3 way splitting wedge- couple questions

[stltreedr]

Kevin in Ohio, among others was right. the head design didn't break upon use, but the machine won't split it. I'm running about 30 tons of force through my 5 inch cylinder, and even moderately big, or knotty wood stalls the cylinder. I really want a 3 way wedge, so I'm hoping to redesign it so that it will work. The vertical splitting wedge is 8" tall, and the horizontal is 16" wide. I'm figuring if the splitting "point" is about 1/8", the log is encountering about 4.5 square inches at a time. What would you think about either:

cutting 4 inches off each side of the horizontal splitting wedge to reduce surface area by 1/3,
or
remounting the top wedge about an inch or two in front or in back of the vertical wedge so the log doesn't hit all the surfaces at the same time.
or both, or something else...open to suggestions.
Those of you that have 4 and 6 way wedges- are the horizontal and vertical splitting surfaces offset or even. If offset, by how much?

Opinions needed.
View attachment 273591View attachment 273592View attachment 273593

 

[Stihl310]

Might try tapering the leading edges of each blade, would help cut down on initial contact surface area and place more pressure on a smaller area of the wood. Be similar to offsetting the edges, maybe do this in conjunction with.

Might help initially get a split started rather than putting the entire cutting edge in contact with the wood all at one time.

 

[midwest_170]

Start your 2nd wedge behind where the horizontal bevel stops. You have enough force make a 6-way if you designed the wedge properly.

 

[Guswhit]

I am in agreement with some of the above comments to get the wood started splitting on one wedge before starting you second split. I think once you have started the split it will reduce the pressure needed on the second portion of the split. You may have to leave the piece on the wedge and start another through to finish pushing it off.

 

[motoman3b]

set your top wedge back about 4 inches so it splits vertical before splitting the horizontal, most 4 way wedges are like this, your just trying to do too much in one crack should work good if you offset IMO..

 

[Steve NW WI]

Moving the top wedge back will help, so will a sharper angle. Also, with that much force that high up, I'd use a lot longer slide guide on the pusher plate than you have. There's going to be a LOT of force trying to twist that plate off the beam, especially if you get a piece that isn't cut square and it's pushing on the top.

 

[stltreedr]

Thanks for all the useful ideas. I think I'm going to start with cutting the top off and remounting it back a few inches. Maybe I can get that done this week. How long would you recommend the slide guide being? My guess is it's about 8 inches now.

 

[jrider]

I have a 4 way from Iron and Oak on a 22 ton splitter. The 4 way drops on and can lift off without locking anything in place. I do need to take it off for really big or knotty stuff. The horizontal wedge is set back about 2 inches. That being said, I couldn't be happier with the machine.

 

[Kevin in Ohio]

Do you know what pressure you are running? Might want to check that but it doesn't surprise me that it stalls. Takes a lot more force to split "real world" firewood than people assume. I see those french fry splitters on Utube with 10+ way wedges and wonder how much force they are having to have to do that. Funny how you never see a knotty piece in the videos, isn't it. Fun to get unstuck for sure.

Backsetting the cross will help but with a fixed wedge like you have you are limiting what you do. I use my single for all the knotty tougher stuff and then switch to the 4 way for the rest.

My single is plenty aggressive angle wise. I would split easier if the first wedge was straight for a while longer before it opened it up on the second stage. The 5 inch overcomes it though as planned.

At this point I'd say taper back like jet wings and backset as others have offered. You have a lot of high force on those wedge welds at the bottom.
http://www.arboristsite.com/firewood-heating-wood-burning-equipment/206143.htm

 

[Evanrude]

I think all the 4 way wedges I've seen had an angled edge on the horizontal. Some even have little fins vertically back from the front edge to help pry the wood apart.

Here's a pic from a Timberwolf.

 

[Steve NW WI]

A good rule of thumb is the slide guide should be as long as the pusher is tall.

 

[Rattler05.5]

Kevin in Ohio, among others was right. the head design didn't break upon use, but the machine won't split it. I'm running about 30 tons of force through my 5 inch cylinder, and even moderately big, or knotty wood stalls the cylinder. I really want a 3 way wedge, so I'm hoping to redesign it so that it will work. The vertical splitting wedge is 8" tall, and the horizontal is 16" wide. I'm figuring if the splitting "point" is about 1/8", the log is encountering about 4.5 square inches at a time. What would you think about either:

cutting 4 inches off each side of the horizontal splitting wedge to reduce surface area by 1/3,
or
remounting the top wedge about an inch or two in front or in back of the vertical wedge so the log doesn't hit all the surfaces at the same time.
or both, or something else...open to suggestions.
Those of you that have 4 and 6 way wedges- are the horizontal and vertical splitting surfaces offset or even. If offset, by how much?

Opinions needed.
View attachment 273591View attachment 273592View attachment 273593

I am going to preface this with, "I'm a rookie at this but as a lay person looking in.

Are you sure you're getting full pressure to your cylinder? I can't believe it would struggle to press it through that wedge. Flip it vertically and stack 30 cars on top of one another couldn't press a piece of wood through that sharp edge!? Doesn't seem right.

And that timberwolf wedge seems like it would try to tear itself apart being that the wood encounters the farthest point out on the wings first and would try to tear that weld apart with the most force possible. (again, who am I to question a proven, great, company?)

Does your splitter act like you would expect when it dead heads 30 tons of force into your wedge? Maybe it's bypassing and its not your wedge?
30 tons should be distorting your beam and straining your engine and make you cringe when you watch it! :msp_ohmy:

 

[stltreedr]

I'll try to help you all help me. I am running a pressure gauge and have the relief set about 2800 PSI- it really bogs down the 13hp Honda under load.

The beam is 7/8" thick and You can watch it flex under full load. I have no doubt that I am pushing the full force, but I too, could not believe that it wouldn't split some not so gnarly wood.

Looking back at some of the monstrosities that I've seen on the web, they MUST be running huge cylinders, because I don't know how they could generate the necessary force.

Maybe I should cut off the top part for now, then make a 3 way removable sleeve that could fit over it...There's a project for next winter, along with a longer slide guide. I've gotta get some splitting done soon though.

 

[stltreedr]

kevin in Ohio

I've tried to check out the Catersplitter before but I can't see the pics. Seems like that happens to me often on here.

 

[Patrick62]

My design

View attachment 273645
This has worked well for me. I use a 5" cylinder as well, and the only stuff that stopped the cylinder was some really knotty Mulberry. This was the favorite around here that the second splitter was created with same setup.
Each wing is 6" long, and made outta road grader blade welded with low-hy rod.

 

[turnkey4099]

Kevin in Ohio, among others was right. the head design didn't break upon use, but the machine won't split it. I'm running about 30 tons of force through my 5 inch cylinder, and even moderately big, or knotty wood stalls the cylinder. I really want a 3 way wedge, so I'm hoping to redesign it so that it will work. The vertical splitting wedge is 8" tall, and the horizontal is 16" wide. I'm figuring if the splitting "point" is about 1/8", the log is encountering about 4.5 square inches at a time. What would you think about either:

cutting 4 inches off each side of the horizontal splitting wedge to reduce surface area by 1/3,
or
remounting the top wedge about an inch or two in front or in back of the vertical wedge so the log doesn't hit all the surfaces at the same time.
or both, or something else...open to suggestions.
Those of you that have 4 and 6 way wedges- are the horizontal and vertical splitting surfaces offset or even. If offset, by how much?

Opinions needed.
View attachment 273591View attachment 273592View attachment 273593

Except when shearing through a knot/crotch that point never touches wood after it enters the block.
Off setting the horizontal back a bit so the "entering the block" part is two-stage as others suggested will help.

Harry K

 

[dave_dj1]

How close does your pusher come to the wedge? The reason I ask is maybe you could weld on a point like I've seen on some splitters, I think anything that will start the split will help.

 

[stltreedr]

I really appreciate everyone's help. We made a quick field repair last night to get us splitting. We took the torch and re-cut the horizontal beveled cutting surface back about 2 inches. voila- works like a charm. I split some good sized hickory knots and an ash butt piece last night in the dark to try it out. The pressure didn't even get above 1000psi. I cannot believe the difference.

This repair looks like crap. After splitting season I think we will cut off the whole splitting head and redesign using all of your suggestions.

Thanks again.

 

[dave_dj1]

COOL