Help Me Build a Better MS660

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Some tree removal companies might not even use a 660 for 20 hours in a year. But, they need one for an occasional biggie to pull a 36" bar. So, paying $1,200 for a saw that sits on the shelf and rarely gets started seems a bit senseless. Just MHO.

Would a low hour 660 hold its resale value though?
 
Some tree removal companies might not even use a 660 for 20 hours in a year. But, they need one for an occasional biggie to pull a 36" bar. So, paying $1,200 for a saw that sits on the shelf and rarely gets started seems a bit senseless. Just MHO.
I agree. 100%. Even less so for Joe Homeowner.
 
I agree. 100%. Even less so for Joe Homeowner.
Honestly, I dont care about having the more powerful saw, my dad has used his big saw about 3 times in as many years. I have realistic expectations of a chinese knockoff saw and I will probably use mine just as little.

I'm not going to slap Stihl decals on it and try to pass it off as the real thing. It's a project / conversation piece for me. I dont cut trees for a living, I just like chainsaws.

I will probably use this saw more for fun than for need. But if I can get a saw that will run a big bar for $200, then it is worth it to me. Not only will i get familiar with every nut and bolt, but it's still a big saw for very little invested.

However, with that said, if there were bolt ons, or easy mods, such as a top end kit, or power reeds ( or equivalent for piston port) that would make it run better than stock, then why not?
 
If you want your Dad to cry about his 661, buy a 395.

But since you bought a kit 660, dig around on here and elsewhere. Those kits have mountains of issues. Luckily other people have already sorted most of them, so read their threads and you’ll learn a lot.

If you throw it together without doing your homework it won’t last 20 tanks. It may not even go together. But if you figure out what has to be changed you’ll have a big saw for cheap and you’ll know how to work on it.
 
If you want your Dad to cry about his 661, buy a 395.

But since you bought a kit 660, dig around on here and elsewhere. Those kits have mountains of issues. Luckily other people have already sorted most of them, so read their threads and you’ll learn a lot.

If you throw it together without doing your homework it won’t last 20 tanks. It may not even go together. But if you figure out what has to be changed you’ll have a big saw for cheap and you’ll know how to work on it.
I have been doing alot of reading and watching in regards to the saw issues.
 
Nice. It’s fun building the kits. All the pieces are so clean.

I believe the kit comes with a standard bore cylinder but an AM big bore kit with a popup will get you some more snort. Mod the muffler, delete the gasket (get squish around .020), sand out the casting flaws and you’ll have a beastly saw for the occasional rampage.

:chainsaw:
 
So I ordered a set of Caber rings today. What other parts should I order to upgrade this kit. I have decided against going for more power and and aiming more at reliability, unless of course swapping out jugs would give me more power and more reliability for example. I know the earlier kits have been improved upon, and most threads and videos I find on building these are a few years old, but are there other parts that should be upgraded from the start? I saw somebody mentioned the piston and wrist pin / circlips. Has anybody built one as shipped recently that can post experiences with the kit?
 
Some tree removal companies might not even use a 660 for 20 hours in a year. But, they need one for an occasional biggie to pull a 36" bar. So, paying $1,200 for a saw that sits on the shelf and rarely gets started seems a bit senseless. Just MHO.

Not so senseless for companies/businesses as tools are a write off or write down at tax time, I buy whatever strikes my fancy for that reason but for an individual that can`t claim tools against income tax then it is a different situation.
 
Honestly, I dont care about having the more powerful saw, my dad has used his big saw about 3 times in as many years. I have realistic expectations of a chinese knockoff saw and I will probably use mine just as little.

I'm not going to slap Stihl decals on it and try to pass it off as the real thing. It's a project / conversation piece for me. I dont cut trees for a living, I just like chainsaws.

I will probably use this saw more for fun than for need. But if I can get a saw that will run a big bar for $200, then it is worth it to me. Not only will i get familiar with every nut and bolt, but it's still a big saw for very little invested.

However, with that said, if there were bolt ons, or easy mods, such as a top end kit, or power reeds ( or equivalent for piston port) that would make it run better than stock, then why not?


That is 1/2 your budget. B/C

Let us know about trips to Chinesium....
 
Not so senseless for companies/businesses as tools are a write off or write down at tax time, I buy whatever strikes my fancy for that reason but for an individual that can't claim tools against income tax then it is a different situation.
It's a bit senseless for most individuals to itemize income tax deductions anymore and take the time to collect all the receipts and other proofs of expenses to do it. The $12 K standard deduction for individuals and $24 K for married couples now makes that somewhat of a moot point.
 
It's a bit senseless for most individuals to itemize income tax deductions anymore and take the time to collect all the receipts and other proofs of expenses to do it. The $12 K standard deduction for individuals and $24 K for married couples now makes that somewhat of a moot point.

Agree, for individuals but for us who make money with our tools $1,200 is a drop in the bucket, as for chainsaws a couple new ones each year is common. Just chalk them up to the cost of doing business.
 
The OP stated he is not a professional so the dispute over production use isn’t an issue for him.

Having worked on a few “Blue Thunder” saws and other FT kit saws, I speak strongly against them even for occasional production use. They break faster than they can be fixed and when the labor involved in repairs costs, tree guys lose money instead of save it. There’s not much sense in replacing a crankshaft or case on a $320 saw when the labor will be in the $200 range. Sadly cases, cranks and cylinders often go on these saws in the first 50 tanks. The manufacturing standards just aren’t high enough for a 300 piece machine.

It seems like the OP gets that. I wish more start up tree guys did.

Other parts that should be replaced even for occasional use: Clutch springs, cylinder bolts, tank vent, de-comp, caps, muffler/gasket, chain tensioner, spark plug, and cir-clips. Probably more I’m forgetting.

I also strongly recomend using a liquid gasket to seal the cylinder, having threading taps and helicoils on hand and running the saw at 32-1.
 
... I have decided against going for more power and and aiming more at reliability...

I would agree with that, ask yourself what is really the critical parts of this saw.

Crankcase bearings (oil seals) and needle cages are not too expensive OEM parts, other parts that may be interesting in the "long" run is such as chain adjuster crown gears, guide bar studs and clutch springs.
Other than that you will know what parts that don't hold up after some extensive use.

When you have assembled the crankcase check that the crank axle don't wobble at the clutch side when turning it, if it does - find a better crank axle.
An OEM one is probably seriously expensive but it might still be worth it depending on how much you put in to the saw, I would consider the crank axle the most significant and important part of the whole saw.

Hyway have lots of parts too and though they are eastern made as well - they are designed and produced within the brand name, that should also indicate some sort of quality control and prestige as well in contrary to the Chinese parts that looks more like a collaboration and distribution of all sorts of parts coming from all sorts of factories with virtually no quality control.
 
About if it would be preferably to buy a used saw as a project - definitely !

But I have followed the national marked for a while now and only on a very rare occasion "one" of the bigger saws (70ccm+) is on sale and the very few times I have seen one the seller seems to put some sort of "this is a true Stihl therefore it's a jewel worth about the same thing or more than a new saw" kinda price tag on it.
I'm not going to buy a used and out of date 460 when I can just put in a few cents more and get a new 462, some people just don't seem to understand that. If I could get a used saw that would be a good starting point really cheap that would be great but it didn't happen to me.
 
You guys are motivating me to actually build this into a reliable saw, let's hope my patience holds out. I am just curious if there is a common failure with these, or if the failures are all over the place, which it sounds like. By upgrading the p/c, do many of the issues go away? I am not too concerned about the parts that can easily be replaced as they break, like the pull starter or chain adjuster. I'm more concerned with internal failure points.

I have also read about using a Dremel and putting a groove around the base of the cylinder to hold sealant. I know most recommend against using the gasket, but I am unsure why. I have access to a full machine shop, what are the thoughts on the groove, what about taking it one step further and adding an o-ring groove and putting an o-ring in place instead of sealant?
 
I have also read about using a Dremel and putting a groove around the base of the cylinder to hold sealant. I know most recommend against using the gasket, but I am unsure why. I have access to a full machine shop, what are the thoughts on the groove, what about taking it one step further and adding an o-ring groove and putting an o-ring in place instead of sealant?
dont do that. and dont let all the negative nellies talk you out of what you wanna do. lots of people out there getting lots and lots of use out of these. yeah they have weak points. the oem wrist pin bearing is an absolute must, as are oem circlips. caber rings are a good idea.
 
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