Live Oak Trimming Question

[RRockTXLee]

Hey yall,

I have a question in reference to a live oak at my house. My tree have been in place for 10 years or so (since the home was built), and seem to be thriving. Unfortunately, my grass is suffering, and I would like to take out some of the larger forks of the tree to push the canopy up a bit to give my yard a chance.

Would it be safe (for the tree) for me to cut the two larger branches shown?

I have attached photos.

 

[The Satch]

I don't know if it's safe for the tree or not, but I don't think it's going to fix your issue. Pushing the canopy up will cause it to spread out higher up, which will in turn cast an even larger shadow. At best it's a short term solution, if it works at all, which I doubt. I think you would be better off aerating your lawn and over seeding with a shade tolerant grass species.

It's a great looking tree right now, I would be really hesitant to mess with something that took 10 years to grow before I messed with the fast growing plants beneath it.

 

[Del_]

Mulch the areas where the grass doesn't grow.

You are not going to get grass to grow there anyway even after the live oak is mutilated.

 

[sb47]

Plant shade resistant grass. It wont hurt the tree to prune it but it will make the higher limbs sag over time and you would be back to square one. You can thin out some of the small inner leaves and branches in the middle to let more light filter through. But you will have to keep doing it every year. Your best bet is to plant a shade resistant grass that does well in shaded arias. However your going to have thin to no grass under the tree no mater what you do. Over time that tree will cover the entire yard anyway.
Live oaks can have a very large spread, of 50 to 60 feet. It's the nature of the beast.

 

[Flintknapper]

The Oak isn't your problem. It's the soil in your yard. You have the typical soil for the 'Austin' Area (a little bit of dirt holding all that Limestone together).

IF you don't already have St. Augustine grass (very shade tolerant) that is what you will want to plant. But you need to bring in some decent top soil first and spread it around.

If you are a Texas Native...you should know this already. If not....well now you do.

 

[sb47]

The Oak isn't your problem. It's the soil in your yard. You have the typical soil for the 'Austin' Area (a little bit of dirt holding all that Limestone together).

IF you don't already have St. Augustine grass (very shade tolerant) that is what you will want to plant. But you need to bring in some decent top soil first and spread it around.

If you are a Texas Native...you should know this already. If not....well now you do.

I am a Texas native and I have more then 40 live oaks on my property. St. Augustine will NOT grow under a live oak.

 

[Deleted member 117362]

Do you have oak wilt in your area?

 

[sb47]

Do you have oak wilt in your area?

I'm sure it exist here since oaks are a common tree all over Texas. I have not seen any signs of it in my 30 years of planting and growing oaks for relocate with a tree spade.
Most common oaks around here are live oak, water oak, shumard oak, nut all oak, white oak, pin oak, saw tooth oak and holly oak, bur oak and post oak.Then of course the crosses that are prevalent.

 

[sb47]

You can sometimes get grass to grow under oaks but it's hard to keep it thick enough and you have to water it to the point that the tree will be shallow rooted and that creates a different kind of problem. It's best to just mulch the area directly under the tree and plant flowers or some kind of shrubs. There are many factors as to the soil and other conditions that may help or not.

 

[Flintknapper]

I am a Texas native and I have more then 40 live oaks on my property. St. Augustine will NOT grow under a live oak.

Do as you wish. But St. Augustine WILL grow under a Live Oak. Drive around some and look at other peoples yards. The Live Oak you have is nowhere near large enough to require pruning, nor is it casting enough shade to be the problem. Amerishade St. Augustine will grow just fine (like most other grasses if you take care of it.

Live Oaks soak up a lot of water...so grass needs to be watered around them. Grass needs to have decent soil and should be fertilized from time to time.

If you have 40 Live Oaks with no grass under them, you have the wrong kind of grass or don't know how to take care of it (or won't).

Alternately, you can mulch around the tree or plant ground cover...but grass WILL grow in the area in your photos if you get some decent soil in there, water it and don't cut it too short.

 

[Flintknapper]

Do you have oak wilt in your area?

Yes, Oak Wilt exists in all of Central Texas. It isn't usually a big problem but outbreaks do occur. The most prevalent Oak Tree (by far) in the OP's area is the Live Oak. When they get Oak Wilt it is usually spread though the root system (one tree transmitting it to the next because of overlapping root systems).

 

[Deleted member 117362]

Yes, Oak Wilt exists in all of Central Texas. It isn't usually a big problem but outbreaks do occur. The most prevalent Oak Tree (by far) in the OP's area is the Live Oak. When they get Oak Wilt it is usually spread though the root system (one tree transmitting it to the next because of overlapping root systems).

Here we have mainly Red Oak and oak wilt is a major problem. Many tree services will not touch them until September.

 

[Flintknapper]

I'm sure it exist here since oaks are a common tree all over Texas. I have not seen any signs of it in my 30 years of planting and growing oaks for relocate with a tree spade.
Most common oaks around here are live oak, water oak, shumard oak, nut all oak, white oak, pin oak, saw tooth oak and holly oak, bur oak and post oak.Then of course the crosses that are prevalent.

And then certain Oaks fare better than others with respect to Oak Wilt. For instance White Oaks rarely suffer from Oak Wilt and when they do...it is generally just the tops. Red Oaks on the other hand NEVER survive Oak Wilt. Live Oaks are susceptible but are a pretty hardy tree all in all.

 

[sb47]

Do as you wish. But St. Augustine WILL grow under a Live Oak. Drive around some and look at other peoples yards. The Live Oak you have is nowhere near large enough to require pruning, nor is it casting enough shade to be the problem. Amerishade St. Augustine will grow just fine (like most other grasses if you take care of it.

Live Oaks soak up a lot of water...so grass needs to be watered around them. Grass needs to have decent soil and should be fertilized from time to time.

If you have 40 Live Oaks with no grass under them, you have the wrong kind of grass or don't know how to take care of it (or won't).

Alternately, you can mulch around the tree or plant ground cover...but grass WILL grow in the area in your photos if you get some decent soil in there, water it and don't cut it too short.

I did say it can be done but at a cost. If you keep it watered enough to grow grass you also make the tree shallow rooted and that can lead to the tree being blown over if the ground is very wet and you get some high winds.
Shallow rooted trees also require a lot of watering because there use to lots of water and if you stop or cant water during a drought the tree may die.

 

[sb47]

This is what I'm talking about. Over watering makes the grass grow but also make the tree shallow rooted.

 

[sb47]

Oaks need to stress during dry periods to force the roots to go deeper making them stronger against blow over.

 

[sb47]

I ran a tree spade for 30+ years and I have transplanted thousands of oaks. Some were natural volunteer trees that grew naturally with only rain water, to trees that were grown in a tree farm where the trees were watered till they got about an inch in diameter then the water was cut off, to farms where the trees were grown for production and kept on a drip system all the time. Digging them up with a tree spade let me see how the roots structure was depending on how they were grown. The best and most hardy trees were always the trees that were not watered. The trees that were on drip systems always had very shallow roots and always needed staking to keep them from blowing over.

 

[sb47]

Do as you wish. But St. Augustine WILL grow under a Live Oak. Drive around some and look at other peoples yards. The Live Oak you have is nowhere near large enough to require pruning, nor is it casting enough shade to be the problem. Amerishade St. Augustine will grow just fine (like most other grasses if you take care of it.

Live Oaks soak up a lot of water...so grass needs to be watered around them. Grass needs to have decent soil and should be fertilized from time to time.

If you have 40 Live Oaks with no grass under them, you have the wrong kind of grass or don't know how to take care of it (or won't).

Alternately, you can mulch around the tree or plant ground cover...but grass WILL grow in the area in your photos if you get some decent soil in there, water it and don't cut it too short.

Thats another thing about St Augustine, it can brown out during how dry spells but as soon as the first rain hits, within days the St Augustine will green right back up. Because it's a native grass, it has adapted to the hot dry cycles common down here.

 

[Flintknapper]

I did say it can be done but at a cost. If you keep it watered enough to grow grass you also make the tree shallow rooted and that can lead to the tree being blown over if the ground is very wet and you get some high winds.
Shallow rooted trees also require a lot of watering because there use to lots of water and if you stop or cant water during a drought the tree may die.

Yes, of course Live Oaks are shallow rooted to begin with (as are most Oak Species). The root ball extends outward to compensate for this. But you are correct to advise that TOO much watering over a period of time...encourages the roots to grow toward the surface where the water is more abundant. Tree loss due to storm damage (in the OP's area) is a rare occurrence. Limb damage....yes, the tree actually uprooting..not common at all. This is owing to the soil they grow in, it is both a blessing and an curse.

Anywhere around Austin (to include Round Rock, Georgetown, Pflugerville and Westward) you have soil with a lot of Limestone in it. Anything from various size rocks to formations as big as a house. It is heavy..compacted soil and doesn't pull up easily. The OP looks to live in a fairly recent subdivision, so I would expect the soil there was mightily disturbed during construction and isn't great soil to begin with.

You go East of the OP (Hutto, Taylor, Coupland, Elgin, etc) and the soil is fantastic (traditional farmland out there). But not most places in Round Rock and certainly not Westward toward the Lakes.

Then look at what we try to do with our Lawns and Trees in the quest for that 'perfect' landscape. Oak Trees (in the wild) have and benefit from a ring of Leaf Litter around their base and out toward the drip line. This is GOOD for the Oak for a number of reasons. But this clashes with the wishes of the homeowner who wants thick, green grass growing right up to the trunk. It can be done (and is) but isn't the best thing for the tree.

Oaks are shallow rooted ...we know that. But it is important also to understand that the roots near the surface (first 6"-12") are the most 'active' roots the tree has. So the homeowner would do well to consider the needs of both the tree and anything planted underneath or near it.

If you want grass to grow under the tree...that is possible in the majority of situations, but you must have adequate soil (without smothering the tree roots), appropriate grass for your region and perform careful watering/fertilizing maintenance.

 

[Flintknapper]

I ran a tree spade for 30+ years and I have transplanted thousands of oaks. Some were natural volunteer trees that grew naturally with only rain water, to trees that were grown in a tree farm where the trees were watered till they got about an inch in diameter then the water was cut off, to farms where the trees were grown for production and kept on a drip system all the time. Digging them up with a tree spade let me see how the roots structure was depending on how they were grown. The best and most hardy trees were always the trees that were not watered. The trees that were on drip systems always had very shallow roots and always needed staking to keep them from blowing over.

Interesting line of work. Thanks for your perspective and contributions.