Stump Grinding Cleanup. How much do you clean up after grinding?

[ClimberBusinessman]

We do tree removal/trimming as well as landscaping work. When doing a tree removal estimate, I usually give my customer 3 choices regarding stump grinding. I use a reliable and affordable subcontractor to grind the stumps.
1. No stump grinding (with the stump left at stump-level, usually 4-8" from ground level unless it's a huge tree with dirt/rocks in the roots, in which case it would be cut higher).
2. Stump grinding, with shavings/grindings/mulch left in place with no cleanup/haul away. My subcontractor usually grinds to about 8-12" deep below grade, and fills the hole back in with the grindings.
3. Stump ground, with shavings removed and topsoil and grass seed installed.

For the third option, I specify removal of "excess shavings", but in reality, I usually remove every single wood shaving. I'm afraid that if I don't remove all of them that the shavings will settle, leaving a dip in the yard, and will also absorb all the nitrogen, turning the new grass yellow. Trouble is, due to all the labor involved, stump grinding removal can make our quotes not very competitive compared to companies that either don't offer this service or do a "half baked" job.

My question for the community is what is your typical level of stump-grinding cleanup?

A. No cleanup at all; all shavings left in place, with the hole left unfilled
B. Some general smoothing out/filling in the hole with grindings, with no haul away. (this is basically our no-cleanup option)
C. Haul away of the top 2 inches or so of grindings, adding topsoil on top of the remaining grindings.
D. Haul away basically 100% of the stump grinding shavings before adding topsoil. (this is our cleanup option).

Any and all answers would be appreciated. I'm just trying to better understand what the standard practice is for the industry.

 

[jefflovstrom]

I'm confused. Every customer is different so the scope of the work is on the contract. Are you saying that you are giving the clients a few options, or are you going to do what is agreed to? No a,b,c,d, just bid it the way you bid.
Jeff,
It was a beautiful day!

 

[ZinTrees]

normally we refuse cleanup unless its a really good repeat customer, in general we rake the chips up to a mound over the stump then the customer can do what they want, usually leaving them and let them decompose, they turn to soil and fill the hole pretty much perfectly

if it is a cleanup job, we rake up all the chips, and leave the hole, we don't do any soil or sod, im a tree guy not a landscaper lol

 

[pdqdl]

Most of our competition is like Zin, and doesn't believe in giving the customer what they might want. I routinely offer similar options, but with a few changes.

A. No cleanup at all; all shavings left in place, with the hole left unfilled. I only do this for other contractors and let them finish the cleanup.
B. Some general smoothing out/filling in the hole with grindings, with no haul away. (this is basically our no-cleanup option) We pile up the grindings where the stump was at, leaving as much lawn surface as practical. This is the same service provided by most other stump grinders in town.
C. Haul away of the top 2 inches or so of grindings, adding topsoil on top of the remaining grindings. This is our standard cleanup, although we don't bother with any topsoil.
D. Haul away basically 100% of the stump grinding shavings before adding topsoil. (this is our cleanup option). I have a better method: we clean up the area and leave the hole filled with chips. Then I grind out enough of the root flare to quickly grade the area flat while mixing in some of the wood chips as a soil improvement. This eliminates the need to move any topsoil, it keeps the soil of approximately the same content as the surrounding ground, and loosens it up for rapid grass growth. THEN seed, or offer sod for those folks with an irrigated lawn that want rapid restoration. Fertilization is an option too, especially if your soil is so poor that you anticipate yellow grass. Be sure to use high phosphorus fertilizer for better seed germination.

Keep in mind that most folks who are willing to pay for turf restoration are probably fertilizing already.

 

[ZinTrees]

Most of our competition is like Zin, and doesn't believe in giving the customer what they might want.

I usually try my best to give them what they want, but with cleanup it always ends in them standing over my shoulder, nitpicking everything and telling me how to do my job, so I quit offering it and stopped having issues, you get what you get

 

[pdqdl]

Charge enough money that they are entitled to nit-pick. Then smile and do a great job.
Cheap jobs are done cheaply, fine work should be more profitable than the cheap work.

You are giving easy dollars away to the landscapers. Let's face it: cleanup is the easiest and least dangerous part of the job, but it takes time. Make some money doing easy work. If you get a customer that still nit-picks, tell the guys to take care of it, then start pointing out other areas of their yard where you could do additional cleanup (or other services) for additional fees. Be chatty and friendly all the while. They'll usually decline and go back inside after finding some good excuse for departing.

 

[ZinTrees]

I usually tell them anything after the bid is $300 a hour, excess cleanup doesn't take very long
for great customers I will offer cleanup but very rare, as my stumps are subcontracted so now I have to go back to the job to clean up, he doesn't offer cleanup

 

[TheJollyLogger]

For me, it always depended on the client and the neighborhood. When I was in Colorado, our level of service was to make it look like the tree was never there... topsoil, sod, we even leaf vacced the lawn to suck up our sawdust, to the point where there were a few times I went back to pick up the check and they didn't even notice the tree was gone. In Texas and Alaska, they weren't willing to pay for that level of service usually.

It's all about knowing your market and your competition, but it's a fairly easy way to set yourself apart from the competition. An extra half hour spent on cleanup can really set you apart from the pack. At the end of the day, apples to apples, the tree will be gone with no damage... how you leave the jobsite can make it apples and oranges... do a little extra and set yourself apart...

 

[ZinTrees]

the fact we clean up or even own a chipper puts us wayyyy ahead of 80% of the local companies

I saw a local guy a few weeks back with an old F700, with a rear mount highranger, entire truck rattle can yellow, he had an entire tree cut up sitting on the deck, and pinched between the lower and upper booms...


yeah thats my competition, dude seriously used his boom as a rachet strap to carry a whole tree down the road, multiple other companies I've seen here are using SUV's and car trailers, no straps, most of them will just drop the tree in the road/on the fence while standing on a ladder with a wild thing


i really wish I was lying

 

[TheJollyLogger]

the fact we clean up or even own a chipper puts us wayyyy ahead of 80% of the local companies

I saw a local guy a few weeks back with an old F700, with a rear mount highranger, entire truck rattle can yellow, he had an entire tree cut up sitting on the deck, and pinched between the lower and upper booms...


yeah thats my competition, dude seriously used his boom as a rachet strap to carry a whole tree down the road, multiple other companies I've seen here are using SUV's and car trailers, no straps, most of them will just drop the tree in the road/on the fence while standing on a ladder with a wild thing


i really wish I was lying

Where are you again?

 

[ZinTrees]

Where are you again?

about 20 minutes south of Knoxville, TN

 

[TheJollyLogger]

Yeah, rural, probably a lot like the Texas market

 

[ZinTrees]

Yeah, rural, probably a lot like the Texas market

probably

everyone and their uncle here owns a chainsaw, most companies here are unlicensed and only get work because someone they know at church said they can cut trees, thats my competition and for the most part thats also who underbids me, I've lost jobs to uninsured rednecks because they were $100 cheaper than my bid, but the customer is happy because they saved a little money, meanwhile they are dealing with broken driveways, brush piles all over, ruts in the yard etc, that $100 would have saved them thousands in the long run but whatever

 

[TheJollyLogger]

probably

everyone and their uncle here owns a chainsaw, most companies here are unlicensed and only get work because someone they know at church said they can cut trees, thats my competition and for the most part thats also who underbids me, I've lost jobs to uninsured rednecks because they were $100 cheaper than my bid, but the customer is happy because they saved a little money, meanwhile they are dealing with broken driveways, brush piles all over, ruts in the yard etc, that $100 would have saved them thousands in the long run but whatever

Yup

 

[ZinTrees]

I was helping my guy with 3 stumps we were grinding, had to get 811 to mark stuff, of course they painted on the shrubs we removed along with the trees, so I had to take pictures ahead of time, then cut everything down and put flags out where every mark was, him and I are digging out around these stumps to see how deep utilities were, customers neighbor comes over pointing out "oh thats not where the wire was its over this way" and stuff, as if I didn't call 811, AND TAKE PICTURES


after about half an hour of me and the stump guy complaining, I tell dude to go inside for "insurance reasons" well he'd go inside for 4 or 5 minutes and be hovering right over the operating stump grinder in no time flat, being pelted with chips, why? to point out every wire, that he had no clue the location of but wanted to argue with my pictures


I honestly almost wrote him a bill for my time, shoulda been a 20 minute job and turned into like 3 hours because his BS and standing in the way, id have to go all the way around him with the shovel because he wouldn't move, it was all I had not to yell at him and/or call the cops to come talk to him, I've dealt with some really stupid people but that one takes the cake for last year

 

[TheJollyLogger]

I was helping my guy with 3 stumps we were grinding, had to get 811 to mark stuff, of course they painted on the shrubs we removed along with the trees, so I had to take pictures ahead of time, then cut everything down and put flags out where every mark was, him and I are digging out around these stumps to see how deep utilities were, customers neighbor comes over pointing out "oh thats not where the wire was its over this way" and stuff, as if I didn't call 811, AND TAKE PICTURES


after about half an hour of me and the stump guy complaining, I tell dude to go inside for "insurance reasons" well he'd go inside for 4 or 5 minutes and be hovering right over the operating stump grinder in no time flat, being pelted with chips, why? to point out every wire, that he had no clue the location of but wanted to argue with my pictures


I honestly almost wrote him a bill for my time, shoulda been a 20 minute job and turned into like 3 hours because his BS and standing in the way, id have to go all the way around him with the shovel because he wouldn't move, it was all I had not to yell at him and/or call the cops to come talk to him, I've dealt with some really stupid people but that one takes the cake for last year

I feel your pain, I remember a job in east Texas when a guy sent us packing after trimming one tree because he didn't think I was a real climber because I wasn't using spurs... I was wasting too much time setting ropes and srt...

 

[pdqdl]

the fact we clean up or even own a chipper puts us wayyyy ahead of 80% of the local companies

I saw a local guy a few weeks back with an old F700, with a rear mount highranger, entire truck rattle can yellow, he had an entire tree cut up sitting on the deck, and pinched between the lower and upper booms...


yeah thats my competition, dude seriously used his boom as a rachet strap to carry a whole tree down the road, multiple other companies I've seen here are using SUV's and car trailers, no straps, most of them will just drop the tree in the road/on the fence while standing on a ladder with a wild thing


i really wish I was lying

It's a lot easier to compete with untalented tree hacks. Do not wish for better competition.

 

[TheJollyLogger]

Yes, never drop to the level of your competition... raise the bar and let them compete with you... in the long run it will always put the odds in your favor... play the long game and they will either improve or fall by the wayside...

As a funny aside, when I got back to Colorado, I ran into a guy that had a landscaping/tree business at a friend's of mines window tinting business, and he introduced me as the jollylogger... keep in mind I had been gone for 15 years... and the guy remembered me. He said he was so glad when I went to Texas, because he couldn't compete. He mentioned one client in particular that he wouldn't climb his trees, and the customer said well the jollylogger did, and he said well call him then, lol. But by then I was down in Texas...
My point is never worry about the competition, let them chase you and your level of professionalism and service, it will always pay off in the long run.