gloves

[rmihalek]

I've discovered over the past couple climbs that those blue rubber coated "ugly" gloves (or whatever they're called) are great for ascending because they grip the rope so well. I was able to pull myself up without even footlocking and then hold the running end and slide the friction hitch up with ease. Of course, footlocking made it even easier.

However, while descending one time, I was wondering what was slowing me down so much. I stopped to check things out and realized that the friction hitch had sucked in a bit of the rubber coating and it was preventing the rope from sliding through the hitch easily.

So what I've been doing lately is to ascend with the ugly gloves and then switch once aloft to my motocross gloves. The motocross gloves are great because they have padding on the topsides of all the fingers in case my hand whacks a limb and good palm padding for descending. I also still have enough dexterity with them on to untie throw bags and tie other knots and stuff like that.

 

[moss]

I've come to the same conclusion Bob, the sticky gloves are great for going up DdRT but get sucked into the hitch going down. A light but sturdy glove with leather or equivalent synthetic material on the palms is best for general rope handling and descending.

 

[Sizzle-Chest]

funny, i was just thinking about this very issue. you really cant beat the blue gloves for ascending, but i found that i could blow through a pair in one day of work simply by descending or running ropes on the ground. that grippy stuff does not hold up to friction, so i bought some leather palm gloves just today. and while writing this i just got an idea: a reversable glove with one sticky blue side and the other with just a leather palm. it couldnt be as form fitting, but i would still prefer it to two pairs!

 

[rmihalek]

Yeah Sizzle, the reversible idea is nice because a few climbs ago I was changing over from the blue gloves to the motocross gloves only to watch one of my motocross gloves fall to the ground...

I wonder how easy it would be to get a hand into a reversed blue glove?

 

[moss]

I never ever drop my gloves from a tree :biggrinbounce2:

Here's a whacked out idea, rubber on the front, leather on the back. Switch hands and you have leather on the front, rubber on the back, no need to pull them inside out.

My Ironclad Cold Condition gloves are still my favorite. They don't actually keep my hands warm below 28f or so. I wore them yesterday climbing in 85f and my hands were cooler and drier than when I was wearing my blue sticky gloves on the same climb. Even though the Blue sticky gloves have a fabric back they still hold sweat and heat inside.

I still like bare hands the best for ascending but I'd welcome a breathable glove that would grip the rope when you want it and release when you want to.

 

[Sizzle-Chest]

I never ever drop my gloves from a tree :biggrinbounce2:

Here's a whacked out idea, rubber on the front, leather on the back. Switch hands and you have leather on the front, rubber on the back, no need to pull them inside out.

moss, thats actually what i meant by reversable gloves. i think it would work if they were desgined right. and i cant even count the times that i've dropped my gloves. i dont even take them off anymore. in fact, im wearing them right now (not really).

 

[trevmcrev]

Ive climbed for years without gloves but one of my climbers really likes them so we tried those coated gloves and found the same problems. The best compromise ive found since are the stretchy cotton gloves with little rubber dots all over the palm & fingers. They fit snug, breath, and grip well going up but dont get sucked into your friction hitch coming down. This style of glove is getting hard to find though, seem to be taken over by the new style coated ones.

Trev

 

[moss]

moss, thats actually what i meant by reversable gloves. i think it would work if they were desgined right. and i cant even count the times that i've dropped my gloves. i dont even take them off anymore. in fact, im wearing them right now (not really).

Big duh! on my part. Nice idea Sizzle.

 

[Tom Dunlap]

Ny hitch handling style must be a bit different than you guys. the only time I find a Smurf Glove getting sucked into the hitch is when I grab with a closed hand. If I manipulate the hitch with my finger tips there's no problem. Even if a Smurf Skin gets trashed, they're cheap and get tossed.

 

[treeseer]

Same prob here with smurfs--maybe we all need to switch to TD's fingertip style!

trev, the dotted cotton knits (my fave too) are available cheap from Galeton.

 

[Fireaxman]

Ny hitch handling style must be a bit different than you guys.

I'm with Tom. Love the Uglies, have not had a problem yet. But since I use the Uglies a lot I'm paying close attention to understand how it happens, to be sure it doesn't happen to me. Seems to me that as long as your hand is on top of the friction hitch, and (coming down) the line is coming Out of the friction hitch, it shouldn't suck Ugly rubber into the hitch. I control the friction hitch with my left hand on the top of the hitch, and control tension below the friction hitch with my right hand down around my hip. Bob, Moss, Treeseer, Sizzle - does that sound any different from what you are doing?

Come to think of it, I was climbing with a freind last week and she had some trouble coming down. She finally made it down by using both hands to force the friction hitch down. She was using the same 4/2 VT I was using, the same Blue Streak rope, and the same Uglies. I had trouble understanding why her friction hitch was giving her trouble and finally wrote it off as just very weak hand strength. I wonder now if she was having the same problem you guys are talking about.

 

[Sizzle-Chest]

i've never had my glove get sucked into the hitch. my only beef with sticky gloves is that the rubber material wears away too fast. they are still the best gloves i have found, and cheapest too! maybe they could make a heavy duty version with extra thick sticky!

 

[rbtree]

The cheap Ugly gloves, which i get for maybe .80 a pr, have a thin coating which rarely gets caught in my friction hitch, especially since I use a light touch, as Tom explained. But, when I use the thicker and better made Atlas gloves, those can tend to get caught, especially if the coating is coming loose. I've found the best prices are at Galeton.com, but don't get their red gloves which they say are as good as the Blue Atlas gloves..they are junk.

 

[trevmcrev]

Come to think of it, I was climbing with a freind last week and she had some trouble coming down. She finally made it down by using both hands to force the friction hitch down. She was using the same 4/2 VT I was using, the same Blue Streak rope, and the same Uglies. I had trouble understanding why her friction hitch was giving her trouble and finally wrote it off as just very weak hand strength. I wonder now if she was having the same problem you guys are talking about.

Is she of lighter body weight than you? Otherwise maybe just technique on the hitch.

Trev

 

[moss]

I'm with Tom. Love the Uglies, have not had a problem yet. But since I use the Uglies a lot I'm paying close attention to understand how it happens, to be sure it doesn't happen to me. Seems to me that as long as your hand is on top of the friction hitch, and (coming down) the line is coming Out of the friction hitch, it shouldn't suck Ugly rubber into the hitch. I control the friction hitch with my left hand on the top of the hitch, and control tension below the friction hitch with my right hand down around my hip. Bob, Moss, Treeseer, Sizzle - does that sound any different from what you are doing?

I climb old-school using a Blakes which I think is more likely to pinch rubber coated gloves on descent. That's because you can get your "down" hand close to the bottom of the hitch, with a VT or similar hitch you don't get your hand in there.

Typically on descent I start with my down hand at my hip but sometimes I let it ride up and it might contact the bottom of the hitch. With bare hands or leather gloves there is no problem when this happens. The reason I let my hand ride up is because I don't use splittails and I tend to hold a little weight off the hitch when I'm descending to reduce rope wear on the hitch. To do this my down hand starts at the hip and then rides up until it gets near the hitch then I regrab at the hip again. I just started using the ruber gloves and see that the technique is incompatible. I also descend conventionally with hand stationary at the hip, rope sliding through, depends on the situation.
-moss

 

[rmihalek]

After reading Tom's post I re-evaluated my hand placement on the friction hitch (Blake's) when descending and realized that I was somewhat gripping the entire knot while pressing down on the top wrap with my two fingers. So, I tried keeping a more open hand and just pressed down on the top wrap with my index and middle finger while keeping the rest of my hand away from the knot. This worked very well.

I also keep my other hand down near my hip to control the feed of the running end of the rope a bit. I noticed that with the rubber gloves on, I need to keep a light touch with the "belay" hand as well because some significant heat was getting generated.

So, a light touch on the Blake's and a light grip on the running end and I had a smooth, slow descent with no loss of glove material.

 

[moss]

Come to think of it, I was climbing with a freind last week and she had some trouble coming down. She finally made it down by using both hands to force the friction hitch down. She was using the same 4/2 VT I was using, the same Blue Streak rope, and the same Uglies. I had trouble understanding why her friction hitch was giving her trouble and finally wrote it off as just very weak hand strength. I wonder now if she was having the same problem you guys are talking about.

That's strange, my experience with advanced hitches is that they have very light release control. That's one thing I really like about them. The descent handling and control is sensitive and superb. I can't imagine needing to use two hands to pull down a VT. It should require light pressure. Two hand release is potentially dangerous if the climber freezes and won't let go of the hitch (straight to the ground). As I mentioned in the previous post, it's difficult to get your rubber gloved down hand stuck up under the hitch with a VT. Sounds like a hitch tuning problem with your friend's setup. Or as Trev mentioned some effect of her weight. I would check her descent technique out close to the ground and see if you can replicate and solve the problem before getting her up high again. Otherwise put her on a Blake's and reinforce the one hand only above the hitch rule.
-moss

 

[Fireaxman]

She is a little lighter than I am, about 125 to my 170. I really think she got some of the glove stuck in the VT, and I just did not know to warn her about it. She was following the rope up with her right hand, not quite trusting the VT; Moss, I think you were describing it as a way to keep some friction off the Blakes, but neither she nor I knew to watch out for getting a glove stuck in the VT.

She might have been more comfortable with the Blakes. I used to climb Blakes, but I've been so pleased with the advanced hitches on our long clear stem loblollies that I was trying to encourage her to use the VT. She really enjoyed the trip up, hand over hand instead of body thrust, especially since I was able to help her up by pulling on the tail of the rope, and she didn't have to tend the friction hitch at all going up. I think I just need to coach her a little on keeping that right hand clear of the hitch.

We started low and slow of course, and she had no trouble close to the ground. I think she just got a little nervous at 80 feet and started keeping her weight off the VT by following the rope up with the right hand. Thanks to this thread, I'll know more about what to watch for next time.