Stihl MS 291 burnt out after 1 hr

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west041

ArboristSite Operative
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Location
maine
Our 028AV crapped the bed after 30 years of dedicated service. My father bought a brand new MS 291 to replace it. This thing was terrific for 1 hr of use, and then on the second outing, about a month ago,I was bucking up a fairly large spruce. After I felled the tree, I worked the saw pretty stead for about 10 minutes limbing up and cutting the trunk into 16" lengths. I had the saw pretty well buried into the lower trunk when I start to see smoke coming out around the bar area. This whole time the chain had been moving, the brake was off and there were no signs of any problems.
First I check the bar oil (check) and chain brake (0ff). The chain tension was just fine, but there is a lot of resistance when trying to rotate chain by hand. So I rip into it and find a bunch of burnt up plastic around the sprocket area. It goes without saying that there was OEM Stihl two stroke properly mixed in the gas. I mean this is a brand new saw. So I send it over to my dealer who we originally purchased it from and wait. A month later they come back and say Stihl won't cover the repairs. Stihl claims that I was overreving the saw with the chain brake engaged. Are you kidding me? I've been running Stihl saws since I was 12 and there is no way this is the case.
The estimate for the repair is $541.90 so the saw is basically an assembled inventory of parts that is quite worthless to us. Parts that would need replacing are the chain sprocket, needle cage, worm gear, oil pump, engine housing, various oil seals, the brake band and the clutch.
So as of now my father is out about $500 while getting 1 hr of use out of this brand new high end saw. Stihl just doesn't make 'em like they used to (I ran an 031 and a 1970's 041 farm boss for many years without incident) and I feel that they obviously don't care about retaining customers after this experience. I'd love to hear others' theories on what might have happened, because Stihl's version is not what happened. I am going to call Stihl directly on Monday and try to work this out because I think there was some sort of internal failure that caused this overheat. I will post updates if there is anything to update.

One thing I want to be clear on is that my local dealer did everything they could to try to get this covered for me, but in the end Stihl made the decision not to cover it.

Pictures to follow.
 
Our 028AV crapped the bed after 30 years of dedicated service. My father bought a brand new MS 291 to replace it. This thing was terrific for 1 hr of use, and then on the second outing, about a month ago,I was bucking up a fairly large spruce. After I felled the tree, I worked the saw pretty stead for about 10 minutes limbing up and cutting the trunk into 16" lengths. I had the saw pretty well buried into the lower trunk when I start to see smoke coming out around the bar area. This whole time the chain had been moving, the brake was off and there were no signs of any problems.
First I check the bar oil (check) and chain brake (0ff). The chain tension was just fine, but there is a lot of resistance when trying to rotate chain by hand. So I rip into it and find a bunch of burnt up plastic around the sprocket area. It goes without saying that there was OEM Stihl two stroke properly mixed in the gas. I mean this is a brand new saw. So I send it over to my dealer who we originally purchased it from and wait. A month later they come back and say Stihl won't cover the repairs. Stihl claims that I was overreving the saw with the chain brake engaged. Are you kidding me? I've been running Stihl saws since I was 12 and there is no way this is the case.
The estimate for the repair is $541.90 so the saw is basically an assembled inventory of parts that is quite worthless to us. Parts that would need replacing are the chain sprocket, needle cage, worm gear, oil pump, engine housing, various oil seals, the brake band and the clutch.
So as of now my father is out about $500 while getting 1 hr of use out of this brand new high end saw. Stihl just doesn't make 'em like they used to (I ran an 031 and a 1970's 041 farm boss for many years without incident) and I feel that they obviously don't care about retaining customers after this experience. I'd love to hear others' theories on what might have happened, because Stihl's version is not what happened. I am going to call Stihl directly on Monday and try to work this out because I think there was some sort of internal failure that caused this overheat. I will post updates if there is anything to update.

Let me reiterate that at no time was the chain stopped during this experience.

Pictures to follow.
looks like you can fix that your self if Stihl dont . It wont cost that much . I aint so sure the engine housing is wrecked.
 
That's a shame. Maybe I'm wrong but it seems like I've seen a lot of threads like this with homeowner stihl saws lately.
 
The case can be cleaned up and the parts replace. It isn't terribly difficult to do. Just order in the parts the dealer said you need and watch a few YouTube videos on it. If that doesn't work for you I'm guessing there a person or two on here who would do the work for a small fee.

Bad deal that stihl isn't standing behind it.
 
Thanks for the input guys. I am going to work the phones with Stihl before I start getting into a self repair. I have done quite a few repairs on the 041s and 031s but I almost never work on brand new saws, and it was still within the warranty period which is why I didn't mess with it at all and brought it straight back to the dealer.

To be quite honest it wasn't even that big of a spruce. It was probably about 16" diameter. I just can't believe that Stihl would say I overreved with a stationary chain. That's chainsaw 101, always keep the chain moving...
 
I have seen this before and it looks like the sap did the saw the damage. I agree it is not that bad of a repair. It looks like the sap got into the innards and just became like cement. clean it up really well and then report back.
 
I have seen this before and it looks like the sap did the saw the damage. I agree it is not that bad of a repair. It looks like the sap got into the innards and just became like cement. clean it up really well and then report back.

Thanks for the alternative theory. I was totally befuddled by the chain brake excuse. I was looking for alternative theories and no one at the shop could provide me with one other than the chain brake was on. Which is completely idiotic to me.

Sap seems like a very likely culprit, November was quite mild in Maine and before you get consistent cold temps the spruces are pretty sappy and hard to buck up.
 
Thanks for the input guys. I am going to work the phones with Stihl before I start getting into a self repair. I have done quite a few repairs on the 041s and 031s but I almost never work on brand new saws, and it was still within the warranty period which is why I didn't mess with it at all and brought it straight back to the dealer.

To be quite honest it wasn't even that big of a spruce. It was probably about 16" diameter. I just can't believe that Stihl would say I overreved with a stationary chain. That's chainsaw 101, always keep the chain moving...
Yeah, but stihl has to deal with joe smoe that doesn't know 1 of chainsaw 101, but still buys their product.
 
If the chainbrake was applied, how could you over-rev the saw? You'd smoke the clutch, but not melt everything around it.
I was thinking the same thing. Could the spruce chips/bar oil have somehow blocked the oil flow and lead to the overheat?
I cannot imagine stihl and the dealer both leaving you high and dry?
Good luck!
 
Alternatively, if you buy something else, don't buy a plastic-cased homeowner saw. If nothing else, you won't have the risk of melting an engine housing when the housing is made of metal...
There's not much risk of that on a plastic cased saw if it doesn't have an inboard clutch either. There's a reason we only read these melted case stories about plastic Stihl saws.

A clutch is a friction device. It should not be slipping if things are working correctly, but given it is on the output of a several HP engine it has the capability of getting very hot very fast. To put that up next to a case material that melts at a fairly low temperature is an obvious design compromise.
 
Thanks for the alternative theory. I was totally befuddled by the chain brake excuse. I was looking for alternative theories and no one at the shop could provide me with one other than the chain brake was on. Which is completely idiotic to me.

Sap seems like a very likely culprit, November was quite mild in Maine and before you get consistent cold temps the spruces are pretty sappy and hard to buck up.


The sap heats up and the water is " boiled " away and it just become harder, coats the brake band and slowly builds up. gets hotter and then begins to bind things up. a good cleaning, perhaps place the power head in a plastic bag and then place it into the fridge get the nice and cold the sap will break off easier. then make a list of the parts you need. I do not blame Stihl as much as I would blame the dealer. If you identify the problem correctly then you can easily get the issue solved. The dealer is asked what they think happened to the unit, Stihl can only base if the saw is worth repairing from what they said. A good cleaning will show you pretty quickly if it is indeed melted or just coated in sap. From the photos I can see you need a new oiler gear, dunno if the brake band is toast, clutch may need a good tear down and cleaning. If you are very lucky all that would be needed are a few parts and a good cleaning.
 
The sap heats up and the water is " boiled " away and it just become harder, coats the brake band and slowly builds up. gets hotter and then begins to bind things up. a good cleaning, perhaps place the power head in a plastic bag and then place it into the fridge get the nice and cold the sap will break off easier. then make a list of the parts you need. I do not blame Stihl as much as I would blame the dealer. If you identify the problem correctly then you can easily get the issue solved. The dealer is asked what they think happened to the unit, Stihl can only base if the saw is worth repairing from what they said. A good cleaning will show you pretty quickly if it is indeed melted or just coated in sap. From the photos I can see you need a new oiler gear, dunno if the brake band is toast, clutch may need a good tear down and cleaning. If you are very lucky all that would be needed are a few parts and a good cleaning.

Thank you for the very detailed advice. This will come in handy if I do have to do the repair myself. I know Stihl has to draw a line somewhere and not cover idiot homeowner mistakes. The dealer just did their job, to say what they think happened. I really shouldn't be surprised that the dealer couldn't get this covered. What will help is me calling the Stihl representative and telling them exactly what happened. If they still stonewall me then I am going to be very disappointed. If they cover the repairs then it will reinforce what I've always thought of Stihl - that they have a good product and they back it up. I honestly have never had a problem with their product before. I've owned four saws made in "West Germany" and they all had hundreds if not thousands of hours on them and the only work I ever had to do was on wear items (carburetors, recoils, etc). I always felt that the only way to kill an old Stihl was to drop a tree on it or put straight gas in it.
 
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