What happens if you clear cut the wrong parcel?

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Taxmantoo

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Saw this in a financial forum, neighbor sells timber for clear-cut, loggers also clear-cut 1/3 of the forum poster's land.

http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/finance/1374253/

What would happen in your state if you did that?
I can recall a time in the 1980s when a landowner claimed he bought a survey, cut a few mature trees just his side of the line, neighbors got a survey that didn't agree, and he ended up with a 5 digit lawsuit judgment against him. This was all hearsay from the landowner's grandson, but those are the details from what I understood. IIRC, the guy who issued the erroneous survey was uninsured and judgment proof.
 
What happens? Nothing good, that's for sure. If you're not sure of your boundaries you shouldn't cut. Period.

Third party hearsay and anecdotal opinions of boundaries don't mean squat. If the logger,even armed with the information he believes to be correct, cuts over the line he might not be legally liable for damages but the pile of crap he'll have to wade through...meetings, hearings, depositions, court testimony...will cost him a bundle in attorney fees and lost work time.
I found this out first hand. Once. I'll never make that mistake again.
 
Part of my insurance covers cutting over. Its mandatory to have it in this state. Some old fence line that's been there a 100 years could be on the wrong side. I'm always Leary of that. Cutting too close. I moved 90mbf for a guy that was cut and skidded by the Amish. Couldn't get a truck to them so I had to run them out to the road. Anyway the DNR did an aerial survey and claimed some of the timber was theirs. The fenceline had been there for over 70 years. The actual survey proved some of it was although not as much as they originally claimed. The landowner is now selling the poperty over the whole mess. Its been in his family for several generations. His brother and him are on the outs now too because of the mess. Its funny how little errors in judgement can turn into big life changing problems.
 
I've done some work establishing the extent of trespass for legal purposes, and was an expert witness in a timber theft case near Portland a few years ago. The best tool the landowner has in their kit is a forester. We can do stuff like reconstruct volume of missing trees to determine the magnitude of the violation. Sometimes a boundary is a big deal, sometimes not. Most states have a rule that triple the cash value of stolen timber can be levied against the offender, based on timber prices in the affected area at the time of the theft.
 
This happened around me not too long ago a local company was cutting on state land and were caught stealing cherry outside of there parcel they were charged per tree as if it was vaneer logs they were looking at a 1.1million in stolen timber ended up settling on paying 60k to the local boces forestry program they got out of it pretty cheap compared to what could of happened
 
Depends on "who" the timber owner is.
Sometimes fines take into account more than the timber volume stolen.
Then there's the bar time, more likely as a felony in gov't cases when it's intentional, willful.
 
A friend had a lot on a lake and didn't live there. He came up and found a new well on his land. A real estate salesperson had sold the property next door and didn't know the property lines, but told the well driller to drill on my friends property. It became a legal mess.
 
When my parents planted trees in this yard, they had the good sense to plant them
about 8~10 feet from the western property line.
(I've Never understood the mindset of people planting trees on the line.
Anyhow, the drawback is that every flippin new resident on that side of me
has been a royal pain to get it across to them that the land and grass in that area is mine
and to not "drift" over and scalp it when they mow.
I've contoured the area to catch water in heavy rainfall and slowly let it run off
so as to prevent erosion, So scalping creates real problem with water velocity.
The street is on a slope of a bit steeper than wheelchair ramp
so runoff from three acres of typicaly scalped yards ( cut at 1.5 inches) uphill
from me get a pretty good bit of energy
behind the water when we get a half inch of rain in 30 mins or so.

Actually started to got a bit ugly with one guy until the aerial maps (on the county web site)
were updated to clearly could show the lines overlaid on currently visible land features.
Come to find out the the problem was damn realtor had (repeatedly ) told the guy it was his yard. Seemed to be the case every time.
The property has been GPS surveyed and it always has matched the original lines.
sorta gives me a low opinion of real estate agents
 
DanTheCanadian said:
Ouch? Where are they finding pole trees like that? I'd love to see one!!
Click to expand...


They grow tall here, but since they don't necessarily have the logs laying around they "guess" at the height and measure the stumps, then forget to calculate for taper.

As far as the 80' thing I can get 90-120 feet of logs per tree in a good stand, most I only get 50-70', leaving a 20-30' top.
 
northmanlogging said:
They grow tall here, but since they don't necessarily have the logs laying around they "guess" at the height and measure the stumps, then forget to calculate for taper.

As far as the 80' thing I can get 90-120 feet of logs per tree in a good stand, most I only get 50-70', leaving a 20-30' top.
Click to expand...
I understand how they calculate, I just wanted to know where they are finding 80' no taper lol.
 
DanTheCanadian said:
pretty straight and then all of a sudden taper right of, usually at a cluster of branches.
Click to expand...

That's exactly right. Older trees stop growing vigorously and over the years sort of smooth out their irregularities. You can usually get a couple of clear straight logs out of such a tree. The tops are often stunted, contorted, broken, dead, or flat. Complex epicormic sprays are common.
 
the last job at the commune got a couple 75's that had only had a 3" taper. to the eye they pretty much a pipe. 32 on the butt. not huge but nice poles anyway.
 
Hey Madhatte, does Douglas fir grow as fast as pine? Here a pine will be big enough for saw logs after about 30 years, reaching maturity at about 60 years. They tend to just die of at that point. Now I know that Douglas firs don't die after 60 years but I was wondering about growth rate. I would love to bury a bar in one of those, maybe someday.:rolleyes:
 
DanTheCanadian said:
Hey Madhatte, does Douglas fir grow as fast as pine?
Click to expand...

It grows differently in different places. Here, in the South Puget Sound region, it grows like crazy for the first 75-100 years and then slows down. Sure, you can get sawlogs at 50 years, but waiting just 25 more years improves both volume and quality.
 
madhatte said:
... . The best tool the landowner has in their kit is a forester. ... .
Click to expand...

Above is worth repeating. Before you cut. After the cut you'll need to throw a good lawyer in the kit as well. You don't want to get that far if you can avoid it - it takes a lot of timber to cover the defense cost of a wrongful cut claim. Ron
 

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