MS291 vs. MS261

[Scooterbum]

NO! That's what's getting old, man!

I'll 2nd and 3rd this one.

 

[johnnichols]

"Runs like a 70cc saw" and "is a 70cc saw" are still two different things in my book. The former would be a saw strung out to within an inch of its life, while the latter is going to be relaxing right in the middle of its intended operating range.

I mean, I have a 261 and I can appreciate how it would run if ported. But I don't think either version of the 261 could make me put down saws like the 441 or 461 for really big wood or big cuts. I think that is especially true for milling, where the saw has to run for a long time when making cuts. Capacity is another consideration -- I'd have no problems running a 28" bar on a 441, but I'd never suggest doing it on a 261, ported or not.

Time will tell how much lifespan has been given up on my "Stumpbroke" 261, and I'm sure some. However.... IMO I don't feel its strung out to an inch of its life. No load speed is 700 RPM higher than factory setting of 14,000 and top power is achieved around 10,150 vs. factory specs. of 9,500. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but aren't saws meant to be run at full throttle while in the cut and not "relaxing" in the middle of its operating range? Range is WOT.
At WOT the saw pulls like a 70cc saw is a true statement, however, thats with the recommended bar lengths of the 50cc saw that it is. I did try a 20" bar on it burying it in oak and hickory and it pulls it great, but went back to 18" where I feel its happier. With that said, I agree with you in that it runs like a 70cc but indeed its not.
And finally, I agree with most that big saws are needed for milling.... 80cc class or bigger. Thanks, John Nichols

 

[Gologit]

There's some good information in this thread . There's also way too much childish bickering by a couple of members.

It needs to stop. Now.

Some of the posts which add nothing to the thread will be deleted.

 

[MS260 Fan]

I'm sorry. 271, 291, 311, and 391. NOT 201, 261, 441, and 461. Us stihlheads need a simpler numbering system. Sheesh.

The middle number is what matters. Even = pro. No clamshell in those.

If I was looking I would definitely take the 261 over the 291. The 291 is probably a good saw but the $70 seems like a bargain to me.

 

[MEATSAW]

An MS280 is not a pro saw. Neither is the MS180.

 

[Scooterbum]

Time will tell how much lifespan has been given up on my "Stumpbroke" 261, and I'm sure some. However.... IMO I don't feel its strung out to an inch of its life. Thanks, John Nichols

I don't think any of the saws being built by the many on this site are even remotely close that description. You'd have to be tripling or quadrupling the HP to be even close.

 

[sawfun9]

If you start to pinch the bar, the 261 will feel much more solid than the plastic 291. You may spit out AV rubbers with the homeowner saw that you won't with the pro model.

 

[SawTroll]

An MS280 is not a pro saw. Neither is the MS180.

:msp_smile: I guess we all know that, did anyone say the were?

Edit, now I see - and you are of course right, that "rule" is useless, and always was! :msp_biggrin:

 

[SawTroll]

If you start to pinch the bar, the 261 will feel much more solid than the plastic 291. You may spit out AV rubbers with the homeowner saw that you won't with the pro model.

Sure, but you should of course not yank on the powerhead in the first place - however, it is tempting.....

 

[THALL10326]

Sure, but you should of course not yank on the powerhead in the first place - however, it is tempting.....

Whatttttttttttttttttttt, Sawtroll ya been in the cave too long ole boy. Out in the real world they aren't tempted to yank the saw, they do it with joy. They snap anti vib springs, pull buffers completely out the crankcase and sometimes stretch the tank housing out the saw so far they rip the manifold. Course I love it, such non-sense cost money to repair, yank it again I always say, cheers!!!!

 

[SawTroll]

Whatttttttttttttttttttt, Sawtroll ya been in the cave too long ole boy. Out in the real world they aren't tempted to yank the saw, they do it with joy. They snap anti vib springs, pull buffers completely out the crankcase and sometimes stretch the tank housing out the saw so far they rip the manifold. Course I love it, such non-sense cost money to repair, yank it again I always say, cheers!!!!

Sure, I know you love it! :yoyo:

 

[THALL10326]

Sure, I know you love it! :yoyo:

You betcha. I give little mercy to those that tear em up from brute strengh, they gotsa pay. They seem to learn faster once they dip in the wallet. Accidents account for alot of repairs too. Those types I feel kinda bad for. Had a fellow borrow his pops like new MS260. He got in pinched in a tree that went the wrong way. He couldn't get the saw out and the tree feel backward taking the saw with it. Snapped the tank housing off. He comes and buys his pop a new 261, goes back and saws out the 260 with it. Brings me the 260 to put back together. That little accident cost that man over 750.00. Gotta hand it to him though, he made no excuses and apparently he's a good son. Yup, I love it,cheers!!!!

 

[SawTroll]

You betcha. I give little mercy to those that tear em up from brute strengh, they gotsa pay. They seem to learn faster once they dip in the wallet. Accidents account for alot of repairs too. Those types I feel kinda bad for. Had a fellow borrow his pops like new MS260. He got in pinched in a tree that went the wrong way. He couldn't get the saw out and the tree feel backward taking the saw with it. Snapped the tank housing off. He comes and buys his pop a new 261, goes back and saws out the 260 with it. Brings me the 260 to put back together. That little accident cost that man over 750.00. Gotta hand it to him though, he made no excuses and apparently he's a good son. Yup, I love it,cheers!!!!

:msp_biggrin:

 

[deye223]

Well that is an incorrect statement. Obviousely the 271 is a replacement for the 270 and the 291 is a replacement for the 290. Sorry but he must have had too much to drink or you heard wrong. Thats just how it is not being rude but thats just how it is.

yep as uncommon sense (as i call it now days as it ain't common any more) would dictate :bang:

 

[SawTroll]

3.1 Engine
MS 290 MS 310 MS 390
Displacement: 56.5 cm3 59.0 cm3 64.1 cm3
Bore: 46 mm 47 mm 49 mm
Stroke: 34 mm 34 mm 34 mm
Engine power to ISO 7293: 3.0 kW (4.1 bhp)
at 9,500 rpm
3.2 kW (4.4 bhp)
at 9,500 rpm
3.4 kW (4.6 bhp)
at 9,500 rpm
Max. permissible engine speed
with bar and chain: 12,500 rpm 13,000 rpm 13,000 rpm
Idle speed: 2,800 rpm
Clutch: Centrifugal clutch without linings
Clutch engages at: 3,500 rpm

MS 291
Displacement: 50.2 cm3 55.5 cm3
Bore: 44.7 mm 47.0 mm
Stroke: 32.0 mm 32.0 mm
Engine power to ISO 7293: 2.6 kW (3.5 bhp)
at 9,500 rpm
2.8 kW (3.8 bhp)
at 9,500 rpm
Maximum permissible engine speed
with bar and chain: 13,000 rpm 13,000 rpm
Idle speed: 2,800 rpm 2,800 rpm
Clutch: Centrifugal clutch without
linings
Centrifugal clutch without



Id like to talk to the man you talked to. His logic makes no sence.

Your 290, 310 and 390 specs are not correct for the US version, nor are the 270/280 ones. I assume the specs are from the workshop manuals?

 

[johnnichols]

I don't think any of the saws being built by the many on this site are even remotely close that description. You'd have to be tripling or quadrupling the HP to be even close.

I agree with ya sir. Builders on this site put their rep on the line everyday building modded saws for the occasional user to pros that rely on their "tools of trade" for keeping the lights on and food at the table. Making anything to run more efficiently may have "cons" but the "pros" far outweigh them.... lighter,stronger,faster,and running cooler (not hotter) in the process vs.slightly higher bearing load and a little less surface area for the rings to wear on. Yes I'm sure theres more, but the smile thats on my face when I wake up thinking back on yesterdays cutting makes me forget them all anyway.
Hooked on modded saws forever. Thanks, John Nichols

 

[johnnichols]

I looked at both of these saws today and the 261 was about 70 bucks more. Same weight and about the same HP. Can anyone with experience tell me what the difference is besides the obvious? I know the 261 is a pro saw and the 291 is a mid grade. I am looking to clean up some storm damage and maybe even an occasional use on the old alaskan mill.
Thanks!

Sorry Newguy12358 for getting away from your question. We have new 291 and a 311 at work and I prefer the feel of the 261. No surprise to you I guess. If care is given to the 291 it would probably last as long as the 261, so it comes down to "feel" and handling in the end for me when putting my money down. AV is great on all of them IMO. Power is near the same stock.
No absolutes as everyone here has a different opinion. Sooooooo, what feels good to YOU??? The PRO for me. Thanks, John Nichols

 

[Roll Tide]

Your 290, 310 and 390 specs are not correct for the US version, nor are the 270/280 ones. I assume the specs are from the workshop manuals?

Those are specs out of the user manuals. Not worried about if they are dead on, just proving a point.

 

[hardpan]

Read any of my post on the 261, hands down the 261 it is as good as any 50cc saw on the market, imho one of the very best, it is not however a milling saw, you need to look at 90cc plus. The 261 is rock solid, one of the members here THALL posted he has sold almost 60 of them and not seen one back in his shop yet. My sons use two in our wood business and they have been bullet proof, I wouldn't trade mine for any other 50cc saw on the market. Absolutely love them, one of my all time favorites in right at 35 years running them. We sell the fire out of them at our shop, predominantly to the tree service pro's and several to full time firewood operations, several have bought multiple units. We have not had one come back with any issues.

Saw Troll will show up and bash them, but he bashes all Stihls and has never used one. They are a fantastic saw.

Careful. That out of balance in-bound clutch will flip you on your head.LOL

 

[H 2 H]

Careful. That out of balance in-bound clutch will flip you on your head.LOL

Na; that only happenings with those saw's with the out board clutches there just not balanced right the weight is out to far from the center point of the saw