New Moisture Meter

[Sawyer Rob]

Not long ago i bought a moisture meter from Norwood Industries... Then on a nicer day, i had the opportunity to try it out.

I was surprised how small and light it is, and it "easily" fits into any pocket... It has pins, and has a nice cap to go over them so you won't get poked while carrying it in a pocket...

I had a big maple on the mill that i just took a slab off from, so i pushed the pins into the log and took a reading... Once the pins are in, you push a button and it takes a reading. When you let off the button, the reading disappears...

I don't have another moisture meter to compare reading to, but the log has been sitting around a long time, so there wasn't much moisture in the surface, and even less in the end grain, as shown here...

Anyway, i did take several reading of both the side grain and the end grain, and the readings were consistant...

The paper that came with the meter says it has measuring range of 5-50% in wood products, and 1.5-33% in building materials like brick, plaster ect...

I'm guessing that this meter will be more than accurate for my needs and very handy to have around the shop...

Rob

 

[redprospector]

I'm glad you posted this.
I'm needing to get a new moisture meter so I can keep a little closer tab's on things.
I've been looking at Lingomat, and Delmhorst. What did the Norwood cost, if I might ask?

Andy

 

[SilverBox]

I think baileys sells this one.


http://www.baileysonline.com/itemdetail.asp?item=17718&catID=

 

[BobL]

I have a similar meter. Just a heads up that pin type meters are not that accurate especially above about 25% and below about 12% MC. They are ok at saying "this piece of wood has a higher/lower NC than that piece of wood", provided it is the same type of wood and the pieces are bit from the same part (preferably inside) of the centre of the wood.

They can be calibrated against MC determinations done using weight measurements, but it needs to be done for a range of different types of timber you will be using.

 

[Brmorgan]

I have some cheap no-name probably-Chinese meter I got off eBay a couple years ago. It can do both pin-based reading and radio-wave pinless (touch) reading. I tested it against the good Wagner we had at the sawmill and it was pretty close, always within 2%. It also has a selectable range for different types of wood and other stuff like concrete. Who knows how long it'll last though.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

It was about a hundred bucks... I don't know "exactly" because i bought it with some other things, and i can't find my paper work to see the exact amount...

Thanks guys,

Rob

 

[artie__bc]

I have some cheap no-name probably-Chinese meter I got off eBay a couple years ago. It can do both pin-based reading and radio-wave pinless (touch) reading. I tested it against the good Wagner we had at the sawmill and it was pretty close, always within 2%. It also has a selectable range for different types of wood and other stuff like concrete. Who knows how long it'll last though.

Which one did you get Brad?

 

[peterrum]

I have some cheap no-name probably-Chinese meter I got off eBay a couple years ago. It can do both pin-based reading and radio-wave pinless (touch) reading. I tested it against the good Wagner we had at the sawmill and it was pretty close, always within 2%. It also has a selectable range for different types of wood and other stuff like concrete. Who knows how long it'll last though.

I did the same thing a couple of years ago and bought one off Ebay that was advertised as not being Chinese. I bought it for about $30. When it arrived at my house I looked at the packaging it came in and thought, that sure looks like Chinese packaging. There was no label on it to say where it was made but the company was advertising it as Made in Canada on their website. I took the battery out of the unit and there was the evidence, PRC (Peoples Republic of China) written on the side. The unit seems to work alright but like you Brad, I dont know how long it will last. I am not sure of the name brand on it as I am not home right now, but the company was from the Ottawa area.

 

[BlueRider]

I have only had a moisture meter for a couple of years. I have milled my own wood for 15 years but never needed one until I was in the middle of a project and ran out of wood. I bought a moiture meter to do exactly what Bob mentioned, to check one piece of woods moisture level against anothers. I traded for some wood with a friend and he stores his wood in a covered area but not indoors and I needed to check it against my wood that had been stored indors.

I ended up with a timber check meter for $69 and have been happy with it, when I remember that I own it. I still feel that moisture meters are a bit unnessesary. but if you are planning on selling your wood that would be a different story. One of the few times I have used my meter in the last few months was when friend came over to swap for a piece of walnut. I knew he needed to use it soon and I did not want to send him home with a board that was not dry.

From what I learned when I read up on them before I bought mine the cheper ones have a narrower window where they are acurate. they are designed to be acurate around 12% and as you go under or over that they start to vary and the farther away the more variation. and as Bob said they are not very acurate above 25% and absolutely worthless above 30%.

 

[Brmorgan]

From what I learned when I read up on them before I bought mine the cheper ones have a narrower window where they are acurate. they are designed to be acurate around 12% and as you go under or over that they start to vary and the farther away the more variation. and as Bob said they are not very acurate above 25% and absolutely worthless above 30%.

But so is the wood, so no problem. A good meter has different calibration ranges to be more accurate in different species too. They work by electrical resistance/conductance, and the hard-as-nails Aussie woods that BobL works with are going to conduct electricity a lot differently. I don't think meters are really important if you're air drying and are in no rush to use the wood - if you season a bunch of 1" outdoors for a year and bring it inside for six months before using it, you're pretty sure to be safe. But if you're kilning the wood in any fashion, a meter is fairly necessary to dial-in your kiln cycles and temps, otherwise you risk overdrying or drying too fast, both of which can ruin a lot of good wood.

Artie / Peter - I don't know what the manufacturer of mine is. I don't remember it being advertised as "made in Canada", but I did buy it from a Canadian seller who stated they would service it here. At any rate, the user manual is in Engrish and the build quality is not what I would expect of a North American product, so I'm pretty sure it came from China or some other SE Asian country. I'll have to look at it later when I go downstairs to do some work.

 

[BlueRider]

After reading what I wrote it sounds like I am reiterating that Bob said a meter is worthless above 30%. that is not true, That is my opinion that I added to his statement about the meters not being very acuratte above 25%. Sorry I didn't mean to put my foot in Bob's mouth.

you are correct about the wood being worthless above 30%. I just wanted to add the info about the cheap meters not being useful for measuring free moisture content. I would suspect that the $200-$400 meters are able to acurately measure moisture in a much broader range.

Just as an aside the meter I have was made in Canada and for $69 it is a lot of quality for the $$

 

[redprospector]

Well, in my opinion a moisture meter is a very valuable tool if you are doing interior work with the lumber.
We are doing a (never ending) remodel on our house. We decided to do a wall in T&G Juniper, in a herring bone pattern. The Juniper I used had been drying for about a year (that's a long time for a softwood like Juniper), I moved it inside and stickered it for about 2 months.
I have a little experience in this, and the wood seemed dry as a bone but I no longer have a moisture meter. I planed the wood, straight lined it, sized it, put the V tongue & groove in it, everything seemed good. I meticulously fit my joints in the center of the wall. Everything still seemed good for another 2 months, and then the joint's started to open up. A 45 degree mitre cut will do some funny things with the slightest shrinkage. Some of them opened up pretty even, and some of them opened up at the heel and stayed closed at the toe. It's not much but it really looks bad to me. I believe a herring boned wall with a piece of trim up the middle is a sure sign of shoddy work. So now I have to figure out how to dress it up without using a piece of trim.

The moral of this story is: If I would have had, and used a moisture meter I would have known that the wood was not quite dry enough and would move a little. Could have saved me a lot of work, and worry.

Andy

 

[BlueRider]

Well, in my opinion a moisture meter is a very valuable tool if you are doing interior work with the lumber.
We are doing a (never ending) remodel on our house. We decided to do a wall in T&G Juniper, in a herring bone pattern. The Juniper I used had been drying for about a year (that's a long time for a softwood like Juniper), I moved it inside and stickered it for about 2 months.
I have a little experience in this, and the wood seemed dry as a bone but I no longer have a moisture meter. I planed the wood, straight lined it, sized it, put the V tongue & groove in it, everything seemed good. I meticulously fit my joints in the center of the wall. Everything still seemed good for another 2 months, and then the joint's started to open up. A 45 degree mitre cut will do some funny things with the slightest shrinkage. Some of them opened up pretty even, and some of them opened up at the heel and stayed closed at the toe. It's not much but it really looks bad to me. I believe a herring boned wall with a piece of trim up the middle is a sure sign of shoddy work. So now I have to figure out how to dress it up without using a piece of trim.

The moral of this story is: If I would have had, and used a moisture meter I would have known that the wood was not quite dry enough and would move a little. Could have saved me a lot of work, and worry.

Andy

I suspect your paneling problem was less of an issue of uncured wood and more an issue of an inappropriate choice of joints. A miter joint is rarely a good choice for fine carpentry or furniture making. Its popularity is largely due to the relatively inexpensive sliding miter saws and the need for increased speed from finish carpenters. It used to be that on high end finish work inside corerners for things like crown molding were always coped even though outside corners were mitered. coping takes longer but it will show wood movement less.

to understand why a miter joint is usualy a bad choice you need to keep in mind how wood moves. a 4" wide juniper board will expand and contract about .020"-.040" in width, depending on if it is flat sawn or quarter sawn. At the same time that board will not expand or contract at all along its length,no mater how long the board is. keeping this in mind and looking at the trinagle at the end of the board created by the miter cut and a line drawn square from the inside of the miter across the board one of the legs will change by aproximately 1/32" and the other will stay the same. this means the 45* angle must also change. now if two of these boards are held at a 90* angle and the boards are held fast on the wall with nails, the miter cuts on the ends will open and close and result in 1/16" gap. A better chioce in your situation would have been to keep the ends square and cut a groove or tongue on the end to match the sides of the boards and do a stagered pattern. when done in a herring bone it can really accentuate the herrring bone effect very nicely.

 

[redprospector]

I suspect your paneling problem was less of an issue of uncured wood and more an issue of an inappropriate choice of joints. A miter joint is rarely a good choice for fine carpentry or furniture making. Its popularity is largely due to the relatively inexpensive sliding miter saws and the need for increased speed from finish carpenters. It used to be that on high end finish work inside corerners for things like crown molding were always coped even though outside corners were mitered. coping takes longer but it will show wood movement less.

to understand why a miter joint is usualy a bad choice you need to keep in mind how wood moves. a 4" wide juniper board will expand and contract about .020"-.040" in width, depending on if it is flat sawn or quarter sawn. At the same time that board will not expand or contract at all along its length,no mater how long the board is. keeping this in mind and looking at the trinagle at the end of the board created by the miter cut and a line drawn square from the inside of the miter across the board one of the legs will change by aproximately 1/32" and the other will stay the same. this means the 45* angle must also change. now if two of these boards are held at a 90* angle and the boards are held fast on the wall with nails, the miter cuts on the ends will open and close and result in 1/16" gap. A better chioce in your situation would have been to keep the ends square and cut a groove or tongue on the end to match the sides of the boards and do a stagered pattern. when done in a herring bone it can really accentuate the herrring bone effect very nicely.

You've got some good points, and I agree that the 45* mitre joint is not a good choice if you don't have a good moisture meter.
15 years ago I put up paneling in a house in the same pattern using a moisture meter, and today the center line is still tight.
Maybe it's our climate or something.

Andy