NE 346XP - Affects of Cat Muffler & Muffler Mod - Porting & Popup To Come

[Article10]

Brad, relatively new to the site, but very much enjoy what you and everyone here is doing with engines.

With the increased effiency of the cylinder assembly, is there much of a gain by increasing the venturi ID of the carb or using a larger "flowing" carb or is the engine RPM limited?

 

[B_Turner]

Good stuff Brad, I really appreciate how you share details.

Sorry if I missed this info, but it's stuff I have been trying to figure out before I buy a second 346 (first one non cat).

The vid says turned against the limiter at 13.7k. Is that the carb limiter or the coil on the etech model? If my non etech coil is limited, it is above 14k so I am trying to figure out if the etech coil is different than the non etech coil (stock coils).

Is that a Baileys non OEM non cat muffler? Do all the etech bolts deflector shield, gasket etc work with the replacement muffler? (i.e. Do I need anything else?)



For me I love my non cat 346 and am trying to understand if there are any real differences between the etech and non etech 346 that a replacement muffler won't fix. Like do they have the same coil?

 

[blsnelling]

Brad, relatively new to the site, but very much enjoy what you and everyone here is doing with engines.

With the increased effiency of the cylinder assembly, is there much of a gain by increasing the venturi ID of the carb or using a larger "flowing" carb or is the engine RPM limited?

At a certain point, I'm sure a larger carb would be needed. I actually have a 357XP carb on mine. I'm not sure it did much for it. I did not measure the venturi on either carb. But this is a work saw and has to retain all functionality. So that rules out a lot of carb and intake mods. This saw will still function 100% the was a stock saw does. Starting, idle, and throttle response will all be as good or better than stock. Externally, the only noticable difference is the extra deflector on the muffler.

 

[Guarddog1]

It just takes some time and thinking to get your head around some of this stuff. Now I'll try and confuse you While exhaust and transfer port timing doesn't change, intake timing does. Because the bottom of the piston skirt isn't changing, and the intake port is coming down, intake duration is increased. It's kind of like automatic porting, lol. I kept this in mind when I ported it. I left it about 4° higher than what I want the final number.

Yeah I followed that whole deal that was explained on another site. I will most likely do the same deal to my 346 if this yours turns out ok. Just another question a touch off topic what program do you use to print the degree wheel differnt sizes I have the pic already just need to size it.

Thanks.

 

[blsnelling]

Sorry if I missed this info, but it's stuff I have been trying to figure out before I buy a second 346 (first one non cat).

The vid says turned against the limiter at 13.7k. Is that the carb limiter or the coil on the etech model? If my non etech coil is limited, it is above 14k so I am trying to figure out if the etech coil is different than the non etech coil (stock coils).

Is that a Baileys non OEM non cat muffler? Do all the etech bolts deflector shield, gasket etc work with the replacement muffler? (i.e. Do I need anything else?

That was with the limiters trimmed. If I went any leaner, I started getting erratic RPM readings, indicating I was past the rev limiter. AFAIK, all NE 346XPs have a rev limited coil.

The muffler is off of a 350. This is one of the mufflers replaced by Husqvarna that was vibrating loose on the 350. It's not an issue on the 346. Something to do with harmonics or something on the 350. You can use all the same bolts and other hardware.

 

[blsnelling]

...if this yours turns out ok.

The same mods have been on my 346 for months. It's one lean mean machine.

I use Photoshop to resize the degree wheel.

 

[B_Turner]

That was with the limiters trimmed. If I went any leaner, I started getting erratic RPM readings, indicating I was past the rev limiter. AFAIK, all NE 346XPs have a rev limited coil.

The muffler is off of a 350. This is one of the mufflers replaced by Husqvarna that was vibrating loose on the 350. It's not an issue on the 346. Something to do with harmonics or something on the 350. You can use all the same bolts and other hardware.

Thanks. Must be just some variation in the 346 coils as I know mine will turn at least 14.1k without being on the limiter (as verified by two different tachs).

Earlier in the week I had called a dealer about an hour and a half south of here who said they still had a non cat 346 in stock (I know they still did a few months ago). But when I got down there they were all etechs, so I am trying to get a handle on the differences before I buy another 346 of the etech flavor.

I need to track down a recent 346 IPL.

 

[blsnelling]

Thanks. Must be just some variation in the 346 coils as I know mine will turn at least 14.1k without being on the limiter (as verified by two different tachs).

Earlier in the week I had called a dealer about an hour and a half south of here who said they still had a non cat 346 in stock (I know they still did a few months ago). But when I got down there they were all etechs, so I am trying to get a handle on the differences before I buy another 346 of the etech flavor.

I need to track down a recent 346 IPL.

Just get a used OEM coil off eBay for $25. That is the best solution. That and the muffler are the only difference. Oh...unless you don't like the green fuel cap

 

[B_Turner]

Just get a used OEM coil off eBay for $25. That is the best solution. That and the muffler are the only difference. Oh...unless you don't like the green fuel cap

Thanks.

To be honest I don't like the look of the green gas caps.

In regard to coil, you are referring to what you did to get an unlimited coil?

In other works, the stock etech and non etechs 346's have the same coil as eachother (same limit, that is). There are conflicting postings on the web on this...

Still smarting from when I bought my first 3120's and found out they were limited so much lower than the older ones....:deadhorse:

 

[JT78]

So I noticed that you state the squish as being .016 currently and then say it is .013 without a gasket I have two questions first is .016 a safe number on this saw because of the smaller combustion chamber vs a larger I thought that .020 was as small as you want to go? Second question is what did you use for your gasket that was .003 thick? I am not questioning why just trying to learn thanks.

 

[blsnelling]

So I noticed that you state the squish as being .016 currently and then say it is .013 without a gasket I have two questions first is .016 a safe number on this saw because of the smaller combustion chamber vs a larger I thought that .020 was as small as you want to go? Second question is what did you use for your gasket that was .003 thick? I am not questioning why just trying to learn thanks.

I have had no problems at all with a squish of .016 on smaller saws. No errosion of the crown or anything.

I use different thicknesses of paper and make my own gaskets. I've never had a failure. Once machined, I'll be using a fuel proof sealant such as ThreeBond 1194.

 

[blsnelling]

In regard to coil, you are referring to what you did to get an unlimited coil?

In other works, the stock etech and non etechs 346's have the same coil as eachother (same limit, that is). There are conflicting postings on the web on this...

All NE 346XPs have a rev limited coil. I can't say if they vary or not. I always replace them. The rev limit is usually stamped on the coil. I'll check the one that came off this saw to see what's stamped on it.

 

[SawTroll]

....

The muffler is off of a 350. This is one of the mufflers replaced by Husqvarna that was vibrating loose on the 350. It's not an issue on the 346. Something to do with harmonics or something on the 350. You can use all the same bolts and other hardware.

If memory serves, the issue on the 350 was that it lacked the muffler support bracket that the 346xp and 353 has.

 

[blsnelling]

Here it is ported and about 1 tank of fuel through it. It's running great. It started in one pull this morning cold.

I've got a question for you carb gurus. You'll notice that the saw goes leaner and leaner the more cuts I make with it. It's not an air leak. Every 346 I've worked on does this. Even my 346 with a 357 carb does the exact same thing. I simply tune the saw to its leanest point and it's fine. But let it set a few seconds and it's rich again at first. Could the carb be having trouble supplying enough fuel? Do you think raising the needle lever would help cure this characteristic? Could the tank vent be having trouble keeping up in extended cuts?

It's hold about 11,800-12,000 in the cut, and 10,000 dogged in.

The saw comes back apart tonight for the machine work.


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[Article10]

Might be temperature of the cyl assy. Try setting it up on a "warmed" up assy and see if it goes leaner with more cuts.

The tank vent may be an issue worth looking into.

 

[PasoRoblesJimmy]

New EPA/CARB scam to prevent removal of a cat muffler.

The EPA or CARB has come up with a new scheme or scam to block removal, replacement or modification of a cat/non-cat muffler.

The muffler on my Husky 445 (purchased Nov 2009) has 2 round metal rings firmly pressed with a tight force fit into the 2 deep holes on the front side of my muffler. It looks like the EPA or CARB is trying to block access to the muffler bolts located just behind those 2 force fitted rings. My Stihl SH86 (purchased May 2009) has the same exact force fit rings pressed deep into the front holes of its muffler. In both cases, the metal rings block removal of the muffler bolts. The metal rings have writing on them.

The non-cat muffler on my Husky 445 is made of plated, likely aluminized, steel. It looks like the muffler could be hollow behind the opening underneath the muffler screen.

I am trying to figure out how to remove the muffler to see what is lurking inside of it. How do you remove the 2 metal rings blocking access to the muffler attachment screws? Can these 2 rings be removed with a drill or a screw extractor? Can these 2 rings be reinstalled after they have been removed? Is there a simple way to remove a muffler without destroying the rings or the muffler?

I'm not interested in a radical racing saw. I just want a working saw that isn't turned into a gutless wonder by the Political Correctness of the EPA.

 

[blsnelling]

The EPA or CARB has come up with a new scheme or scam to prevent removal, replacement or modification of a cat/non-cat muffler.

The muffler on my Husky 445 (purchased Nov 2009) has 2 round metal rings firmly pressed with a tight force fit into the 2 deep holes on the front side of my muffler. It looks like the EPA or CARB is trying to block access to the muffler bolts located just behind those 2 force fitted rings. My Stihl SH86 has the same exact force fit rings pressed into the front holes of its muffler. In both cases, the metal rings have writing on them.

The non-cat muffler on my Husky 445 is made of plated, likely aluminized, steel. It looks like the muffler could be hollow behind the opening underneath the muffler screen.

I am trying to figure out how to remove the muffler to see what is lurking inside of it. How do you remove the 2 metal rings blocking access to the muffler attachment screws? Can these 2 rings be removed with a drill or a screw extractor? Can these 2 rings be reinstalled after they have been removed? Is there a simple way to remove a muffler without destroying the rings or the muffler?

I'm not interested in a radical racing saw. I just want a working saw that isn't turned into a gutless wonder by the Political Correctness of the EPA.

Not to be rude, but please start another thread.

 

[blsnelling]

Might be temperature of the cyl assy. Try setting it up on a "warmed" up assy and see if it goes leaner with more cuts.

The tank vent may be an issue worth looking into.

The saw was fully warmed up. If you wait just a few seconds, it goes back to being rich.

 

[Article10]

Not necessarily a "jetting" issue unless the plug indicates lean burn.

What else in the fuel supply equation could impead flow?

 

[dingeryote]

The EPA or CARB has come up with a new scheme or scam to block removal, replacement or modification of a cat/non-cat muffler.

The muffler on my Husky 445 (purchased Nov 2009) has 2 round metal rings firmly pressed with a tight force fit into the 2 deep holes on the front side of my muffler. It looks like the EPA or CARB is trying to block access to the muffler bolts located just behind those 2 force fitted rings. My Stihl SH86 (purchased May 2009) has the same exact force fit rings pressed deep into the front holes of its muffler. In both cases, the metal rings block removal of the muffler bolts. The metal rings have writing on them.

The non-cat muffler on my Husky 445 is made of plated, likely aluminized, steel. It looks like the muffler could be hollow behind the opening underneath the muffler screen.

I am trying to figure out how to remove the muffler to see what is lurking inside of it. How do you remove the 2 metal rings blocking access to the muffler attachment screws? Can these 2 rings be removed with a drill or a screw extractor? Can these 2 rings be reinstalled after they have been removed? Is there a simple way to remove a muffler without destroying the rings or the muffler?

I'm not interested in a radical racing saw. I just want a working saw that isn't turned into a gutless wonder by the Political Correctness of the EPA.

Jimmy,

Start a new thread and put up some pics if ya can.

I'm gonna run to TSC tomorrow and will eyeball the snot outta thier saws to see what it is in there.

Stay safe!
Dingeryote