038 Super Aluminum Removal from Jug?

[darren_nh]

Rebuilding an 038 Super. I tried muriatic acid to remove the aluminum from inside the cylinder to no avail. From what I have read here, honeing it off is not a good idea. I used a q-tip to apply the acid, waited a bit and rinsed well.

Is there something else I can try? The dealer wants over $350 for a new jug and piston for the saw.

Thanks.

 

[Roy M]

Be patient with the acid, it will work. A light scuffing with a finger hone and a wash will not hurt anything but go easy.

 

[Rookie1]

Id do a search and check brad the snellerizer's threads. I think he has alot of time doing it.

 

[BlueRider]

knock of worth the money

I broke a ring and scored the cylinder on my 038M last year. I could't swing the cost of an OEM so I picked up one from Bailey's for $120 delivered to my door. Iv'e miled a couple hundred feet of olive and cut up a fair bit of walnut. nothing overly abusive but enough to make me think it is going to last long enough for me to get my money's worth. I actualy mic'd the knockoff against the OEM and the only difference was in the guage of wire used for the retainer clips. I put the oem clips back in.

 

[epicklein22]

I recently went through your same situation. You need to apply a lot and you need to be patient. You should be able to see and hear it working. Typically gets white. You will have to repeat it over and over. Each time I washed it out and then took some emory cloth and roughed it up/removed some of the alloy. Good luck, it is a slow process but works compared to a new cylinder.

 

[Jacob J.]

+1 and then get in there with some elbow grease, emery cloth, and cutting oil and remove the last traces of aluminum with your fingers.

 

[darren_nh]

I broke a ring and scored the cylinder on my 038M last year. I could't swing the cost of an OEM so I picked up one from Bailey's for $120 delivered to my door. Iv'e miled a couple hundred feet of olive and cut up a fair bit of walnut. nothing overly abusive but enough to make me think it is going to last long enough for me to get my money's worth. I actualy mic'd the knockoff against the OEM and the only difference was in the guage of wire used for the retainer clips. I put the oem clips back in.

I would have gone that route if Baily's offered a kit for the Super.

 

[Crofter]

Oven cleaner or lye also attacks the smeared on aluminum very well. Dont get it into the ports or up onto the combustion chamber or anywhere there is no plating as it will undercut the cylinder plating and destroy the chamfering. This is also true for the acid method.
The spring loaded finger hones might be a disaster unless the stones are almost full length of the bore and the cylinder has closed transfers.

 

[darren_nh]

Oven cleaner or lye also attacks the smeared on aluminum very well. Dont get it into the ports or up onto the combustion chamber or anywhere there is no plating as it will undercut the cylinder plating and destroy the chamfering. This is also true for the acid method.
The spring loaded finger hones might be a disaster unless the stones are almost full length of the bore and the cylinder has closed transfers.

I have opted not to go the finger hone route as I spent close to $40 (more than the saw) at Bailey's for the flex hone. I will try the acid again and then maybe oven cleaner.

The dealer said the jug wasn't worth the work and probably wouldn't last very long after the rebuild, but he agreed that the roughness on the inside was aluminum transfer. I figure if I can get the aluminum off, it will probably last unless the aftermarket Golf piston doesn't hold up.

 

[Rookie1]

I argue with my dealer alot about situations like this. He is a dealer and its a business he has a reputation to uphold and keep customers happy. So its not cost effective for his labor rate to acid out aluminum or hone cylinders. Then there is the reliabilty factor. If you do it and blows an hour after you start it its only you and your time your out. Im sure alot of saws are scrapped because of scored cylinders that could be cleaned up. :greenchainsaw:

 

[Mad Professor]

1) Try concentrated hydrochloric acid (12 M) , muriatic is a 50% dilution with water.

2) There was an OEM 038S assy on ebay yesterday, buy it now for $95, can't beat that.

3) I think there was a used jug too.

4) You can adapt a 038M jug to work

 

[ZeroJunk]

I tore down an 026 and an 028 Super a couple of days ago, both needed pistons and the cylinders were scored. I got them free, the 028 is almost new.

Anyhow, I honed them with a brake cylinder hone for a few seconds and they smoothed right out.
If that was a bad idea and going to cause me problems I wish somebody would advise me and I'll buy new jugs.

Also, were all, some, or none of the Stihl cylinders lined?

 

[Mad Professor]

Model: A

MANUFACTURED BY:
STIHL ANDREAS MASCHINENFABRIK
STUTTGART, GERMANY
SERIES OR ASSEMBLY NUMBER:

YEAR INTRODUCED:
1927
YEAR DISCONTINUED:
1932 (?)
ENGINE DISPLACEMENT:
235 ccm (14.3 cu. in.)
NUMBER OF CYLINDERS:
1
CYLINDER BORE:

PISTON STROKE:

CYLINDER TYPE:
Aluminum with cast iron liner
INTAKE METHOD:
Piston ported
MANUFACTURER ADVERTISED H.P.:
6
WEIGHT :
46kg (101.2 lbs.)
OPERATOR CONFIGURATION:
Two Man operation

 

[Nailgunner]

lined, or plated? All the cylinders I've seen have been chromium plated rather than mechanically lined.

I'd be careful with caustic soda since it's very aggresive and if the liner plating is compromised, I suspect it could undercut the plating quite easily.

Incidentally, another strong etchant for aluminium is a mixture of salt and copper sulphate, I use this for deep etching in aluminium and it's very fast. Suggest you keep treatment very local to the galled area; ie the bit you actually want to work on. My suggestion - haven't tried this but it should work, your risk etc - would be to paint the inside and base of the cylinder with tar paint, leaving only the bit you want to work on, make a little well around it with plasticene or similar, spoon etchant in and pour it out. Tar paint is resistant to most water-based corrosives, being highly hydrophobic. Remove afterwards with thinner or petrol.

BMW had trouble with Nikasil liners a while back, all the 4.0 litre V8s in Britain started developing poor compression and low power as the sulphur in the fuel corroded the liners. they replaced thousands of engines under warranty before switching to Alusil.

 

[darren_nh]

1) Try concentrated hydrochloric acid (12 M) , muriatic is a 50% dilution with water.

2) There was an OEM 038S assy on ebay yesterday, buy it now for $95, can't beat that.

3) I think there was a used jug too.

4) You can adapt a 038M jug to work

I looked at Ebay last night. I didn't find the listing. I saw a parts saw, but it is an AV. I think I am going to try some emery cloth and more acid. Then I will put it together. If it blows again, I will adapt the 038 Magnum kit from Bailey's as you did. Is that saw still running?

 

[J Beard]

Years ago I had a 302 go lean because of a bad injector on the #8 cylinder.
AL transfer was heavy enough that I scraped it out with a razor blade.
Left 2 small lines in the cyl that almost honed out with a few passes.
Only damaged 1 Cyl but i honed and put new rings in all 8.
That was 80k miles ago and still running strong!