Am I doing something wrong

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As I said a few days ago...RE is expecting your call. Good luck.
 
Not trying to sound like an ass, but

Well, my point is this. You are spending money on fuel you should not be using while we are all giving you our best advice based on your descriptions but without actually seeing the system work. We can keep guessing, you can keep trying and you can keep using fuel and spending money on it. Or, you can hire someone to inspect it and either tell you how to correct the problem or fix it.

I have offered you my input. Others have as well. We did it freely and with the intent to help. Yet, the issue remains. IMHO, the next step is to hire someone who does this stuff for a living.
 
Called my boiler guy, he couldn't think of too much really. He said i should take a FLA reading of the blower to see if its working correctly, make sure there is no blockages in the pumps. I'm not really sure what else to think/do. I might see if there are any solid fuel techs around who might be able to diagnosis an issue. I'm just stumped, the OWB is designed to heat 5000 sq ft and im no where near that.

I was reading through another thread and I'm thinking/ hoping my issue now is with draft. I check to make sure the intake was blowing correctly, but i think im not drafting up my stovepipe correctly. I also realized my rod that is supposed to divert smoke never really diverts smoke well and now is jammed closed from creosote. Is there any real way of cleaning the stack/flue other than something like a creosote log and sweeping? Where is a good place to look for a set of brushes and rods? I will need to sweep top down with the furnace running.
 
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Sorry this may sound stupid, but I'm thinking this could be a major part of the issue. I decided to try and clean out my boiler as much as I could, I shoveled out two garbage cans full of ash and coals. In doing so, I found that the edges/outer part of the boiler chamber were coated completely with about 1 to 1-1/2 inch of creosote/nasty buildup. I'm assuming this is a major restriction on heat transfer. My plan is to try and burn down my fire as much as I can, shovel out all the ashes and coals, scrape what is possible while its still warm. Then I'll build a good fire back up and keep the ash level down way before the door (as of today it was 2-3 inches above the sill height)

Any insight?
 
you should be removing ash regularly, like once a week or every two weeks.
you should be scraping the inside of the firebox regularly, like at least once a month.

too much ash or creosote buildup will not cause the heat loss issue you described.
 
I didn't get it cleaned out 100 % yesterday, still too much ash and coals etc in the box, nowhere to put it to cool. My temps stayed up in the 175-180 range for a while then plummeted down to 141 this morning when I got up. I'm still thinking there is some type of restriction/ issue with getting a good burn in the box, I still have large chunks in the stove, and as soon as I open the door it flares up and temps rise a bit. I can feel air being moved by the draft fan, but maybe its not working at 100% anymore, or can't draft right. Any issues with sweeping while burning other than a whole lot of smoke in the face? Plan is to pull everything out of the stove this weekend and scrape as much as possible, and if I can find some brushes, to sweep the stack ( might be a little tricky, sloped steel roof with ice on it)

I included some pictures of what the inside of the stove looks like, please feel free to comment/criticize any bad practices you may see.

Just as a frame of reference, the level of coals that you see is approx 2-3 inches about the door sill, 4-8 above the bottom of the firebox

View attachment 219987View attachment 219988
 
Unless you have something specific in mind, there is no need to completely empty ashes and coals from the firebox.

You should have a long handled scraper for cleaning the interior of the firebox. I bought mine from my dealer when i got the boiler 8 years ago. Its all steel and the handle is about 7' long. With this tool you can scrape the walls/ceiling while the fire is burning.

Regarding the chimney, if using a chimney cleaning brush, I would let the fire burn down to coals only before going at it. However, I'd take a different approach (described below) unless you believe the chimney is plugged. If you think the chimney is plugged, then use a chimney tool or long rod to check for blockage.

To clean your boiler I would burn 1-2 creosote logs in a hot, stoked fire. Then tap on the chimney to shake anything remaining loose. Next, scrape the walls and ceiling with appropriate scraper tool. Next, shovel out ash/creosote, keeping coals. Finally, stoke the fire. Once you have cleaned the creosote and ashes you should be fine.

Now, back to the air flow issue. From your comments, it seems the boiler water temperature issue is burn-related and not caused by draw from the house system. It sounds like your fire smolders when the boiler door is closed and damper is open/fan is running, but when you open the boiler door the fire takes off burning strong.

I say this because there are only 2 ways your boiler water temp will drop to the 150's range you describe. First, cold water in the home loop dominating the hot water in the boiler loop, causing the boiler loop temp to drop ( as opposed to hot water in boiler loop dominating and causing home loop water temp to rise). Second, fire not burning strong enough to maintain 175-180 degree boiler water temp. Your descriptions/comments have suggested the latter as the cause.

So, you should check the chimney to be sure its not plugged. You should be able to contact a dealer to find out what tool to use to check/service the chimney. You also need to check your damper/fan airflow. Your comments suggest air intake is the root cause of the issue. The damper may not open completely or may be partially clogged, or the fan may be failing or compromised. I'm not familiar with your boiler design, but assume you will need to disassemble housing on the boiler door to check the damper/fan. Be safe! Kill the power before you do it. Disassemble the housing, check and clean the openings, parts and fan. The cause may be obvious. I would leave the housing off and turn on the power (be careful) so that i could observe the damper/fan cycle on and function. Diagnose/rule out based on your observations.

Finally, if you can afford it, and you cannot determine the cause of the issue yourself, have a dealer come and inspect your boiler. The dealer will probably immediately know what is wrong.
 
Thanks for the quick reply. I do have a scraper, I try and use it as much as possible. I wish the boiler hadn't been running when I bought the house so I could have properly cleaned it, I'm not sure how well it was maintained before me. I'm not sure if the chimney is fully plugged, I can see smoke coming out of it, I'm just not sure if its restricted or not, and whether that would effect the burn. My plan is to climb up this weekend and check it out.

Regarding your comments on whether its burn related or a sizing issue, in my mind it is a burning issue, because as far as I can tell the boiler is sized for heating much more than I want, and many others heat a lot more square footage than I do with the same unit.
If I crack the door while the blower is running it stokes right up and burns awesome. I took apart the housing around the blower the other day and watched it cycle a bit, the blower seems to be spinning fine and the rubber flapper/solenoid open and close no problem. I've got a clamp on meter to throw on the blower lines today to see if I'm drawing a strange amperage, and Grainger has a new blower in town if I need to replace it.

If I could find a dealer nearby I would absolutely have them come checkout the system. Unfortunately, I haven't found any Woodmaster dealers within 50-100 miles. I've contacted Woodmaster to see if they know of any service techs or anyone nearby who has experience.

I appreciate your help, I'd really like to get this sorted out.


Unless you have something specific in mind, there is no need to completely empty ashes and coals from the firebox.

You should have a long handled scraper for cleaning the interior of the firebox. I bought mine from my dealer when i got the boiler 8 years ago. Its all steel and the handle is about 7' long. With this tool you can scrape the walls/ceiling while the fire is burning.

Regarding the chimney, if using a chimney cleaning brush, I would let the fire burn down to coals only before going at it. However, I'd take a different approach (described below) unless you believe the chimney is plugged. If you think the chimney is plugged, then use a chimney tool or long rod to check for blockage.

To clean your boiler I would burn 1-2 creosote logs in a hot, stoked fire. Then tap on the chimney to shake anything remaining loose. Next, scrape the walls and ceiling with appropriate scraper tool. Next, shovel out ash/creosote, keeping coals. Finally, stoke the fire. Once you have cleaned the creosote and ashes you should be fine.

Now, back to the air flow issue. From your comments, it seems the boiler water temperature issue is burn-related and not caused by draw from the house system. It sounds like your fire smolders when the boiler door is closed and damper is open/fan is running, but when you open the boiler door the fire takes off burning strong.

I say this because there are only 2 ways your boiler water temp will drop to the 150's range you describe. First, cold water in the home loop dominating the hot water in the boiler loop, causing the boiler loop temp to drop ( as opposed to hot water in boiler loop dominating and causing home loop water temp to rise). Second, fire not burning strong enough to maintain 175-180 degree boiler water temp. Your descriptions/comments have suggested the latter as the cause.

So, you should check the chimney to be sure its not plugged. You should be able to contact a dealer to find out what tool to use to check/service the chimney. You also need to check your damper/fan airflow. Your comments suggest air intake is the root cause of the issue. The damper may not open completely or may be partially clogged, or the fan may be failing or compromised. I'm not familiar with your boiler design, but assume you will need to disassemble housing on the boiler door to check the damper/fan. Be safe! Kill the power before you do it. Disassemble the housing, check and clean the openings, parts and fan. The cause may be obvious. I would leave the housing off and turn on the power (be careful) so that i could observe the damper/fan cycle on and function. Diagnose/rule out based on your observations.

Finally, if you can afford it, and you cannot determine the cause of the issue yourself, have a dealer come and inspect your boiler. The dealer will probably immediately know what is wrong.
 
think the stack could be partially blocked. This afternoon I ran the temp up to 181 with the door open, closed the door, then went to open it a minute or two later to toss a piece of scrap in and literally the gases/smoke blew up out the door probably 4-5 feet out the door easy, good thing I was low or it would have got me. Unfortunately, the smoke baffle is locked right up, I can only get it to move an inch or two so I think its gummed up good.
 
get a good hot fire going and burn a couple creosote logs. it will only help.

if you need to work inside the firebox you're going to have to shut it down and cool the water until its safe.
 
Now you've got me confused. What do you mean by door open? Does door open mean door open an inch and exhaust leaving the chimney? It seems if the chimney is open enough to get hot with the door cracked open it should be open enough for the blower to make a hot fire. Any chance there's some obstruction on the intake side like a mouse or hornets nest?

Hope you get this sorted out soon.
 
This afternoon I ran the temp up to 181 with the door open, closed the door, then went to open it a minute or two later to toss a piece of scrap in and literally the gases/smoke blew up out the door probably 4-5 feet out the door

was the damper open/fan running when the vapor explosion occurred? If no, then that is not uncommon. If yes, then it means you have an air issue and its probably on the intake side.

when the fire burns strong and hot with good wood, and then the damper closes, it is normal for gasses to accumulate in the firebox. Opening the door can cause the gasses to ignite resulting in a fireball blowing out the door opening. this should not occur if the damper is open, since there should be ample draw out the chimney. Plus, when you burn with the door open, if the chimney is plugged your smoke will boil out the door opening.
 
think the stack could be partially blocked. This afternoon I ran the temp up to 181 with the door open, closed the door, then went to open it a minute or two later to toss a piece of scrap in and literally the gases/smoke blew up out the door probably 4-5 feet out the door easy, good thing I was low or it would have got me. Unfortunately, the smoke baffle is locked right up, I can only get it to move an inch or two so I think its gummed up good.

This is normal if your draft was closed and the blower was off at the time. My grandson named my OWB the Dragon because this happens on mine when the conditions are right.
 
Burned a creosote log yesterday, looking for a brush setup to run through the chimney. I've let the firebox run down to very minimal amount of ashes/coals. I haven't had a chance to pull the blower apart and clean it. I might pick up an extra blower Monday from Grainger just to have, but I'm still stumped on whats causing my fire not to burn correctly. I did manage to get the smoke bypass rod free, and pulled out 4-5 full shovelfuls of crap that fell out with it. Who knew how long that rod was? Wish I had been there for the start up this season to have made sure it was clean.
 
Curious, is this your first experience operating a wood burning appliance? Wish I was more familiar with Woodmaster design, might be easier to help out.
 
Well,

I swore to myself that I was done with this thread, but I can't help it.

The first question that you need to answer is: what is happening? The short answer here, as I read it, is that the supply temperature from your OWB is not constant, and occasionally falls below your desired setpoint.

By your statements, we can assume that the plumbing is in good order, all pumps and heat exchangers working properly, which leaves the boiler and its associated controls as the likely culprit. A boiler, or any other fire, works on a triangle: Fuel, air, and ignition. We'll assume that your fuel is correct, properly dried and energy-dense enough to provide adequate BTUs on combustion. We'll also assume ignition is good, because you have a fire burning. That leaves air.

If this is similar to others I have seen, this has a small centrifugal blower that is cycled on a call for heat from the controller. So, the first question, does it cycle? Change the setpoint and see if the blower kicks on. If it does, measure the amperage. Is it correct? If it is, let the fan run. Does the amperage change over time, indicating a bad winding that is heating up and then opening, causing intermittent fan failure during high demand? If it doesn't, does the fire get hotter when the fan runs? It should, it's being stoked. If it doesn't, and the amperage isn't high (>85% of FLA) is there a small damper on the side of your fan that you can open and get more air to the fan? If you move that inlet damper, does the fan amperage increase? If it doesn't, you may have a restriction in the discharge of your fan.

You have a choice to make. Either A)Start listening to the advice you've been given, combining it with observations you make yourself,B) Call in a professional, or C) Shut off the OWB, drain it, and admit you've been defeated by a kettle with a pump. I have to say, for a guy so desperate to get his boiler running, you sure don't listen to the advice you solicit.
 
Can yoy explain to me how I haven't been listening to peoples advice? I've done everything that people have suggested, including calling both the local own guy and woodmaster itself a call, neither of which had any real ideas. I haven't had time to pull the blower motor and clean it or been able to borrow the clamp on meter from work. Id really like to know why you seem to think you're so much smarter than me, and say that I don't listen. I've done everything I've been able to, and sought this forum out as a way to seek help, not to be berated.
 
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