Carbon?.

[46 Poulan]

I did not know cleaning carbon out of my classic saw was such a cotroversal subject.-- David

 

[Brent Nowell]

Well

OMC makes a product for cleaning outboards that’s added to the fuel. I have a gallon but have yet to use it. It is supposed to remove even the most stubborn carbon from a saw jug.

I generally let mine soak in my USC, which is filled with Mean Green overnight. I have small with wheels to remove stubborn stuff from the chamber, and the lathe generally removes all the carbon from the band when I cut it.

This one was caked.

View attachment 751064

can you post a pic of the bottle?
That looks great.

I have tried gunk engine degreaser and even heavy duty gun bore cleaner and it doesn’t seem to work.

 

[lone wolf]

First let’s clear this up ball honing isn’t boring. All it does is clean the surface and put a cross hatch on the cylinder walls. There’s no way I removed the nikasil. I do have a gear driven hone that can bore nikasil, steel and cast iron sleeve cylinders. My early husky saws are industrial chrome plated.

https://www.enginehones.com/niapho.html

Note, I do not run the hone full on, I jog the drill in, then jog it out clockwise, then I jog it in, then jog it out counter clockwise. A quick fast short jog. That’s it for a nice cross hatch. Again do not run the hone full on.

Those are nice ball hones I use them. Note, some are for Nikasil and some Iron. Order appropriately.

 

[lone wolf]

I’ve honed many Nikasil cylinders. It does not ruin them. One has to use some light oil and some common sense.

I use a 3 stone hone and only do it if a jug had extensive amounts of transfer in the bore. I finish it with medium and then fine Scotchbrite.

NEVER use a ball style hone. They will catch the port edges and remove the plating.

Not going to ruin the ports typically it can happen if its already shot and you overdo it.

 

[LegDeLimber]

Where does the chips go when the muffler is cut to modify it? Into the carbon inside the muffler, does anyone wash the muffler out? When running with chips in the muffler where can they go? During the two stroke cycle there is a blow back or scavenge where they could end up in the cylinder.

That's the reason why you see so many threads about going to all the effort of cutting a muffler open.
The guys who charge money and rarely have issues, do it for a good reason.
I can understand a guy gambling on brand new muffler, but not an oily one.

But.
Suit yourselves gents, I was just trying to point out a potential problem that I keep seeing.

Chemical wise? Everything else that I had (that worked and didn't destroy aluminum) has pretty much been taken off the market here.
Anyone remember Gum-out Hydro-seal in the five gallon bucket, from 30 years ago?
So I'll mention soaking the combustion chamber with the Stihl decarboning fluid and then I'll shut up.

 

[blsnelling]

I’ve honed many Nikasil cylinders. It does not ruin them. One has to use some light oil and some common sense.

I use a 3 stone hone and only do it if a jug had extensive amounts of transfer in the bore. I finish it with medium and then fine Scotchbrite.

NEVER use a ball style hone. They will catch the port edges and remove the plating.

Not going to ruin the ports typically it can happen if its already shot and you overdo it.

A ball hone will not ruin a cylinder, including port edges, unless you SERIOUSLY over do it. You almost have to be trying to ruin the cylinder in order for that to happen.

 

[lone wolf]

A ball hone will not ruin a cylinder, including port edges, unless you SERIOUSLY over do it. You almost have to be trying to ruin the cylinder in order for that to happen.

I been using them for 5 years and burned a couple but I suspect they were thin at the starting point.

 

[Huskybill]

While waiting for the crc throttle body cleaner to get here I tried a orange degreaser to soften the carbon so my wire wheel on the Dremel could remove it. I soaked it for 24 hours. It worked.
Throttle body cleaner is probably better but the majic cleaner did soften it. The combustion chamber dome is squeaky clean.
I’m sorry but I’m a perfectionist it has to be perfectly clean, score free, new bearings/seals, rebuilt carb, new gaskets, new airfilter, prefilter, new clutch n drum with 404 rim, nothing is spared. I’m very fussy.

https://www.amazon.com/Citrus-Magic-Cleaner-Degreaser-32-Ounce/dp/B00KVYC1DY

Btw, with the ball hones from enginehone.com I got no ball bounce over ports at all. I tested it on my scrap 2100 test cylinder.(scored) remember to jog the trigger move the hone in, jog it move it out slowly.

 

[Marshy]

I read an article which recommended a brush with embedded silicon carbide to deglaze nikasil cylinders and restore cross hatching. It seemed like the best tool after reading the article. I dont know if it's the same deal for chrome. If what your doing works for you then that's all that matters.

 

[Huskybill]

Again here’s what I’m using. It’s what you use and how we use it. The smaller sized bores some of these hones are the right size bore but feel tight, I ordered the smaller size for the 40 mm bore. I just want the cross hatch. The lines of the cross hatch hold oil in them. So does the horizontal lines in the piston. I use a moly engine assemble lube on the cylinder walls and piston skirt. Plus pre lube the crankbearings, rod bearings and rings with new clean two stroke oil. This is when the most wear occurs on start up. Proper break in lube is very important. Then run your mix ratio a little oil rich. I burnish the moly, paste or antiseeze into the cylinder walls and piston skirt. Then oil the rest up. Run the choke on idle let the crank case get fogged with oil.

https://www.enginehones.com/niapho.html

I been building engines a long time and I’m set in my ways I’ve done time after time. I just have my own way of doing things. I’ve tested moly in every metal to metal Contact application and it hasn’t failed me yet since 1970.

Moly,
Eliminates all wear It gets into the micro pores of the metal and wears against itself.
Reduces friction
Prevents galling
Fights corrosion
Stays where you apply it
Doesn’t attract dirt.

 

[drf255]

A ball hone will not ruin a cylinder, including port edges, unless you SERIOUSLY over do it. You almost have to be trying to ruin the cylinder in order for that to happen.

The tension, which is needed to accomplish anything, will push the balls into a port slightly. This will wear the port edge it’s rotating into. Maybe it won’t be enough to matter, but it will happen.

Will it significantly occur every single time? Of course not. Could it happen to someone at the wrong time and ruin a cylinder made of Unobtainium? Yes it can.

A 3 stone will float over the ports if you get one with long enough stones.

That’s my point. I’ll stick with a 3 stone, plus they are great when the V out at the end of the bore and make a factory edge on the plating to base interface. They also get down in the bore further to the band where as a ball hones natural chamfer will leave an untouched area.

 

[Terrence Jefferson]

A 3 stone will float over the ports if you get one with long enough stones. QUOTE]

My only question is how do you hone a open port cylinder where you only have a small sliver of cylinder wall between ports without a stone blowing up?

 

[drf255]

Cant. Hard with a side opened extension as well.

I dont hone that many jugs.

 

[Mad Professor]

Just leave the carbon there. It will help prevent global warming and make Al Gorebot happy.

 

[Huskybill]

I hammered my scrap cylinder trying to make the ball hone bounce over the port openings as I thought it would but it didn’t.

Theres a scotch bright hone too at enginehones.com I haven’t used it on saw cylinders but we’ve used it in nikasil bike cylinders.