85 Chevy c-30

[JeffHK454]

Thanks! It took quite a bit of hunting to find this guy. I'm going to do a hydraulic dump flatbed with front and rear air suspension over the winter if all goes well.

A stock 4-53t was 185hp/435tq, so nothing terrible to scoff at. It's more than a first gen 5.9 Cummins was! The 4-53t I'm putting in is nothing normal though. It's fully built with a ddec electronic conversion and compound turbos. All parts are spec'ed for 500hp/1000lbft. Tossing on an air starter just for the hell of it too. I have a slowly running build thread over here https://www.greatlakes4x4.com/showthread.php?t=418578&page=2

I figured you weren’t drop’n in no regular Detroit but that’s a badass build!

 

[rarefish383]

You may be right about the Big Block getting the 70. My neighbor has a 82 diesel camper special and it is 14bolt. You would have to ask a GM insider from the 80's to know for sure, but I know that in 88-91 they used a special offset pinion 70HD with a 3.07 gear behind non-overdrive transmission 1 tons. Why they went that route for better fuel numbers instead of using 3.73 (or 3.54, or 3.21) gear 14 bolt behind a NV4500 doesn't make sense to me. On the other end of the scale a 14 bolt only goes to 5.38 gears where the 70 goes down to 7.17 gears. Again don't know that that matters to GM as the lowest gears I have seen from the factory since 1970 are 4.88.

Our 72 C30, 12' bed had the D70, and a 350.

 

[4seasons]

Our 72 C30, 12' bed had the D70, and a 350.

1972? That is the older body style and I was unaware of D70's under GM back then. My Dad had a 65 (completely different body style) GMC 4000 dump truck. It was a man's truck with no power steering or brakes, 305 V6, SM420, large 5 lug bolt circle wheels, and a 10 lug rear. I know it wasn't a 14 bolt, but couldn't tell you if it had the Eaton H072, or a Rockwell.

 

[rarefish383]

We put a Dana 60 in my room mates 65 Cuda, looked just like the truck rear. We also had a 68 C50 dump, that thing was a monster to drive. One of my happiest days working with Dad was when I got home and there was a brand new Ford F600 sitting in the driveway, with power steering and brakes. Of course the C30 had power discs and power steering, and a radio.

 

[sawfun]

I'm going to be swapping my 82 k30 to a 4-53t Detroit diesel this winter, it's a 454 4x4 4spd. If you want the trans, t case, and front shaft, they're absolutely for sale. Truck has 110kmi. It's a cherry I flew to Cali and drove home to MI.

I saw a dually like yours converted to a 4:53 and while it sounded cool, it's owner seriously recommended a 5.9 as they are much lighter and more power. He indicated that the little Detroit was a dog. He really had to beed up the front suspension.

 

[Whitbread]

I saw a dually like yours converted to a 4:53 and while it sounded cool, it's owner seriously recommended a 5.9 as they are much lighter and more power. He indicated that the little Detroit was a dog. He really had to beed up the front suspension.

I'm going 3 link air bag in the front so any suspension work is irrelevant. A 6bt and 4-53t are very similar in weight and power ratings in stock forms. If you've never driven one, a first gen 160hp 6bt is also a dog in stock form. My 4-53 will be ~450whp/900+wtq, it will run just fine with any tuned up 6bt .

 

[sawfun]

I'm going 3 link air bag in the front so any suspension work is irrelevant. A 6bt and 4-53t are very similar in weight and power ratings in stock forms. If you've never driven one, a first gen 160hp 6bt is also a dog in stock form. My 4-53 will be ~450whp/900+wtq, it will run just fine with any tuned up 6bt .

That Detroit must have a giant turbo, or compounds.

 

[4seasons]

I'm going 3 link air bag in the front so any suspension work is irrelevant. A 6bt and 4-53t are very similar in weight and power ratings in stock forms. If you've never driven one, a first gen 160hp 6bt is also a dog in stock form. My 4-53 will be ~450whp/900+wtq, it will run just fine with any tuned up 6bt .

Are you running a bypass on the turbo or is it pushing thru the blower?

That Detroit must have a giant turbo, or compounds.

The 4-53 is in the same engine family as the 6-71 and 8-71 that old hot rodders used the superchargers off of on their drag cars. They are all supercharged with the T version also having a turbo. The 4-53T was used in bigger trucks than the 5.9 Cummins. The 4-53T is only 3.5 liter putting it closer to the 4BT than the 6BT in displacement. But the 4-53T is a 2 stroke so can provide twice the power since it fires twice as many times per rotation.

 

[sawfun]

Are you running a bypass on the turbo or is it pushing thru the blower?

The 4-53 is in the same engine family as the 6-71 and 8-71 that old hot rodders used the superchargers off of on their drag cars. They are all supercharged with the T version also having a turbo. The 4-53T was used in bigger trucks than the 5.9 Cummins. The 4-53T is only 3.5 liter putting it closer to the 4BT than the 6BT in displacement. But the 4-53T is a 2 stroke so can provide twice the power since it fires twice as many times per rotation.

I've seen the 6BT used in 50k garbage trucks. We had 6-71's 8-71's and 6-92T's in our transit busses and the were all dogs compared to the Cummins, when it came to hills. There was an experimental bus with a twin turbo 8-71 That the Old timers said went pretty well. And I knew a trucker with a twin turbo 8-92 that claimed to be able to pull 80k over a!6% grade mountain at 70 mph all day long. Again these were pretty heavily turbo'd engines. Even though turbo'd, I'd like unaltered video of a stock 4-53T pulling harder or beating a stock 6BT in a race, especially involving hills, with both vechicles pulling the same load. I like Jimmy's, especially wound up, but when stock I've been unimpressed with them on hills. I sure do miss their sound though.

 

[066blaster]

I got this 86 1/2 ton 2 wheel drive when i was 16. Not a work truck . parked it 20 years ago. 383 stroker ran and drove perfect when i parked it. original paint

 

[Whitbread]

That Detroit must have a giant turbo, or compounds.

A large set of compounds !

Are you running a bypass on the turbo or is it pushing thru the blower?

I'm running a natural blower with an external bypass. It's going to be a 3" drag style gasser throttle body set to open by a regulator and mini air cylinder at about 20psi of boost. The bypass valve will by mounted on a cnc'ed plate on what's normally the airbox cover plate opposite block side of the blower.

I've seen the 6BT used in 50k garbage trucks. We had 6-71's 8-71's and 6-92T's in our transit busses and the were all dogs compared to the Cummins, when it came to hills. There was an experimental bus with a twin turbo 8-71 That the Old timers said went pretty well. And I knew a trucker with a twin turbo 8-92 that claimed to be able to pull 80k over a!6% grade mountain at 70 mph all day long. Again these were pretty heavily turbo'd engines. Even though turbo'd, I'd like unaltered video of a stock 4-53T pulling harder or beating a stock 6BT in a race, especially involving hills, with both vechicles pulling the same load. I like Jimmy's, especially wound up, but when stock I've been unimpressed with them on hills. I sure do miss their sound though.

Like I said before, stock they're both turds by modern standards. A stock 4-53t from the mid 70s was 185/435tq @ 1500rpm, a first Gen Cummins was only 160/400. Bring both into the modern era with electronics and real turbos, and look how far they went. I'm doing the same with the 4-53; electronic unit injection for variable timing, better cam, modern turbos, etc.


I'll definitely take plenty of videos of my truck when it's all together. I hope to hit it hard this winter on the swap while the shop is being kept warm by all the wood the old 454 lugged this summer .

 

[4seasons]

I've seen the 6BT used in 50k garbage trucks. We had 6-71's 8-71's and 6-92T's in our transit busses and the were all dogs compared to the Cummins, when it came to hills. There was an experimental bus with a twin turbo 8-71 That the Old timers said went pretty well. And I knew a trucker with a twin turbo 8-92 that claimed to be able to pull 80k over a!6% grade mountain at 70 mph all day long. Again these were pretty heavily turbo'd engines. Even though turbo'd, I'd like unaltered video of a stock 4-53T pulling harder or beating a stock 6BT in a race, especially involving hills, with both vechicles pulling the same load. I like Jimmy's, especially wound up, but when stock I've been unimpressed with them on hills. I sure do miss their sound though.

I used to drive a F650 with a 6BT (that's right, Ford knew the PunyJoke couldn't cut it in a medium duty truck) but it was a 26k hydraulic brake truck. I knew they used them in some heavier airbrake trucks also but didn't know they went up to 50k trucks. I don't imagine those trucks were fun to drive fully loaded. I had that F650 up to 40k a couple of times and wasn't sure if it would make a couple of hills coming back.
I know that the 4-53T was used in some 80k applications, but I am sure that they were not fun either. That would be better for a 6-71, 8-71, or 8-92 for sure. The 8-92T was a beast, but that would never fit in a pickup. I only got to drive a couple of these in worn out trucks when I first got my CDL and was not impressed. I liked the later 12.7 liter 60 series better. But for a pickup I would choose the 5.9 L 12V over any other diesel past or present. But I also am no diesel mechanic that can squeeze 500 HP out of a 6 liter engine either. 500 HP out of a gas engine is easy, but it would lack the fuel economy and torque that a diesel could provide.

Like I said before, stock they're both turds by modern standards. A stock 4-53t from the mid 70s was 185/435tq @ 1500rpm, a first Gen Cummins was only 160/400. Bring both into the modern era with electronics and real turbos, and look how far they went. I'm doing the same with the 4-53; electronic unit injection for variable timing, better cam, modern turbos, etc.

Yes they were both dogs in a medium duty truck, but when Dodge put the Cummins in a pickup, they basically started the diesel pickup market. Again I am not a diesel mechanic but couldn't you get you power without electronics? The best thing about the older engines is the simple design that doesn't need a computer to run.

 

[sawfun]

I used to drive a F650 with a 6BT (that's right, Ford knew the PunyJoke couldn't cut it in a medium duty truck) but it was a 26k hydraulic brake truck. I knew they used them in some heavier airbrake trucks also but didn't know they went up to 50k trucks. I don't imagine those trucks were fun to drive fully loaded. I had that F650 up to 40k a couple of times and wasn't sure if it would make a couple of hills coming back.
I know that the 4-53T was used in some 80k applications, but I am sure that they were not fun either. That would be better for a 6-71, 8-71, or 8-92 for sure. The 8-92T was a beast, but that would never fit in a pickup. I only got to drive a couple of these in worn out trucks when I first got my CDL and was not impressed. I liked the later 12.7 liter 60 series better. But for a pickup I would choose the 5.9 L 12V over any other diesel past or present. But I also am no diesel mechanic that can squeeze 500 HP out of a 6 liter engine either. 500 HP out of a gas engine is easy, but it would lack the fuel economy and torque that a diesel could provide.

Yes they were both dogs in a medium duty truck, but when Dodge put the Cummins in a pickup, they basically started the diesel pickup market. Again I am not a diesel mechanic but couldn't you get you power without electronics? The best thing about the older engines is the simple design that doesn't need a computer to run.

Simplicity is why I like my 97 Dodge 12V 5spd. I wish Cat had made the 3116 fuel system as easy to work on as that Cummins. Both get great fuel economy. I'd sure like to see the new diesel pickups have a fuel economy war rather than a horsepower one they currently do. I should think most current factory pickups have all the power you could use for their size.