The part number of your flywheel and the 051 serial is the what matters if you're checking for compatibility.
050 051 075 076 Info Thread
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When you mention the serial, do you do so, because the flywheel variants have an effect due to a few different things if I remember. One being the Ignition setup, and is a second one, the oiler type? Anything else?
The type of recoil is a major consideration as there were two distinct recoil designs with corresponding flywheels. The only other considerations are ignition components and crankshaft compatibility. Ignition components can usually be accommodated. Cranks can't..., at least on any practical level.
And as I think about it, I need to double check my symbols to see if the -> pointing to a serial number means "up until" or "beginning with". Big difference!
And as I think about it, I need to double check my symbols to see if the -> pointing to a serial number means "up until" or "beginning with". Big difference!
Download all that stuff from the link I posted and start comparing part numbers among all the variants of all the saws in question and see what'll interchange..., which is most of the parts depending on production runs of units sharing the same designs which are specified by the serial numbers. Start writing down numbers and comparing which serial number ranges they cover. Some parts overlap serial numbers and require a physical identification to determine "either, or".
And as far as I can figure, the -> symbol means "beginning with" and the ->| symbol means "until" or "ends with". An asterisk (*) generally indicates 'previous models'.
So refresh my memory as to what is hoped to be accomplished here. Reviving a points 051 with a damaged flywheel using a flywheel from a points 075?
And as far as I can figure, the -> symbol means "beginning with" and the ->| symbol means "until" or "ends with". An asterisk (*) generally indicates 'previous models'.
So refresh my memory as to what is hoped to be accomplished here. Reviving a points 051 with a damaged flywheel using a flywheel from a points 075?
I reviewed a little. LOL
And it makes perfect sense since the 050/051 and 075/076 are all the same 1111 series saws.
In a nutshell, if we're trying to determine if a 1201 flywheel from an 075/076 will work on a given 051 (which we already know at one time during its production also used a 1201 flywheel), we first need to determine if the flywheel is compatible with the 051 crankshaft. We start comparing crankshaft part numbers between the two saws to figure that out knowing 1111 series saws shared the same crankshafts during much of their production. Next is to determine the compatibility of the existing 051 ignition components with the new flywheel or the availability of compatible components if different components are required to utilize the 075/76 flywheel. Again, we compare part numbers between the two saws and utilize serial number ranges (if available) to narrow it down if there's any question. The next consideration is the recoil compatibility as there are two different types that do not interchange. Illustrations in the IPL's will provide that answer.
It will just take some time to cross ref the IPL's to see what works with what, but those are the main considerations if you want to know for sure it will work vs. just throwing the 1201 at the 051 on a trial and error basis.
And it makes perfect sense since the 050/051 and 075/076 are all the same 1111 series saws.
In a nutshell, if we're trying to determine if a 1201 flywheel from an 075/076 will work on a given 051 (which we already know at one time during its production also used a 1201 flywheel), we first need to determine if the flywheel is compatible with the 051 crankshaft. We start comparing crankshaft part numbers between the two saws to figure that out knowing 1111 series saws shared the same crankshafts during much of their production. Next is to determine the compatibility of the existing 051 ignition components with the new flywheel or the availability of compatible components if different components are required to utilize the 075/76 flywheel. Again, we compare part numbers between the two saws and utilize serial number ranges (if available) to narrow it down if there's any question. The next consideration is the recoil compatibility as there are two different types that do not interchange. Illustrations in the IPL's will provide that answer.
It will just take some time to cross ref the IPL's to see what works with what, but those are the main considerations if you want to know for sure it will work vs. just throwing the 1201 at the 051 on a trial and error basis.
Thanks once again Pogo. If I remember right, the recoil types are a smooth cylindrical and the other is a multi indented star type. The best thing I can do for this line of discussion is to add pics which I can do Sunday.
One more thing that occasionally comes in handy in situations like this is to Google the part numbers in question to see what pops up on ebay or other sources which may help identify compatible applications or useful pics of the part in question. Not saying that's a dependable way of parts identification and application by any stretch of the imagination, but it is a another tool in the box when researching this stuff. Some sources provide very detailed and accurate info about parts compatibility and others don't have a clue. Doesn't take long to figure out which is which.
And to answer a previous question...
That's a high squish number. You could shave the cylinder base for a tighter squish but the port timing numbers would then also be changed. To what extent good or bad would need to be determined by projecting the before and after numbers using a degree wheel. That would help determine if the gain in compression be reducing the squish would be worth the effort or if the change in port timing would defeat the purpose.
And to answer a previous question...
That's a high squish number. You could shave the cylinder base for a tighter squish but the port timing numbers would then also be changed. To what extent good or bad would need to be determined by projecting the before and after numbers using a degree wheel. That would help determine if the gain in compression be reducing the squish would be worth the effort or if the change in port timing would defeat the purpose.
Pogo, Last year as I was researching all things SAW tech, tune related I came across some very good degree wheel videos. I am on a different laptop than the one I used then, so I will have to hunt and see if I can find where they were.
I just reviewed the pic of the flywheel from your saw and you're right. It uses the cup style starter design as does the 1201 flywheel so that's covered as you have already determined.
Here's one with a well worn starter cup for comparison. Now to investigate the crank...
Searching 'degree wheel' or 'port timing' here will turn up a ton of good info. Good to have one just for occasional ignition/timing troubleshooting if nothing else.
Now about those cranks...,
Curiosity has the best of me at this point. LOL
Now about those cranks...,
Curiosity has the best of me at this point. LOL
Pogo, I got my 051 flywheel off and the wheels are definitely different due to one MAIN reason I see so far. Ignitions are points and the 075 are not. Looks like I lucked out and got one of each when I bought them off ebay last year. That is if I don't decide to make the 051 a Solid State unit as well.
SO, My 051 has the flywheel with the step up tiered backside Part number 1 216 610 026
My 075 w/ Solid State has the flat backed 1 216 610 045 MTZ flywheel. Pics to follow.
SO, My 051 has the flywheel with the step up tiered backside Part number 1 216 610 026
My 075 w/ Solid State has the flat backed 1 216 610 045 MTZ flywheel. Pics to follow.
Pog, I didn't know any of these had that screen on them until I saw a pic of just a screen on ebay. Neither of mine have this.
OK finally loaded some pics from Phone to laptop. 075 Flywheel
075 Saw Serial051 Flywheel Serial
051 Ignition
Pogo, I found a little info on the question I asked you in PM. Anyone correct me if I am wrong, 1972 saw the first of these.
The 050 was the first of the 1111 series and was introduced in January of 1969 with serial number 1 159 500. All other 1111 saws were numbered in succession thereafter by whatever system Stihl utilized among the models to identify the units and keep track of design changes during the production run of the series all the way up to the last 076 Super. That's how the serial number references in the ipl's and shop manuals work. They apply to all saws in the series, not just to the individual models. There are no date codes in the serial numbers that anyone has ever been able to confirm..., at least that I'm aware of. The earliest 075 IPL I have is dated 1974.
And yes, turns out the 075's/076's didn't have a points ignition version in favor of a trigger unit based system. That said, there were some that still used the windowed 1111-404-1202 flywheel for a time..., presumably to deplete inventory. That flywheel was discontinued and replaced by the same flywheel without the adjustment windows and used the same 1111-404-1202 part number just to keep the change crystal clear to everyone. LOL The curiosity there is what the difference is between the 1201 and 1202 flywheels since they both had points adjustment windows because the points cam itself is on the flywheel shaft hub instead of on the crank -- which required the flywheel to already be installed to set the points. Brilliant! The 1202 flywheel is also 1111 404 1202 instead of 1111 400 like the other flywheels for whatever reason.
Otherwise, there appear to have been three cranks used in the 1111 series with only the first version used in earlier 050's not being compatible with all the later flywheels beginning with the 1111-030-0401 crank and 1111-400-1201 flywheel. Later changes to the crank which resulted in the 1111-030-0402 part number didn't affect flywheel compatibility with the newer crank.
Now on to ignition coils as relate to flywheels...
And yes, turns out the 075's/076's didn't have a points ignition version in favor of a trigger unit based system. That said, there were some that still used the windowed 1111-404-1202 flywheel for a time..., presumably to deplete inventory. That flywheel was discontinued and replaced by the same flywheel without the adjustment windows and used the same 1111-404-1202 part number just to keep the change crystal clear to everyone. LOL The curiosity there is what the difference is between the 1201 and 1202 flywheels since they both had points adjustment windows because the points cam itself is on the flywheel shaft hub instead of on the crank -- which required the flywheel to already be installed to set the points. Brilliant! The 1202 flywheel is also 1111 404 1202 instead of 1111 400 like the other flywheels for whatever reason.
Otherwise, there appear to have been three cranks used in the 1111 series with only the first version used in earlier 050's not being compatible with all the later flywheels beginning with the 1111-030-0401 crank and 1111-400-1201 flywheel. Later changes to the crank which resulted in the 1111-030-0402 part number didn't affect flywheel compatibility with the newer crank.
Now on to ignition coils as relate to flywheels...
To answer the original question and clarify..., the 1111-400-1201 flywheel will fit and should work for your 051 points setup but it was never used on an 076 if you're saying the 1201 is from an 076. If you're saying the 1201 is what you need for the 051 with points, you're correct. Your other option may well be the later 1111-404-1202 depending on the differences. Could simply be a different manufacturer of the same flywheel.
The 1111-404-1204 is not a points flywheel and also requires the newer recoil design. It won't work on an 051AV with your serial number.
ME TOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO Pics I mean
$121I'll give ya $120 for it!
Congrats on the accomplishment, not to mention the persistence.
Well done, sir. Well done.
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