Stihl 2-in-1 file chewing rakers down way too much

[Frank Rizzo]

The progressive depth gauges are the only ones that actually work correctly. Wranglerstar is clueless when it comes to chains!! never trust his advice.

Wtf ? Wranglerstar and Plitz are veritable chainsaw - gods !!!

 

[memory]

Now I am no sharpening expert at all but from what I have read is you don't need to adjust your depth gauges after each sharpening let alone after each stroke. Now I don't know exactly how this works and how much is being taking off of one stroke but I would think that is too much.

 

[Frank Rizzo]

Now I am no sharpening expert at all but from what I have read is you don't need to adjust your depth gauges after each sharpening let alone after each stroke. Now I don't know exactly how this works and how much is being taking off of one stroke but I would think that is too much.

From new to about 1/2 original length the tool maintains the .025 + recommended depth ... after that you have to make adjustments to suit

 

[TurboA2]

Wranglerstar was using it on skip chain which the 2 in 1 doesn't work on. It needs the cutter in front to rest on to get the rakers the right height.

I use mine on skip chain. It works just fine but you have to make sure the guide behind the tooth is firmly seated or it'l roll forward and take too much off of the depth gauges. It took a few times for me to figure it out but it works. Slows you down a bit but over all still faster. Full Comp is smooth sailing. Match your angles and go.

 

[NSEric]

Now I am no sharpening expert at all but from what I have read is you don't need to adjust your depth gauges after each sharpening let alone after each stroke. Now I don't know exactly how this works and how much is being taking off of one stroke but I would think that is too much.

In theory the 2in1 file should maintain .025 on the depth gauges no matter how much you file the chain but some of them take too much off the depth gauges on some chains. Mine set my speed cut chain to about .050 which was horrible for falling hardwood but ok bucking up softwood. Once my chain gets worn more than 1/2 way back I'll put the depth gauge file back in it, .050 will be alright with a almost worn out chain.

I don't pay much attention to what Wranglerstar says or does, he's good at making videos but doesn't know his arse from his elbow when it comes to technical stuff or chainsaws.

 

[SmellyPirateHooker]

Can't see how it can do too much or too little. It's a fixed point and is probably doing something other then what you are used to, correct or not. Want to know for sure, just measure the rakes compared to the cutters on a chain you have been using it on. Measurements don't lie.

Ever.

 

[Frank Rizzo]

Can't see how it can do too much or too little. It's a fixed point and is probably doing something other then what you are used to, correct or not. Want to know for sure, just measure the rakes compared to the cutters on a chain you have been using it on. Measurements don't lie.

Ever.

True from new to about 1/2 left ... as the tooth gets smaller the geometry changes the amount the tool removes off the rakers ...

 

[NickC]

Interesting, I've had the same problem.

Bought an ms461 that had a nearly new but butchered chain, the cutting edges had been bevelled off for some reason and the rakers were not touched. I had the .325" 2-in-1 and liked it so bought the 3/8" version, took quite a lot of material off to loose the bevel and it was terrible, grabbing and bogging down, exhausting to use.

I put a new chain on in the end which transformed it, so I measured the rakers and they are 1.0mm / 0.04" so that explains that....... The chain is now probably not worth recovering.

I measured the .325" chains that have had many sharpenings,

Oregon .325 semi chisel = 0.4mm / 0.016
Stihl RS Full chisel = 0.7mm / 0.027"

The .325 is the Pferd, the 3/8 is Stihl branded

 

[NickC]

This can't be right so I've had a look at the 3/8 chain that has been filed far too low. Flat in a vice with the file in the cut the raker file was way above the raker, what's happening is the tendency to use rearward pressure to file properly is tilting the cutter back forcing the raker into the file - over cutting it. So if you've got a bit of damage and are filing quite aggressively you are progressively exaggerating the cut on the raker Don't see how that can be avoided? Unless you get the chain off and vice it to file, defeating the object of the system...

 

[Huskybill]

Use a 7/32” file by itself to put the arc in the gullet. Next use the Oregon file n guide with the 7/32” file to sharpen the upper edge of the tooth. Now eye ball down the chain From the bar nose to judge what the rakers are set at. If they look shallow I make two passes with the flat file on each raker.

There is no short cut in sharpening a chain, take your time perfection is the key to doing it right. Remember there’s two different angles on the file n guide it’s slanted to match the angle of the top of the tooth and angled rearward to match the cutter angle.

Once I sharpen everyone’s saw I get a lifetime job of sharpening it for them.

 

[SteveSr]

I don't know. Maybe It's because I've had a lot of teeth getting chewed up from storm calls. I tend to file pretty hard. I think I'm bending the unit and applying overt pressure from from the flat file.

I think that you've hit it here. I bought the original Pferd Chain Sharp when it was first introduced and had the same problem. You have to be VERY careful not to press down too hard or you will over file the rakers.

The other issue with the 2 in 1 is that there is no easy way to rotate the tooth file to equalize the wear on it. At least the Pferd would let you do that. The third strike is that both the Pferd and the 2 in 1 use rather expensive proprietary files. At least with the Pferd the tooth file is standard but the raker file is custom and the only place I have found it is Bailey's with their outrageous shipping charges.

I have basically quit using it and am back to the simple Stihl file with the guide attached. With this setup the tooth file is generic but the raker file is proprietary but should last a very long time.

 

[Huskybill]

I still have files I purchased on sale for the bizz they were $6 a dozen on sale for Oregon files.

 

[Andyshine77]

I have basically quit using it and am back to the simple Stihl file with the guide attached. With this setup the tooth file is generic but the raker file is proprietary but should last a very long time.

I find those guides are about perfect for an everyday work chain. Sure one can do better freehand, but these are great for general use IMHO.[emoji111]

 

[NickC]

I think you'd have to be going some to bend it to over cut the raker. Traditionally you don't press down with the round file, it's rearward pressure. Take the raker file out and put it in the chain to see, any slight rearward pressure rocks the cutter back forcing the raker into the file. And the shorter the cutter gets the closer you are to the pivot so I expect it gets worse.

I am going to grind a chamfer on the raker file so that I can flip it stopping it cutting properly, it will still take material but not as fast. Maybe after the forward sharpening strokes you can move the round file out of the cut to flatten the cutter and draw back to take a cut off the raker.

Or leave the raker file out most of the time.

If you're very conscious to be neutral how you hold the thing in the cut it shouldn't be as bad, for the little finessing sharpening, but if you have a lot of material to remove the tendancy is to push back into the cut which is the problem imo.

I know many enjoy filing as an art form, many just want a sharp chain as quickly as possible. For those these 2-in-1's seem great, unfortunately they are not as foolproof as you'd think....

 

[anlrolfe]

Of the times I've gotten grabby chain that wants to hitch and buck I would always think rakers first, then I'd look at the consistency of tooth angle but the worse comes from tooth length.

I find that I'm heavier handed filling right to left while standing on the output side of the saw than when I flip it in the vise.

I have used a crescent wrench as a redneck micrometer to ensure even cutter length and only then set the rakers... or once in a while (midlife) let someone hit the chain with power sharpener to true and even up everything again.

 

[Huskybill]

Ditto above ^^^^^. I find once the sharpness of the chain settles down it will stop grabbing. But check your teeth angles. The file n guide will avoid two different angles.

 

[HarleyT]

Where is that German guy?