A Felling Question

[MustangMike]

I know there are a lot of people on this site with a lot more experience/knowledge than me, so I'd like some feedback from you on a felling question.

There is a tree with a slight lean to it. I want to drop the tree at about 45 degrees from the lean.

I'm thinking to make the notch in the direction that I want it to fall, but with the back cut leaving the hinge a little thicker on the side away from the lean.

Is this a good idea, or not?

If it makes any difference, the tree is a Tulip (Yellow Poplar) about 20" in diameter, and fairly tall.

Thanks.

 

[Trx250r180]

Need a pic Mike

 

[HuskStihl]

You are describing the classic "Dutchman" method for turning a tree from its lean. The amount of lean is reasonable, and the species turns great. Just make sure your face is perfectly matched up and cleaned up. Start the back cut on the lean side (but don't stand under the lean), and leave as much holding wood as possible on the "pull side" to turn the tree. It may try to take your saw for a ride when it starts to go, so be ready.

 

[Deets066]

I like a short bar when useing the Dutchman, easier to keep it out of a pinch on the final cut.

For me anyway

 

[Big_Wood]

You are describing the classic "Dutchman" method for turning a tree from its lean. The amount of lean is reasonable, and the species turns great. Just make sure your face is perfectly matched up and cleaned up. Start the back cut on the lean side (but don't stand under the lean), and leave as much holding wood as possible on the "pull side" to turn the tree. It may try to take your saw for a ride when it starts to go, so be ready.

don't recommend a dutchman to a guy with no experience doing it! oh and judging by your explanation you to don't know what a dutchman is LOL a dutchman is going deeper on the top cut of the under cut on the side you want to break first. so you are essentially taking wood from the hinge before hand and making a flat spot for the stem to sit on putting pressure on the holding wood. this way the side with the dutchman breaks first causing the tree to twist during the fall. not a technique for the average firewood hack! lose control and yer shooting in the dark. what mike described is gonna be easiest for him. not hard to tell you guys are learning from the workBC videos on youtube those videos have errors to by the way. mike, the way you described is not a dutchman and is the safest way to carry out the job for yourself. purpose of the thicker hinge on the side away from the lean is so the hinge don't break having the tree go down with the lean. keep your holding from side to side thick to thin the way you said and wedge it over (if needed). you'll be fine.

 

[KenJax Tree]

Just use you MS 362 C-M and cut straight through the back...the 362 is so awesome the tree will just lay right down where you want it. [emoji1] just bustin' you Mike its been a while.

I agree with Shane a dutchman isn't a technique to use if you've never done it before. When in doubt throw a rope in it.

 

[gomoto69]

Do you want it to go 45 degrees or do you 'need' it to go 45 degrees, as in to miss a building, powerline etc? If so, i would rope it and pull with a pickup or quad to make sure it goes where you want. If its just for convenience, give it a go, make sure your undercut is no more than 1/3 the diameter, and clean, and don't cut it all the way off!

 

[Deets066]

 

[SAWMIKAZE]

Didnt gypo have some vids of him turnin and burnin ?

 

[Trx250r180]

couple of these will help on the back cut ,cut ..........pound ,cut a little more ............pound cut ,leave a good hinge so it does not go over backwards ,if it wont go do the rope thing ,do not cut the hinge too thin ,leave min 2 inches preferably more ,the hinge will steer your tree away from the lean ,use the sights on your saw to make sure the back cut is going direction of the fall ,sights are the black line across your side covers and top of plastic ,

 

[SAWMIKAZE]

couple of these will help on the back cut ,cut ..........pound ,cut a little more ............pound cut ,leave a good hinge so it does not go over backwards ,if it wont go do the rope thing ,do not cut the hinge too thin ,leave min 2 inches preferably more ,the hinge will steer your tree away from the lean ,use the sights on your saw to make sure the back cut is going direction of the fall ,sights are the black line across your side covers and top of plastic ,View attachment 426065 View attachment 426062

I just took my saws to the range to " sight " em in , dem black lines lie sometimes

 

[Trx250r180]

I just took my saws to the range to " sight " em in , dem black lines lie sometimes

My 660 needs to be re sighted ,but for now as long as it goes one of the 3 directions ,its all good

 

[HuskStihl]

don't recommend a dutchman to a guy with no experience doing it! oh and judging by your explanation you to don't know what a dutchman is LOL a dutchman is going deeper on the top cut of the under cut on the side you want to break first. so you are essentially taking wood from the hinge before hand and making a flat spot for the stem to sit on putting pressure on the holding wood. this way the side with the dutchman breaks first causing the tree to twist during the fall. not a technique for the average firewood hack! lose control and yer shooting in the dark. what mike described is gonna be easiest for him. not hard to tell you guys are learning from the workBC videos on youtube those videos have errors to by the way. mike, the way you described is not a dutchman and is the safest way to carry out the job for yourself. purpose of the thicker hinge on the side away from the lean is so the hinge don't break having the tree go down with the lean. keep your holding from side to side thick to thin the way you said and wedge it over (if needed). you'll be fine.

I'm not recommending anything. He is describing a Dutchman and I am telling him a safe way to go about it. You are describing a "kerf Dutchman", which is done from the face, and I am telling him how to turn it from the back. Both techniques will leave basically the same stump, with the pull side thick and the lean side thin/gone at the edge. We could talk about step Dutchmen, and "soft" Dutchmen, both techniques to get it to turn faster/more, but that is not necessary here. It should be no problem to turn a tulip poplar 45 degrees from it's lean from the back, and I think it would be safer for the inexperienced to simply put in a nice clean face and do the "dutching" from the back, rather than trying to set up a kerf Dutchman from the face

 

[Big_Wood]

I'm not recommending anything. He is describing a Dutchman and I am telling him a safe way to go about it. You are describing a "kerf Dutchman", which is done from the face, and I am telling him how to turn it from the back. Both techniques will leave basically the same stump, with the pull side thick and the lean side thin/gone at the edge. We could talk about step Dutchmen, and "soft" Dutchmen, both techniques to get it to turn faster/more, but that is not necessary here. It should be no problem to turn a tulip poplar 45 degrees from it's lean from the back, and I think it would be safer for the inexperienced to simply put in a nice clean face and do the "dutching" from the back, rather than trying to set up a kerf Dutchman from the face

you have obviously done some reading LOL around here we don't refer to any kind of dutchman from the back. we refer to a dutchman as the thinned/gone as you say holding wood being from the front creating a flat spot for the stem to sit. that force strains the holding wood. when using a dutchman i always leave holding wood but very little. the flat spot or step strains that very little holding wood so it breaks first and when you want it to. i won't be the guy standing at the stump with a tree standing with a corner cut off. i am interested where you have done your reading though as i am always interested to learn more. i have only been taught the way fallers do it here really and have never once read on the subject. problem is as with anything there are alot of people writing about things they have never done. like here, WCB officials don't know what it is to fall a tree and yet somehow they tell us what's safe and what isn't LOL. i'm interested in all these names for a dutchman you have read about because i have only learned about the dutchman as a dutchman from guys who actually use it. either way, a homeowner/firewood hack should think twice before doing things more technical that he don't have any experience doing. of course, maybe there is less worry considering the small timber you guys have to work with. **** up a dutchman on something bigger here and your ****ed LOL i was understanding what mike was saying was how they describe to deal with a leaner in the workBC videos which is not a dutchman. the cut is designed to keep a tree on it's stump and have the face pointing where he wants it to go. thick hinge on the pull side would be to hold tree from going with the lean.

 

[HuskStihl]

I see what you are saying. When I intentionally leave more holding wood on one side to turn a tree, I call it a Dutchman whether I set it up from the face, set it up with a borecut, or do to in the back cut. If the term "Dutchman" only applies to when you set it up from the face, I don't think mike should do that. Here's a step Dutch

 

[Big_Wood]

the way i was taught was to just simply go deeper then the lower cut on top cut of the under cut and on the side you want to break first. i am talking of the upper cut of the undercut (lower cut for the easterner conventional cut i guess LOL). now the dutchman is there and the back cut can be done slightly above like normal. i guess that could be what the step is. either way it accomplishes what you accomplished in the vid but in my mind is alot more simple and is less ****ing around at the stump. i've never wedged a dutchman like that and get the same swing as you without the block of wood present. put the block of wood in there and it goes way over. for a homeowner i am impressed. you did your homework. just imagine doing that on a 40" fir though LOL there are many ways to skin a cat. where'd you learn this? i only learned what was handed down through generations.

 

[Trx250r180]

the way i was taught was to just simply go deeper then the lower cut on top cut of the under cut and on the side you want to break first. i am talking of the upper cut of the undercut (lower cut for the easterner conventional cut i guess LOL). now the dutchman is there and the back cut can be done slightly above like normal. i guess that could be what the step is. either way it accomplishes what you accomplished in the vid but in my mind is alot more simple and is less ****ing around at the stump. i've never wedged a dutchman like that and get the same swing as you without the block of wood present. put the block of wood in there and it goes way over. for a homeowner i am impressed. you did your homework. just imagine doing that on a 40" fir though LOL there are many ways to skin a cat. where'd you learn this? i only learned what was handed down through generations.

Never doubt the huskstihl ,he taught Chuck Norris everything he knows .......

 

[HuskStihl]

the way i was taught was to just simply go deeper then the lower cut on top cut of the under cut and on the side you want to break first. i am talking of the upper cut of the undercut (lower cut for the easterner conventional cut i guess LOL). now the dutchman is there and the back cut can be done slightly above like normal. i guess that could be what the step is. either way it accomplishes what you accomplished in the vid but in my mind is alot more simple and is less ****ing around at the stump. i've never wedged a dutchman like that and get the same swing as you without the block of wood present. put the block of wood in there and it goes way over. for a homeowner i am impressed. you did your homework. just imagine doing that on a 40" fir though LOL there are many ways to skin a cat. where'd you learn this? i only learned what was handed down through generations.

The step or block Dutch employs a rock (per Douglas dent) or a piece of the face to break the near side faster. Wedging a bored Dutch is dangerous, as the hinge will break (ask how I know), but that tree needed to turn fast, and had a bunch of limb weight going the wrong way. I usually use a Humboldt, but I was worried the block would fall out. I don't do that for all trees I want to turn. A homeowner in Texas is different than a homeowner in some other places. I'm not a logger, but I've taken down a couple hundred trees in the past 5 years.

 

[Trx250r180]

The step or block Dutch employs a rock (per Douglas dent) or a piece of the face to break the near side faster. Wedging a bored Dutch is dangerous, as the hinge will break (ask how I know), but that tree needed to turn fast, and had a bunch of limb weight going the wrong way. I usually use a Humboldt, but I was worried the block would fall out. I don't do that for all trees I want to turn. A homeowner in Texas is different than a homeowner in some other places. I'm not a logger, but I've taken down a couple hundred trees in the past 5 years.

You could have just shortened it up by saying

"I'm a badass "

 

[HuskStihl]

Every once in a while a 40 incher