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1/2 ton pickup woodhauler reality check

Discussion in 'Firewood, Heating and Wood Burning Equipment' started by Moddoo, Jan 25, 2009.

  1. streeter

    streeter ArboristSite Operative

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    That is dually levels!!! I loaded my ole gal down heavy a few times (85 F-250 with overload springs and air bags)and have "E" range tires (3200 lb rating) those tires where stressing with 6000 lbs in the bed (scaled)
    I thought I was a crazy :censored: LMAO
     
  2. Dok

    Dok ArboristSite Guru

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    I tried hauling wood with a Dodge 1500, 5.2L automatic 2WD and had nothing but trouble with it. It had a short box and the wood thrown in up to the bed sides would split and stack out to about 1/3 cord. The rear end kept going out. The rear end shop said the axle uses a crush sleeve to set pinion depth and that sleeve would further crush under load, allowing the pinion to walk. It did this three times. When the tranny gave out I gave up and bought a 3/4 ton. Lesson learned, 1/2 tons aren't work trucks.
    Dok
     
  3. markbuilt

    markbuilt ArboristSite Lurker

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    clunk ??

    so was this clunk sound and action like a universal joint , have a 2000 1500 chevy has a clunk when you start up , thought it was universals but all are good , next thought it was the locker but can't tell truck has 130,000 miles on it , mostly trailer pulling or something plus a son that liked to burn the tires off the thing and post it on that u tube ( how dumb )
     
  4. Kevin in Ohio

    Kevin in Ohio Addicted to ArboristSite

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    I'm done with E rated tires. Where I used to work we bought 3 Dodge 4x4 with Cummins diesels when they first came out. They all came with E rated Michelin all terrains. We had 14 tires total(2 trucks with spares. Out of those 14 tires, 7 blew out from belt shift with less than 10,000 miles on them. We had 500 gallon tanks on 2 of them which equates to over 5000 lbs in liquid alone. The other truck was just a transport truck and 3 of the tires blew on that one too. It never had more than 400 lbs in the bed.

    I told the owner that I refused to drive any of the trucks till we get rid of them and they agreed. Now you have to remember They had been running different trucks for 20 years and NEVER had one blow and they ran EVERY cheap tire you can imagine. Again, they NEVER had one blow, even running them to the cord showing.

    I thought maybe it was an isolated Michelin this but earlier this year I had this happen on my long distance truck.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Tire was a Goodyear Wrangler E rated tire. They came on the truck and had about 3/4 tread on it. I've never overloaded this truck. Truck was empty and was going about 60MPH when I heard what sounded like a rock caught in the tread. I started to slow down and it started shaking and hit the brakes a little harder. Then all heck broke loose. This all took place in less than 10 seconds. Tire NEVER lost air, the tread just broke free from the case and slapped the backside of the bed.

    From my real world experience E rated tires are "over rated" and I'll never buy any again. Good luck if you decide to try them.
     
  5. Billy_Bob

    Billy_Bob ArboristSite Guru

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    There are a lot of good deals out there on used 3/4 ton trucks.

    It seems a lot of "city people" who have owned these trucks just for the "looks" of owning a big truck (and have no need for such a truck), have traded them in for cars which get better gas mileage. So the lots have plenty of used 3/4 ton trucks - at least around here.
     
  6. Austin1

    Austin1 Addicted to ArboristSite

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    I have that same feeling about Fire Stones! I had the same thing happen to me with Fire Stones.Dad warned me 25 years ago that Fire stones were Junk lol. But then I have also had a 950/33 BFG blow up wile they were mounting the tire at the tire shop the guy mounting the tire only received a minor injury.
     
  7. streeter

    streeter ArboristSite Operative

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    Austin and Kevin, I do know about crappy tires, I used to sell tires:buttkick: I bought a by-product of goodyear (prospectors) and have had great luck. From my experience (20 plus years), tread peeling of if due to low air pressure or overloaded ( that is in the last @15 years). The reason is how a tire put together and how the heat is built up in the tire over speed and time travled on it.
    On one trip I knew I was going to make, I pack 2 spares for my trailer. I used one, had a nice blow out, peeled the tread right off:greenchainsaw:
    The firestone fiasco would require to much typing and do not want to steel the thread.
     
  8. John D

    John D Addicted to ArboristSite

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    I guess I ve been lucky with tires. I run Load range D's and Es with no trouble.If I am approaching the weight limit of the tire,I do 2 things that help it run cooler,I overinflate them(cold)by 5-10 psi,and I do not go fast in the summer esp with trailer tires.Cooler weather or in the rain,I will run 65 on the interstate.Tires fail because the get hot,they get too hot because of weight ,and speed,the buldging sidewall from the weight can be reduced substaintially by running overinflated,this lets the tire run much cooler.ive shot my tires with my lazer gun,running the front tandem at 65psi( ,and the rear set at 75psi,on my 10000GVWR flatbed trailer.The tires at 75psi run at least 10-20 degrees cooler at max load(5000lbs per axle),than the fronts at 65psi.The fronts SHOULD run cooler as they get more air flow than the rear.I started running overinflated on my travel trailers good year marathons,and now all my trailers are overinflated by 5-10 psi.ive heard of all these Goodyear marathon trailer tire problems,but ive yet to have any,so all my trailers have them on them.All overinflated,and my dump trailer,and flatbed trailer get loaded right to and sometimes slightly over the axle ratings(5200 on one)and 7000 on the other.Same with my pickups,load range Es on my GMC are at 85psi.Range Ds on my cummins are at 70psi with a 65 psi label.



    http://www.goodyear.com/rv/pdf/marathon_gen_info_032806.pdf
     
  9. Kevin in Ohio

    Kevin in Ohio Addicted to ArboristSite

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    What I can't understand is WHY we ran bias ply and normal steel belted tires and never had a problem but when we went to tires that were "supposed" to be able to handle it, they wouldn't. I assure you, they (E range) had 80 PSI everytime they went out where our others ran 50 MAX. Overloaded? Yes, 2 out of the 3 trucks were but again: So called junk tires handled it with no problems. Michelins didn't. Just doesn't seem worth twice the price to get what we had.

    I believe, as you eluded to is is the amount of steel that is in them and the tweaking forces when weight is on them. BUT, that doesn't explain the other truck with no overload. One guy said it was due to rotating tires side to side reversing the direction. New to me but we did that all the time with our junk tires too = no problems.

    Thanks for the insight.
     
  10. streeter

    streeter ArboristSite Operative

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    Kevin, looking at the picture of the tire, possibly a blunt impact to break the cord in the tread then heat took over and finished it off OR just a bad tire, who knows, as I can not see the tire in person.
    As for rotating them causing the problem...B.S.! You can look at yoko's, BFG, goodyear, toyota, ford, chevy ect, ect and so forth and you will find they all want tires rotated there way. ASLONG as they are not directional tires you can rotate tires anyway you mind can think.
    Writing this reminded me of another possible cause. Ever since I moved to arizona, I have learned that you DO NOT plug tire:confused: I learned since living here that plugging tires can cause belts to break and cause tire failure. Only patching here.
     
  11. Kevin in Ohio

    Kevin in Ohio Addicted to ArboristSite

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    I thought of the plus possibility and ran my hand all around the inside of the tire once I got it off. There was no plug that I could find. I bought the truck used with 60,000 miles and these tires were on it so A blunt force truma could be possible, none while I've had it and I put about 8,000 on it before this happened.

    No plugs on our work trucks and less than 10,000 miles on all of them. They all were way over 75% tread left.

    That's what I thought about the rotating thing to. The guy "claimed" that your direction is set when tire is spun in one direction and you shouldn't reverse it or damage will occur. I ask why vehicle manufactures don't mention that and why you don't have 2 spares? Mumbo Jumbo in my opinion. He was a Michilin dealer and was trying to come up with an excuse for our problem as he wanted to sell us replacements. We bought Pep Boys Futura Enforcer M/T's and ran them all down to the cord with NO blowouts. They were about 1/3 the price and took all the SAME abuse with no problems.

    Luckily I had full coverage on my truck and insurance covered it. They had to replace the whole bedside, inner fender and taillight. One expensive tire. :buttkick:
     
  12. John D

    John D Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Kevin,whatever the reason you lost those Michelins,you may never know.I personally have always had high reguards for Michelin tires,and they have always wore well,and balanced with little weight,a sing of a good tire .Structurally speaking they seem to be well built.Tread separation is usally a defective tire if it wasnt heat/weight related.Whatever cheapy tires your now running ,keep running them:) and be happy your saving money.
     
  13. streeter

    streeter ArboristSite Operative

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    +1

    And I did not say it. Michelins and brands they build without there name are excellent tires. Honestly, every tire maker today make good to excellent tires. Problems like that happen because something happened to the tire. With all the new stuff (within the last 5 years) I would trust almost anytire out there. I have done over 150 mph on cheap azz mastercrafts (good tire by the way) My "E" range prospectors have served me well being overloaded and looking flat with over 3 tons on them.
    It all comes down to the usage/abuse and vehicle problems. I have an 02 mustang GT with Yokos I put on it. I have over 30k on Z rated tires. My alignment is good and my outside and inside edges are wearing, WHY, cause I know I drive like and animal:rock: in my stang.
    I am not picking on you or anyone! I am just going to say something happened to the tire to cause the tread to seperate. I atleast know (many years experience) when I am going to abuse a tire and can be prepared or can see the signs of problems.
    Crap, I am rambling again, lol.
     
  14. flashpuppy

    flashpuppy ArboristSite Operative

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    You can also get a 14 bolt in a lug pattern. My 454ss had one under it....
     
  15. John D

    John D Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Absolutely,that was a rare axle,not used in many trucks.IIRC only the SS454s from 90-93 used the 5 lug 14 bolt.The 2500 LD 2wd used the 6 lug,as did all the 1500 excab 4x4s with the F44 HD chassis,and the 1500 4wd diesels.My dad had a 6.5 turbo diesel 1500 excab short bed in 94,a 2wd,what a quick truck,it had a 10 bolt under it,which I thought was way to small for the 6.5s 360ft lbs at 1700RPM.That truck could easily tow way more than it should have been towing.
     
  16. Austin1

    Austin1 Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Ya but it is the semi floater but still stronger than a 10 bolt. In a way a semi floater does two two jobs at once it must take the torque of the motor and carry part of the load on the axle shaft. As a full floater will take weight on the axle tube and the axles take the torque.
    I dont think most guy's haul wood in a 454 ss 1/2 ton lol.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2009
  17. John D

    John D Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Your right,they suck gas,and haul ass!:chainsaw:
     
  18. IdahoPanhandle

    IdahoPanhandle ArboristSite Lurker

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    Ill NEVER buy anything lighter than a true 3/4 ton ever again. And Ill never run tires lighter than E rated.

    I routinely load my '96 Powerstroke to the hilt. Tires suffer more than anything. To my knowledge, the rear end has never seen anything but fluid changes. Full float Sterling 10.25 :clap:

    How does 5k of gravel sound?

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    :cheers:
     
  19. John D

    John D Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Exactly 8600 and up minumum GVWR. My Cummins ram has been run hard,original 4.10 Dana 70 outback full floating.Its seen 500-650rwhp/1000-1300ft lbs torque isnce 55K miles,it now has 140K miles.It gets loaded pretty heavy as well.This truck owes me nothing,hasnt missed a snow storm since I put the first plow(boss 9'2"V) on her in 02.Now running a Blizzard/sidewing setup.Hers a few pics,its grossing out between 12,500-13,500 easily in the pics.
     
  20. Dok

    Dok ArboristSite Guru

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    Around here those are highly sought after by the 'wheelers for their Rubicon rigs. If you find one, they are very expensive. The are semi floaters, so not as stong as full float for heavy loads.
    Dok
     

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