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661 Oil Test 32:1 vs 40:1 vs 50:1 ?

redbull660

redbull660

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I have been running 36:1 klotz original techniplate since day 1 on my new 661 arctic. I have 7 tanks on it so far. The saw has the old style boot and it's been bogging. So I decided to change the boot....which pretty much requires pulling the jug. It's a total pain to drop the tank with all the wiring on the arctic.




seems to burn pretty clean inside the muffler can. Big mark on the piston. Oil fault? Klotz does say 13k limit for orig. techniplate. But I would only go over that piss reving so? Or maybe Hd2 let something get through? This is my 11th or 12th 661 and this is the first time I've seen this and it's the first time I've used original techniplate. coincidence?







see video for top of piston - it's wet and black. No transfer wash showing. Video is posted after pictures.

inside the jug. Not exactly clean, like I've seen with the likes of mobil 1, honda hp2, and schaeffers.











vid - shows much more than the pics.


Maybe it would run cleaner at 40:1?
 
redbull660

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ok ran 3-4 tanks of honda hp2 in the Arctic 661. Wanted to see how that would look vs the klotz original techniplate.

here is the klotz original techniplate vid 7 tanks at 36:1 -



here is same saw after 3-4 tanks of honda hp2 at 36:1 -

 
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redbull660

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next ran klotz orig techniplate at 42:1

 

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redbull660

redbull660

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Ok I ran 4 tanks red armor last night. Use the same setup max flow, 28" 404, BP 91 eth free gas etc etc.

So this stuff is really RED. :D It's like pouring red kool-aid into the gas tank. 32:1 seems to be a touch too much. I think if I run it again I'll try 36 or40:1. (this is non ported 661).

It appears the Red armor started to clean things up. But considering how big of a mess the Super Techniplate left. I'd say it did ok for 4 tanks.

Piston Exhaust side - very very thin coat. But was shut down right after the cut.
Piston intake side - good coat
crank - good coat

Conclusion - Seems like decent stuff. I'd like to try it with 36:1 or 40:1 and starting out with a clean P/C to see what it leaves behind if anything.

So next up to bat - will go with the old reliable. Schaeffers and see if that can clean this super techniplate mess up.












looks like it's starting to clean up the mess klotz super techniplate left on the pistion.











 
redbull660

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I ran 5 tanks of scaheffers @ 25:1 to see if it could clean up the klotz mess. Looks like it good a great start to cleaning things up! What a mess though! ( Klotz super techniplate mess - http://************/threads/what-oil-is-best-and-what-ratio.98/page-353#post-153127 )


5 tanks schaeffers 25:1 91 eth free -















missed the jug pics so you'll have to watch the video. I was at tree monkey's having a few good laughs as well. :D

 
redbull660

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so if you've been following my take downs you know super techniplate made a giant mess of the saw in just 4 tanks and been trying to get it clean ever since.

Previous take down: schaeffers 5 tanks 25:1
this take down: red armor 5-6 tanks 40:1


previous takedown schaeffers 25:1


this take down Red Armor 40:1



previous takedown schaeffers 25:1




this take down Red Armor 40:1



previous takedown schaeffers 25:1



this take down Red Armor 40:1




some thoughts...

- red armor does seem to clean things. I do think schaeffers does it better though.

- red armor is pretty impressive as far as residual oil. I do think the red dye makes it look like there is more oil then there really is. I am impressed at what is left at 40:1 vs what was left with schaeffers at 25:1.

- I noticed that the red armor residual seems to be gooey or sticky rather than what the rest have been like...oily?. Is this good or bad? I don't know.

- there is more crusty carbon on the exhaust side top of the cylinder vs the schaeffers so that is a bit concerning. But there seemed to be less of this problem when I ran 32:1 (see below link)

***edit: incorrect. see few posts down from this one***- there seems to be more build up on the top of the piston than what I started with.

- I've been running 28" 8pin 404 full comp on everything. So a decent load. I don't think I would run 40:1 again with that load on the saw. I'd probably go back to 32: or 36:1.



- I guess I am thinking there isn't much point to these take downs anymore unless the load and ratio is consistent. I'm thinking a 36" bar 404 full comp and 32:1 across the board.

- and to eliminate some - seems the best idea would be to do the oil test and take the top 3-5 performers and run those each for 8-10 tanks with the 36" 404 full comp and then take em down.

- attached below some more pics from this take down (40:1 red armor)
 

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redbull660

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Correction - I said the piston top looked like it had more build up on it. That is incorrect.

I scraped a bunch off prior to this picture. So this is the "start value" if you will... how it looked BEFORE running red armor 40:1



this is AFTER running red armor 40:1 5-6 tanks... the carbon layer is thinner for sure and no doubt more of the piston is clearing up. (look at the edges of both pics. Anyway still good stuff. Just don't think 40:1 was ideal for the load I was putting on the saw. And I will say the saw ran good using it. Very curious to see how it stacks up against others in the oil test.
 
redbull660

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Khntr85

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Let me say the work you are doing and showing everyone is absolutely awesome.... GREAT stuff here, a lot of time and work you put into this.... Wish I could buy you a some brews!!!!

Thanks a lot kyle!!!!
 

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I haven't been following this whole thread but here and there I like reading up on updates.

Regarding the Schaefer oil that seems to clean so well - is this possibly because it has a "detergent" in it? I know most car engine oils often have detergents but I believe most two stroke oil does not.

I see you have the motul800 that drf255 recommended to me. How does/did it do?

Also, can I send you some Lucas oil? It's what I've been using and I'd love a comparative reference point.
 
bwalker

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Air cooled two cycle oils do indeed have detergents.
The schaeffers product Redbull is using is an ashless, water cooled tcw3 marine oil and does not have detergents. Rather it uses ashless dispersents which are nitrogen/ amine based, which is what gives tcw3 marine oils their distinct smell.
 
redbull660

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7 tanks - Mobil 1 2t racing (red colored) 32:1

this muffler has been used on other 661s I have so the inside really can't show. But the cover was pretty clean.






spark plug







Jug - the brown is not build up, it's oil that can be wiped away. The jug is very very clean.








Tree Monkey photo bombing my picture!






Piston and crank - plenty of oil on the skirts. Good coating on the crank etc. Clean. Oil puddling inside those trox heads.





 
redbull660

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also did belray SI-7

32:1 after 10tanks (new jug and piston)

 

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redbull660

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Ran Schaeffer 9000 full synthetic on a new 661. 32:1 for 12 tanks running 36"-41" .404

This is NOT the tcw3 7000 semi syn.

 

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