features are already built in to the axe, so that you cannot hurt yourself.
You can stay on your familiar way to make your firewood, but remember,that " MR.MURPHY" is a very patient "person" looking for the chanse that you will hit to your foot. This happens around 4500 times every year in Finland. I do not consider this very fun. Anyway.....
All the best from FINLAND
www.vipukirves.fi

Hitting feet, hm, too short of handles, too high a cutting block, crappy technique, and, as far as the 'lever axe' goes for safety, people hurt themselves with Q-Tips, ergo its the user, not the tool imho. To make a claim to 'cannot hurt yourself' I find sort of preposterous, especially with a tool whacking wood up, come on now, I may have been born yesterday but it was a bright, bright, sunshiney day.
And all the best ta Finland and its fine peoples!



Serge

 

[Finland]

Astonished

tatra 805
I noticed that you came to these pages rather recently.
Is there any chanse you could read the previouse writings, it might help you in understanding this new invention.
I fully allow you to keep in your opinnion, it is your right. Anyway I want you ,too, to understand that the worl is developing all the time, and people make inventions.
The LEVERAXE is patented especially because the new safety fearures and the new way to operate.
The reason why I make splits/kindlings, you can see in the videos, is because of the very developed heatin systems we have in Finland.
Make yourself aquainted with the following websites:
www.tulikivi.com
www.nunnauuni.com
More information about the LEVERAXE , Search by word leveraxe.
I am not takeing anything away from you, on the contrary I try to give you safety to the rest of your life.
Best regards from Finland.
PS. GOOGLE vipukirves or leveraxe, there is a lot more to study.

 

[Finland]

Hitting feet, hm, too short of handles, too high a cutting block, crappy technique, and, as far as the 'lever axe' goes for safety, people hurt themselves with Q-Tips, ergo its the user, not the tool imho. To make a claim to 'cannot hurt yourself' I find sort of preposterous, especially with a tool whacking wood up, come on now, I may have been born yesterday but it was a bright, bright, sunshiney day.
And all the best ta Finland and its fine peoples!



Serge

Very long time ago in the old times there was a group of wice men sitting under a Platan tree in Greece. They were discussing about the earth.Is it flat or round? What do you think, what is your opinion?
Believe me, it was very, very bright and sunshiney day.
May the sun shine on you every day.
Best wishes from Finland.

 

[lwalper]

Now, if it were just priced so I could afford to buy it . . .

 

[ziggy2b]

Hi
VIPUKIRVES/LEVERAXE has now been on the market for over two years.
THERE HAVE BEEN NO ACCIDENT DURING THIS TIME.
I welcome you to explore my on-line shop. Also visit the Finnish MEDIA pages. There are a lot of articles with pictures. This will help you to understand the functions of the tool. Enjoy testing the LEVERAXE.
All the best from Finland.
www.vipukirves.fi

I understand,It just seems to me when you build something idot proof,Mother nature comes along and builds a better idiot:deadhorse:

 

[BlueRidgeMark]

I can very clearly see that you do not quite understand this new way to split the wood.

I can see very clearly that you have come up with a truly brilliant invention that works VERY well for certain types of wood, FAR better than the old methods.

And it works not at all for others.



So, if those types of wood are what you split, the Leveraxe is clearly the best choice and well worth the money.

For the other types of wood, it's pretty much worthless.


Hauling freight requires a different tool than hauling people. Welding mild steel requires a different rod than welding stainless steel. Splitting 12" poplar requires a different tool than splitting 36" oak.

Different jobs, different tools. Life works that way.


You can recognize this fact, and market accordingly, or you can be blindly loyal to your design and insist it works better for all kinds of wood. This will cost you sales.

Your choice.

 

[tatra805]

SOLID ARGUMENTS: missing

tatra 805
I noticed that you came to these pages rather recently.
Is there any chanse you could read the previouse writings, it might help you in understanding this new invention.
I fully allow you to keep in your opinnion, it is your right. Anyway I want you ,too, to understand that the worl is developing all the time, and people make inventions.
The LEVERAXE is patented especially because the new safety fearures and the new way to operate.
The reason why I make splits/kindlings, you can see in the videos, is because of the very developed heatin systems we have in Finland.
Make yourself aquainted with the following websites:
www.tulikivi.com
www.nunnauuni.com
More information about the LEVERAXE , Search by word leveraxe.
I am not takeing anything away from you, on the contrary I try to give you safety to the rest of your life.
Best regards from Finland.
PS. GOOGLE vipukirves or leveraxe, there is a lot more to study.
05-01-2008 01:25 AM

Finland,

I understand you are behind the leveraxe and its marketing. I do have to react to your answer.
Yes i am rather new to this site, what does this has to do with your axe??

I want to contribute to this thread so will ignore your suggestive writing.

Be sure i do understand the principle of your tool. I tried (now several times) to get to a constructive discussion about your invention. Unfortunately you are repetitive in your answers but did not add any information , be it positive or negative- to my arguments or supplying me and the other readers with additional arguments to follow the (your) hype.

YOU are the seller. Not me. And as things stand, I am a non convinced spectator which has no interest in buying your product based on your argumentation.

Please accept that i as a customer expect to be educated and convinced, call it brainwashed, by YOU the seller and that pointing out my shortage of knowledge is not a motivating salestechnique nor does it motivate your customer to go look for self education on YOUR product.

Having a testing public on a forum is a great cheap marketing trick, but then also accept the sceptics and the comments that follow from this public exposure. Stand prepared to defend.

Despite my open wood-profile (read my postings and you will know a lot about me) I do have another life.
I probably have a thousand potential customers in my surroundings for your product. I do live in a country where 80% of the population is heating with wood (be it in advanced or less advanced systems as you wish).
I also do have amongst others a company which is selling in the home market and your tool would fit in my tooling range and scope of this company.
I do have contacts nationwide with horse-loggers, being firewood suppliers etcetc

But i dont see how i would be able to sell your tool to my customers using your argumentation technique.

The commercial power of an invention lays in its marketing.

Selling $hit in 4 color printed bags makes a lot of money just because its called fertilizer.



Remain safe,

Tatra 805

 

[grandpatractor]

I can see how it would be much safer. The right side of the axe actually grabs the right side block of wood . My brother used it in his basement on the cement floor since it won't penetrate clean thru.

 

[Erick]

I don't know where the list is now????? but I would like to get on it. Perhaps we could do as Ian suggested and post an updated list and then new signups could copy and past the list with their name on it into a new post.

I'd like to give this thing a try and see what it will do.

Promise to give it a fare and accurate write up with pictures and video if warranted.

Seems like a neat concept, and I've got everything from 10" pine and poplar to 28" hickory and 36" oak to try it on. I split everything by hand anyway and am very familier with the ring around the roundy concept.

 

[Erick]

As best I can tell I think the list looks like this

GeeVee - had it last according to posts
JBFab - may have it now??
24d
elaps ???? 1 post and has not signed on since 11-27-07 probably not still here
Woodchuck361
Jefflee1
gtstang462002
Erick

There are a lot of folks that posted comments in between these names but none said they wanted on the list if you were posting to get on the list please add your name in line where it should be.

If I left anyone out or got it wrong please post up and let me know.

 

[JBFab]

As best I can tell I think the list looks like this

GeeVee - had it last according to posts
JBFab - may have it now??

. . .


nope, not yet, who do I need to PM my address to?

 

[GeeVee]

A thousand Pardons.....

I am responsible for having it longer than I should. Please accept my apologies.

JB- it is on its way today to you. My secretary boxed it and its sat in her office, waiting on the address. I was confused you still wanted it last I checked.

No matter, its on its way....

THANKS to the manufacturer and the member who cares to keep this pass around going.

Again, sorry for mis-handling.

GeeVee