Homelite Chainsaws

[Maintenance supervisor]

Y

Some of the early black caps that looked sort of like a ships wheel as opposed to hexagonal used a metal tank vent that was upper left in operator position in the tank and had a mating hole to breathe in the carb box.
I don't have any XL-12's so I can't be sure if that's what you have.
The old Homelite duckbills were black if you're on a goo lookout in the cap.

Yes looks like a ship wheel with a metal tube inside, goo color black.

 

[fossil]

The duckbill valve goes under the tube. Carefully pull the tube out using pliers, clean all the goo out making sure the vent hole in the cap is clear. New duckbill in, flange against the cap and tap the metal tube back in so it seats against the valve.
I believe either a Homelite or Poulan valve works in those. Nice simple design.

When you look at the Stihl and Husky designs compared to that you have to wonder what they were thinking.

 

[Maintenance supervisor]

Is this super XL-12 boiling gas or is there a leak? I was running it hard and its got a new duckbill in the cap.

 

[Maintenance supervisor]

Is this super XL-12 boiling gas or is there a leak?View attachment 757548 View attachment 757550 I was running it hard and its got a new duckbill in the cap.

That sound in the video is my shop fan running, the saw was off and resting on a board.

 

[Maintenance supervisor]

This was the blue XL-12 yesterday

 

[rarefish383]

Is this super XL-12 boiling gas or is there a leak?View attachment 757548 View attachment 757550 I was running it hard and its got a new duckbill in the cap.

I'm going to go check my XL12's. I don't remember any of them having stack mufflers?

 

[PogoInTheWoods]

Are the tanks venting in the right direction? The duckbill end of the valve needs to be pointing toward the fuel tank to allow air in, not the other way around. But I have heard of them boiling fuel, too. I've never seen it myself.

 

[Maintenance supervisor]

Are the tanks venting in the right direction? The duckbill end of the valve needs to be pointing toward the fuel tank to allow air in, not the other way around. But I have heard of them boiling fuel, too. I've never seen it myself.

Well the blue one is just venting, but I correctly installed a homelite duckbill in the red super XL-12 .
It is like 90° degrees here but for both saws to do this doesn't make sense.
I only use ethanol free gas with a stabilizer, and Stihl ultra.

 

[Maintenance supervisor]

I'm going to go check my XL12's. I don't remember any of them having stack mufflers?

All of mine do, one I installed.

 

[Maintenance supervisor]

I could be wrong, but all of the old UXL ones I've got started as 0.050". The inside rails are worn, likely accelerated when not fed a steady drink from the manual only pumps. Folks just threw 0.058", then perhaps 0.063" when things got really sloppy.

One thing for certain is that old Windsor steel, and in particular, the hard nose tips, was some hard stuff. Near impossible to close up the rails in a vice and equally hard on files if you true them up.

One could be slop , but the others are marked/stamped .63.

 

[fossil]

They will boil fuel. One thing that causes that is a build up of saw cake between the fuel tank and the crankcase

It's easiest to clean out by removing the flywheel and digging / blowing it out. Go from the clutch side as well. Some had a piece of nitrile cord on the clucth side to block that area off.

Saying that, a lot of the older saws boiled fuel and some had carb vapour lock issues due to heat transfer from the cylinder. That's why the carb adapters were changed to plastic and eventually changed to a rubber boot.

I've heard, but don't know for sure, that MACs and Homelites were the ones that are commonly mentioned.

Keeping them free of crud helps a lot.

Poge is correct in pointing to the tank vent as you want some pressure in there to help raise the boiling point of the fuel.

Gasoline can boil boil at around 100 deg F and up to high temps depending upon what's in the blend.

Yamaha 660 Grizzly's were known for that. They moved the tank away from the engine to fix it.

 

[Maintenance supervisor]

They will boil fuel. One thing that causes that is a build up of saw cake between the fuel tank and the crankcase

It's easiest to clean out by removing the flywheel and digging / blowing it out. Go from the clutch side as well. Some had a piece of nitrile cord on the clucth side to block that area off.

Saying that, a lot of the older saws boiled fuel and some had carb vapour lock issues due to heat transfer from the cylinder. That's why the carb adapters were changed to plastic and eventually changed to a rubber boot.

I've heard, but don't know for sure, that MACs and Homelites were the ones that are commonly mentioned.

Keeping them free of crud helps a lot.

Poge is correct in pointing to the tank vent as you want some pressure in there to help raise the boiling point of the fuel.

Gasoline can boil boil at around 100 deg F and up to high temps depending upon what's in the blend.

Yamaha 660 Grizzly's were known for that. They moved the tank away from the engine to fix it.

It being almost 100° probably didn't help, but both saws have been cleaned, 1 very throughly.
My concern was that crank case pressure could or was escaping into the gas tank. I suppose if that was happening I would have a flooded saw or see fuel out the muffler.

 

[Hoggwood]

They will boil when the vapor pressure is reduced quickly, such as when cracking the fuel cap. If you quickly remove the cap and see a sudden increase in bubbling, your duckbill and cap gasket are likely working properly. To add, winter blend fuels are notorious for boiling at lower pressures and can cause problems if you get an abnormally warm day in the middle of winter and on the shoulder season when stations are changing to summer blend. Vapor lock and flooding are problematic on some of my saws when I am cutting on warmer spring days and running winter fuel. If it is a hot summer day and I am making long cuts, I get boiling in my 9xx and 1xx saws. As mentioned, clean cylinder fins really help. Keeping your fuel jug in the shade or even in a cooler with ice, can alleviate symptoms if you can use up the fuel quickly in the saw when refuelling - before heat gets a chance to raise the temp significantly (funny as it sounds). I've kept some 2 L pop bottles of mix on "the rocks" for the scorchers.

If you see bubbles streaming up from the filter, there can be an issue with heat transfer to the carb. That can make it difficult to restart and present other symptoms.

 

[fossil]

It being almost 100° probably didn't help, but both saws have been cleaned, 1 very throughly.
My concern was that crank case pressure could or was escaping into the gas tank. I suppose if that was happening I would have a flooded saw or see fuel out the muffler.

No worries on an XL-12 as the tank is completely separate from the crankcase.

 

[Hoggwood]

My redneck valve stem puller...

1. 10-32 tap into stem
2. Fender washer over the stem
3. Claw end of hammer between washer (to protect the cap) and vice
4. Lever the cap off of the assembly.

 

[rarefish383]

They will boil fuel. One thing that causes that is a build up of saw cake between the fuel tank and the crankcase



I've heard, but don't know for sure, that MACs and Homelites were the ones that are commonly mentioned

Dad switched from Macs to Homelites in the late 60's because his big Macs were known to vapor lock daily. They kept several big saws on the truck and when one would lock, they would set it in the shade and grab another one. His saw shop recommended switching to the new Homelites because they didn't have the problem. Who knows, if he had of stayed with the Macs, they may have resolved the problem around the same time. I started working with Dad full time in 72 and I don't remember ever having a vapor lock problem with that generation of Homelites. I do remember the guys calling the old Macs that we had on the trucks, go/go saws. One minute they would go like hell, and the next minute they could go to hell. To be honest, every time I get a new/old saw and get it running, I'll use it to death for a couple days, till the novelty wears off, and never have vapor lock problems. Then it goes on the shelf and sits till I have to spend a day getting it running again. I've been thinking about getting some truefuel to put in saws when they go back on the shelf. Dump the mix out of them, put in some trufuel and run them long enough to clear the lines and carb, then put them up.

 

[rarefish383]

I tried to delete part of the quote above and it added my reply to the quote. You have to click on expand to see what I said, sorry.

 

[Maintenance supervisor]

One thing I did do recently was the current fuel mix doesn't have octane boost in it just regular unleaded 87. That might be contributing to the problem considering that the saws were developed when low octane was in the 90s.

 

[ML12]

They will boil fuel. One thing that causes that is a build up of saw cake between the fuel tank and the crankcase

It's easiest to clean out by removing the flywheel and digging / blowing it out. Go from the clutch side as well. Some had a piece of nitrile cord on the clucth side to block that area off.

Saying that, a lot of the older saws boiled fuel and some had carb vapour lock issues due to heat transfer from the cylinder. That's why the carb adapters were changed to plastic and eventually changed to a rubber boot.

I've heard, but don't know for sure, that MACs and Homelites were the ones that are commonly mentioned.

Keeping them free of crud helps a lot.

Poge is correct in pointing to the tank vent as you want some pressure in there to help raise the boiling point of the fuel.

Gasoline can boil boil at around 100 deg F and up to high temps depending upon what's in the blend.

Yamaha 660 Grizzly's were known for that. They moved the tank away from the engine to fix it.

So far I've only boiled the fuel in 2 saws, a Mac 795 that I was milling with and my pioneer p50. Both times it happened it was 30C+ outside. Other than that I've never had an issue. The pioneer kept running no issues, it was just weird to see the rolling boil in the tank when refilling. The mac would vapour lock, so just set it down for a bit, then restart and keep going.

 

[rarefish383]

Is this super XL-12 boiling gas or is there a leak?View attachment 757548 View attachment 757550 I was running it hard and its got a new duckbill in the cap.

Well, pulled my Blue and White XL12 off the shelf and it has a stack muffler on it. Then went out to the shed and looked at my Red Super XL Automatic and it has the 3 bolt can muffler. All I remember is the 3 bolt can mufflers, but as a late teens and early 20's guy, what kind of muffler my XL12 had on it didn't rate high on my care meter. I do remember pulling any baffles and spark arrestors out of them to squeek every last bit of power out of them, and you couldn't do that with a stack.