Tires for a dually.

[SamT1]

So I bought a dually pickup dump truck. It isn’t 4 wheel drive. Currently has singles on the back. It goes pretty good with these big single 33x12.5 16.5 mud grips on the back. But I’m gonna haul loads over their capacity, and they are old anyway. I have a set of 17” dually wheels off a dodge that should fit right up. I’ve not had a non 4x4 vehicle in years! I cut in mixed terrain. Sand, black dirt, hills, everything. I need to set myself up for success here with the right tires. Tire life isn’t an issue (likely they will ruin from age before miles) highway manners at speed isn’t an issue (it’s slow 351 gas) noise isn’t an issue (I’m half deaf) price is an issue (don’t want to blow money)

So I mostly cut in the sand when it’s wet and black dirt when it’s dry. But the county roads to the wood patch are generally deep sand. Usually horrible days are when I have the most time to work so we work in rain, mud, ice. I’m thinking about some iron man MT in a 285-70. I think that’s as wide as won’t rub together with a load and as tall as I’d want for power reasons. Probably put something the same size width in whatever highway tread I find used on the front for flotation. Motor is light up front since it’s small gas. So it has that going for it and I believe a locker in the rear.
Does that sound right or should I be looking at all terrain tires so it won’t “spin down”

 

[Ted Jenkins]

Bad thinking all the way around from my experience. If you are running 16.5 you might be running a Ford. If you have 17'' wheels throw them in the metal pile as they are not good for any thing. Good tires do not come in 17'' or 70's as they are made for your mom's SUV. A set of four 16'' wheels should be easy to come by from the wrecking yard and cheap. Nothing wrong with used tires either other then they should some what match each other. 265x16 is good. 285's have no value. You need to be able to apply chains to the outside duel easy when necessary so 265x16 is likely as big as you can go. 235x75 are great tires and easy to find. E rated tires are essential. Four 235's will give you up to 20,000 lbs rear capacity. The 265's 16 will be about the same capacity, but a little more pricey. Forget about anything 16.5 because they are dangerous as they do not have a safety bead. I use 16.5 some times with an extra watch at the pressure and spares. 235 and 265 are the same tire with a little change in profile. For safety you need four on the rear as was your truck designed for. With my dump truck I have put the chains on and off for years with no issues ever remember they have nothing to do with snow or ice but for added traction. You will do as you want good luck. If you need addresses of good wrecking yard near you you can contact me. I have always been able to find high tread tires for a $2oo or less. The tire I have mentioned are often rated for more than double the load of a 285. Thanks

 

[SamT1]

Yea I think you and me are worlds apart.

 

[4seasons]

17's aren't junk for sure. Most new trucks are running bigger rims than that. It is even getting harder to find used 16's. But I do agree on tossing the 16.5's.
Without 4wd you definitely need a locker, not just a posi, if you need to get thru the mud and sand. I am a firm believer in mud tires for any terrain other than pavement. The wider and more aggressive the better but of course with duals you can get too wide. Ted does bring up a good point with chains. Chains give you a tremendous advantage off road even if your tires are slick. You could run highway treads or all terrains right up to the mud and put the chains on before you get stuck.
If you are not concerned with ride and noise bias ply tires carry more weight, but they do have a reputation for digging a grave in a skinny mud configuration. They may also be hard to find especially used for a 17 inch wheel. If you go for new radials I have been running Kenda Kleavers on my truck for the last couple of years. I like mine pretty well although mine are in the highway tread rather than mud or all terrains.

 

[Ted Jenkins]

Yea I think you and me are worlds apart.

I thought so. Just from my experience. Thanks

 

[sb47]

I drove a R noddle Mack for decades with a tree spade on it so I was off road 50% of the time in all kinds of weather and conditions except for ice. Bosses had us run lots of different tires over the years and mud tires always worked best, lasted longer and had less flats.
Street tread is not what you need for any kind of off road use. First thing is they don't have any traction if the ground is the slightest bit wet, and they are subject of lots of flats.
All terrain tire are much better and are a compromise between street and off road.
Mud tires are the best for off road and still work well on the street, though they are a bit noisy.
You will have less flats with mud tires.
Tires come with a load rating and thats what you need to look at.
The amount of ply's on the tread and even more important are how many ply's the sidewalls have.
I always go one or two rating's over the expected max load.

The next most important thing is tread life. High vs low millage tires are completely different in how they preform, not just how long they will last.
All tires have a life span no mater what they are made of, about 5/6 years till they start becoming risky no mater how much tread they have left.
High millage tires are made of a harder compound and thats what makes the tread last longer. Some with low millage tires, there made of a softer compound that wears faster. Both come with triad off's. A high millage tire is a harder compound but the don't have as much grip, where a low millage tire wear faster but have much greater grip. On hot dry roads a high millage tire works just fine for grip, but when it turns cold and or wet a high millage tire falls short with very little grip no mater how much tread they have.

You need to calculate the amount of miles you plan on driving in the next 5 to 6 years when the tires are gonna start aging out.
Highway miles put a lot of heat on a tire and that heat cycles up and down thousands of times as you drive. That chemically changes the rubber over time and tends to make rubber harder.
Match the expected millage with a tire so that millage and age mature at the same time.
Also make sure you check the D.O.T. date stamped on the tire. You want tires that are no more then six months old. Some tires sit in a wheelhouse for several years so they will age out in about 4 years because they will actually be 6 years old even though they were new when you bought them.


Tires are your life. It's the only thing that gives you traction and thats what gives you control between the truck/car and the road.
Next to breaks, tires are right up there with one of the most important part on any car or truck.

Heat is the biggest killer of tires.

If you only expect to put 20K on in 6 years, no sense in buying 70K millage tires because they will not grip as good and they will age out before they wear out.

I have literally seen tires explode after a truck has sat for 30 min after coming off the road and just sitting parked in a parking lot, while eating lunch.

If they are for farm/ranch work and will see little highway use some of this may not apply. But if you are running paved roads with over 30 mph speeds then public safety is more important.

Dirt and gravel roads tend to be slower speeds and tires can last longer but age will still get you.
Also a softer tread will still give better traction even on dirt.

 

[4seasons]

A high millage tire is a harder compound but the don't have as much grip, where a low millage tire wear faster but have much greater grip. On hot dry roads a high millage tire works just fine for grip, but when it turns cold and or wet a high millage tire falls short with very little grip no mater how much tread they have.
If you only expect to put 20K on in 6 years, no sense in buying 70K millage tires because they will not grip as good and they will age out before they wear out.

Great point by sb47 above.
To expand on it just a bit, different manufacturers use different rubber compounds even though the mileage rating may be the same. Some compounds age better than others. Michelin tires age horrible. Lots of companies run them on their small trucks because of the long tread life, but if you aren't putting at least 20k miles a year on your vehicle, don't waste your money on Michelin tires. They will dry rot in as little as 3 years, and I have never seen a set over 6 years old not falling apart. I had a set of Big O tires that outlasted 3 trucks that saw very little mileage but all severe weather and off road use. I ran them from 1996 thru 2005 before I parked the truck and the tires rotted off.
Bias ply tires in general hold up to dry rot better. I have ran some Super Swampers that had a good bit of dry rot showing at highway speeds for a year without trouble. I don't recommend it but unless you have a good load to heat the tire up a bias ply will still hold up after you start seeing some cracking.

 

[sb47]

Great point by sb47 above.
To expand on it just a bit, different manufacturers use different rubber compounds even though the mileage rating may be the same. Some compounds age better than others. Michelin tires age horrible. Lots of companies run them on their small trucks because of the long tread life, but if you aren't putting at least 20k miles a year on your vehicle, don't waste your money on Michelin tires. They will dry rot in as little as 3 years, and I have never seen a set over 6 years old not falling apart. I had a set of Big O tires that outlasted 3 trucks that saw very little mileage but all severe weather and off road use. I ran them from 1996 thru 2005 before I parked the truck and the tires rotted off.
Bias ply tires in general hold up to dry rot better. I have ran some Super Swampers that had a good bit of dry rot showing at highway speeds for a year without trouble. I don't recommend it but unless you have a good load to heat the tire up a bias ply will still hold up after you start seeing some cracking.

Yep! You don't see NASCAR running high millage tires. They even run different compounds on all four tires because they don't all see the same load or wear equally.

 

[SamT1]

Yea I’m having trouble with the tires on my pickup now because they are 5 years old. 3/4 tread and separating.

I love bias ply trailer tires. Anything else isn’t worth me touching.
I don’t think the bias pickup tires can get descent traction though.

We’re talking 5k miles a year max for now. My thinking is a super aggressive mud tire that’s about half to 1/3 tread and a year old would be awesome for me to find.
All the tires currently on the truck are way too old. It was a seed wheat wagon so I’d bet the tires are 10 years old at a minimum.

 

[sb47]

Yea I’m having trouble with the tires on my pickup now because they are 5 years old. 3/4 tread and separating.

I love bias ply trailer tires. Anything else isn’t worth me touching.
I don’t think the bias pickup tires can get descent traction though.

We’re talking 5k miles a year max for now. My thinking is a super aggressive mud tire that’s about half to 1/3 tread and a year old would be awesome for me to find.
All the tires currently on the truck are way too old. It was a seed wheat wagon so I’d bet the tires are 10 years old at a minimum.

If you buy used tires make sure to check the DOT date stamped on the side so you don't end up replacing old tires with another set of old tires.

 

[SamT1]

If you buy used tires make sure to check the DOT date stamped on the side so you don't end up replacing old tires with another set of old tires.

For sure. I have a friend that’s a trader. He is looking for some but if he doesn’t find them quick I’m gonna have to buy a set. He gets tires off oilfield guys who run them until they don’t look sweet anymore and get new ones. But everything now days is 18” rim. He has some 35x12.5-17 toyo MT’s for $100 that were half tread and 2 years old. But I think they are too big. I have some spacers I could run but I’m not a spacer fan and I think the 35 is too tall for my big ole 250 hp if that motor.

 

[ChoppyChoppy]

We have tires on the log truck from the 1970s, so no I don't believe this "5 year" rule.
I've run tons of stuff with 20+ year old tires.

 

[Ted Jenkins]

17's aren't junk for sure. Most new trucks are running bigger rims than that. It is even getting harder to find used 16's. But I do agree on tossing the 16.5's.

You are going to find it difficult to find anything but C and D's in a 17'' rim because they were made for your mom's SUV. E's and F's are built for heavy use and they ride like a truck but less likely to fail under load. Thanks

 

[sb47]

We have tires on the log truck from the 1970s, so no I don't believe this "5 year" rule.
I've run tons of stuff with 20+ year old tires.

I to have run tires from the 1970's, but that was in the 1970's, not 50 years later. I have a hard time believing you run 50 year old tires on the street.
I have a Kabota tractor with the original tires from the mid 80's but that is completely different. Top speed is all of 10 mph

 

[SamT1]

You are going to find it difficult to find anything but C and D's in a 17'' rim because they were made for your mom's SUV. E's and F's are built for heavy use and they ride like a truck but less likely to fail under load. Thanks

Dude every 1 ton pickup built since like 1998 comes with 17 or 18” wheels. I can’t even find descent used 16’s for trailers anymore around here. The 18” dished wheels I have came off a 2006 dodge dually we converted to single wheel when the bed got damaged.

 

[SamT1]

We have tires on the log truck from the 1970s, so no I don't believe this "5 year" rule.
I've run tons of stuff with 20+ year old tires.

I think your better off with 20 year old tires than 6-7 year old tires these days. I have a couple trailers with 20 year old bias ply tires that are still great. I run 80 at like 80% of their load rating regularly. Not so much for any tires bought in the last 10 years. I’m really having issues with trailers these days. “Trailer tires” age horribly these days. New bias ply trailer tires are expensive, but has anyone tried them? I’ve been buying old bias tires from shops where people scared of them take em off.

 

[4seasons]

You are going to find it difficult to find anything but C and D's in a 17'' rim because they were made for your mom's SUV. E's and F's are built for heavy use and they ride like a truck but less likely to fail under load. Thanks

,
Just a quick search on Tirerack shows 42 different load range E tires in 235/80R17. I wouldn't call that hard to find. In the local used tire shops in my area you can't find 13's, 14's are rare, 15's are snatched up before they hit the rack, 16's are there but you are lucky to find a set of 4. 17, 18 and 20 inch tires are very common and available in E load in any of the 3 shops I have bought used tires from.

 

[ChoppyChoppy]

I to have run tires from the 1970's, but that was in the 1970's, not 50 years later. I have a hard time believing you run 50 year old tires on the street.
I have a Kabota tractor with the original tires from the mid 80's but that is completely different. Top speed is all of 10 mph

Why would I say that the log truck has tires from the 70s if it wasn't true? I've got much better things to do than lie about age of tires.
We had a 1950s 25 ton lowboy with 60s-70s era tires as well. Sold it this summer.

 

[Ted Jenkins]

,
Just a quick search on Tirerack shows 42 different load range E tires in 235/80R17. I wouldn't call that hard to find. In the local used tire shops in my area you can't find 13's, 14's are rare, 15's are snatched up before they hit the rack, 16's are there but you are lucky to find a set of 4. 17, 18 and 20 inch tires are very common and available in E load in any of the 3 shops I have bought used tires from.

If you or any one else can find E's or above in any size then for go for it. Last summer was very disappointed with available LT tires for my trucks. Dealers were not interested in any special orders. 17'' rims were the hardest to find tires for. I realize they are standard on many newer trucks, but for most part have only seen C's which is not acceptable. As time goes on there will likely be more different sizes available, but for now not so much. Thanks

 

[Huskybill]

Off road the super swampers are hard to beat.


I built a 76 Chevy c30 one ton rack body into a 4x4.

I tried the 2wd first with a Detroit locker in the 11,000 lb rear Dana. Not good off road. I found the drive train to convert it to 4x4. It had the 8” wrecker frame. Plus the width for the frame rails was the same. With two lockers in the diffs and six super swappers she went anywhere off road,

The k30 4x4 wasn’t made till 77 at the cost of $25 k. I was out of work doing firewood and built this 76 c30 to 4x4 for under 10 k