More wood in a pickup bed, split or unsplit?

[user 35682]

+1. Take a solid block of wood 2" x 8" x 8" (128 cubic inches), cut from the end of an 8 x 8. Split it into about 100 pieces with a hammer and chisel. Now stack the pieces into one row at tight as you can. Compare that stack to the block that you started with.

'nuff said. :bang:

You guys are all over the place. Wood Doctor, that's a different argument from the one at hand. It's not about how much space is between the logs, it's about which format would fit into the back of his truck better.

Here's an easy test everyone can do:
1) Go to Dunkin Donuts if you're in New England, Starbucks everywhere else.
2) Buy a 1lb bag of coffee beans.
3) Note height of beans in bag.
4) Grind beans.
5) Add grinds back to the original back.
6) Note height.

If anyone has grounds that stack higher than the beans then I'd love in invest in your coffee company.

If you don't feel like doing the test here's an even easier way. Go to Starbucks and compare the size of a 12oz bag of grounds vs. 12oz bag of beans. I have one of each in my freezer and will save you the time; the latter is taller.

Mr4wd,
all that said, if your back can handle it (mine wouldn't) I'd probably still drive the wood out whole to avoid a) dragging the splitter 25+ miles each way, and b) I usually find it faster to move trunks than split wood.

 

[redprospector]

You guys are all over the place. Wood Doctor, that's a different argument from the one at hand. It's not about how much space is between the logs, it's about which format would fit into the back of his truck better.

Here's an easy test everyone can do:
1) Go to Dunkin Donuts if you're in New England, Starbucks everywhere else.
2) Buy a 1lb bag of coffee beans.
3) Note height of beans in bag.
4) Grind beans.
5) Add grinds back to the original back.
6) Note height.

If anyone has grounds that stack higher than the beans then I'd love in invest in your coffee company.

If you don't feel like doing the test here's an even easier way. Go to Starbucks and compare the size of a 12oz bag of grounds vs. 12oz bag of beans. I have one of each in my freezer and will save you the time; the latter is taller.

Mr4wd,
all that said, if your back can handle it (mine wouldn't) I'd probably still drive the wood out whole to avoid a) dragging the splitter 25+ miles each way, and b) I usually find it faster to move trunks than split wood.

Come on now, you're comparing coffee grounds to wood. That's like apples to oranges. Neither one will hold water......Well, coffee grounds will hold a little water, but not enough to make your comparison viable.
Grinding coffee beans will remove almost all the air space, splitting wood won't.

Andy

 

[Curlycherry1]

Time to get the last few doubting Thomases on board.

So I started with a solid hunk of black cherry glued up and sanded smooth.

I then cut nice 4" rounds out of it using a bandsaw circle cutting jig. They actually came out to 3 15/16" and not exactly perfectly round. My blade wandered just a bit. Trees are also not perfectly round so I think this does not matter. But here is the cutting of the rounds.

Then I put the rounds into the face cord rack model. As you can see they fit and there is just a bit of space between them.

Then I split the wood up. As you can see the pieces are very representative of what pieces would look like in real life. They are odd shaped, tapered in some cases, even care a knot or two.

Then I piled it into the rack. To make the Doubting Thomases come on board I can say with 100% certainty I packed the wood tight. Half way through the pile I shook the rack to settle the pieces. Then I finished piling and filled the rack to overflowing. Then I put a piece of wood on top and I schrunched the pile down and put a lot of force on the pile. It went down but it reached stasis and would not go down any further. This wood is packed far, far tighter than any person could do in a normal pile of wood.

So, there is it, biggest blocks possible still lead to MORE wood split when when un split. Face it Doubting Thomas, Mother Nature packs it tighter than you ever could.

 

[KsWoodsMan]

I'd say this pretty much sums up the question. I figured the 2 rounds once split and ricked up would just fill the wood rack. They were even a touch smallish, which we can attribute to peeling the bark off the big rounds, and it still was just a little more than the rack would hold.

I'm a believer that if you want to get more wood back home in as short a time as possible spend your time cutting and loading then split it at home before it goes in the stack.

 

[Curlycherry1]

I found three pieces of wood that did not get added to the rack. They fell into a slot on my table saw and I found them when I was cleaning up. So add 3 more pieces to the rack and it would be even more overflowing.

 

[turnkey4099]

I also vote to make this a sticky. Maybe some heavy editing of theposts but those two demonstrations graphically prove the point. Save a lot of bandwidth the next time someone brings up the subject.

Harry K

 

[redprospector]

Curlycherry, man you went to a lot of trouble to prove a point.
Good job, my hat's off to you. I would have never gone to that much trouble to prove something I learned the hard way.

Andy

 

[olyman]

and heres another thing--notice the space in between the two rounds curly made--- i have stacked the smallest stuff i burn in between those, then youd have even more left over!!!!!!

 

[Wood Doctor]

Bravo, CurlyCherry1!

CurlyCherry has eloquently proven my point.

Carrots and french fried potaties would also have done the same thing, but that cherry wood that Curly cut is immaculate.

I also have demonstrated this to myself with the real thing--firewood split from huge rounds carried on the same truck. The split wood always takes up more room than the orginal rounds. A load of rounds hauled in my Ranger will easily fill an F-150 when split.

 

[Curlycherry1]

and heres another thing--notice the space in between the two rounds curly made--- i have stacked the smallest stuff i burn in between those, then youd have even more left over!!!!!!

That was meant to be an absolute worst case. Those rounds gave the biggest gaps possible and as can be seen, the rack is now filled with more than the rack can hold.

 

[Steve NW WI]

CurlyCherry has eloquently proven my point.

Carrots and french fried potaties would also have done the same thing, but that cherry wood that Curly cut is immaculate.

I also have demonstrated this to myself with the real thing--firewood split from huge rounds carried on the same truck. The split wood always takes up more room than the orginal rounds. A load of rounds hauled in my Ranger will easily fill an F-150 when split.

I realize you all are having fun with this, but if I dig deep enough in my pics, I can show that a 36" oak round, which fits easily on one side of my tractor bucket, will yeild 27 splits, which will fill more than 1/2 of the bucket.

Prove us wrong, ye who beleive that wood can be put into less space after splitting.

I split everything before bringing it to the pile, it is not about what I can haul, it's all about saving a step in the process, I don't have to grab the block again to split it when I get it home.

 

[Wood Doctor]

More Than 27 Splits

Steve said, "I can show that a 36" oak round, which fits easily on one side of my tractor bucket, will yeild 27 splits, which will fill more than 1/2 of the bucket."
--------------
A 36" dia. oak round will yield far more that 27 splits if you are splitting for firewood. Let's assuume that it's 18" long. That 36" oak round weighs 675 lb, so each of your 27 logs weighs almost 25 lb.

Glad I'm not asking LOML to load those into the stove.

You can get at least 50 firewood splits out of a 36" dia oak log--maybe more. Maybe somebody hauled away half of your splits before you loaded the tractor bucket.

 

[Steve NW WI]

Steve said, "I can show that a 36" oak round, which fits easily on one side of my tractor bucket, will yeild 27 splits, which will fill more than 1/2 of the bucket."
--------------
A 36" dia. oak round will yield far more that 27 splits if you are splitting for firewood. Let's assuume that it's 18" long. That 36" oak round weighs 675 lb, so each of your 27 logs weighs almost 25 lb.

Glad I'm not asking LOML to load those into the stove.

You can get at least 50 firewood splits out of a 36" dia oak log--maybe more. Maybe somebody hauled away half of your splits before you loaded the tractor bucket.

Since we are getting way too detailed here, (and I woke up in the middle of the night and have nothing better to do), here's a drawing to scale of a 36" round, with split lines on 6". It's not exactly 27 pieces, but then again I don't split with a tape measure either. I shoot for a split size of about 4-6" on a side, so it's not too far off. I'll hunt down the actual pics I was talking about later, can't seem to find them in my jumbled mess I call a computer right now.

On the weight, is that green or dry? I'm also gonna guess that that is in 16" length, I go for 20" or so, stove takes up to 24". 25# is not bad, especially on a -30° night!

 

[Coldfront]

Here we go again, I remember from last year I asked if you get more wood when split? Not rounds but a 10 cord loggers load of 8 footers, I always thought I would end up with more than 10 cords when split. But the general consensus was you would get less when split and stacked. I still debate that, the 8 ft log length 10 cord truck load was packed pretty tight, not that much air gaps between logs, you have to end up with a lot more air space when it is all split up? I don't have the space or time to do a full fledged experiment. My split wood gets stacked in with some of last years piles.

 

[Wood Doctor]

Since we are getting way too detailed here, (and I woke up in the middle of the night and have nothing better to do), here's a drawing to scale of a 36" round, with split lines on 6". It's not exactly 27 pieces, but then again I don't split with a tape measure either. I shoot for a split size of about 4-6" on a side, so it's not too far off. I'll hunt down the actual pics I was talking about later, can't seem to find them in my jumbled mess I call a computer right now.

On the weight, is that green or dry? I'm also gonna guess that that is in 16" length, I go for 20" or so, stove takes up to 24". 25# is not bad, especially on a -30° night!

Steve, check out the stuck thread at the top for log weights. Oak does not lose that much water when dried. It's rated at about 55 lb/cubic foot dry, and 63 lb/cubic foot green depending somewhat on species. A 36" dia oak round that's 18" long occupies 10.6 cubic feet and weighs 675 lb green and 585 dry.

So, assuming 585 lb dry, each of your 27 logs would weigh nearly 22 lb apiece when dry. That's why I said 50 logs would be a better estimate for more comfortable handling and burning. Now take those 50 logs and stack them up. I bet they take up more room than the original round, which gets us right back to Post #1.

 

[woodbooga]

Here we go again

The debate's like an annual fall ritual - like taking the kids apple picking, the geese flying south, or the in-laws and my folks trading choice words over Thanksgiving turkey.

Easiest answer to the Q: More wood in a pickup bed, split or unsplit?












Buy a bigger truck.

 

[Dalmatian90]

Not rounds but a 10 cord loggers load of 8 footers, I always thought I would end up with more than 10 cords when split. But the general consensus was you would get less when split and stacked.

Depends on the specific question.

A couple pages back I posted a quote from an old book (1918) that stated there was more actual wood in a cord of 16" logs then in one of 48" logs due to "less crookedness."

Comparing short to long logs, short can be packed more efficiently to occupy a smaller volume.

Comparing round to split, split can be packed more efficiently to occupy a smaller volume.

It seems that to carry the most wood volume, we need to have nothing but cookies

 

[Curlycherry1]

Positively, definately once the logs get over 2' long then the volume of wood in a given pile drops off. My brother gets 12' logs all the way up to 30 footers and the trucks with the 30 footers have far less wood on them then the 12' loads. You can see it on the trucks. Hence, he buys by weight.

 

[TreePointer]

Stop thinking about it. Just put any extra wood in the cab and go have a beer.

 

[Coldfront]

I guess when you talk about crookedness of logs it all depends what kind of wood you are getting. My load of logs was fairly straight 8 footer's mostly red oak, ash, some white oak, not quit as straight as say pine poles, but not that far from it. As far as the original question goes I will put my vote in for more wood in a pickup in the form of rounds.