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Best 2 stroke mix

Discussion in 'Arborist 101' started by husqy254xp, Jan 23, 2018.

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  1. husqy254xp

    husqy254xp ArboristSite Lurker

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    Hi guys, I have a couple of 254 XP's and a brand new 435 that I use for keeping the homefires burning and some occasional heavy duty farm use.

    I always used to mix oil as per the mixer bottle lines (50:1 I think) but read something a week or so ago that people are running higher a % of oil, I just wanted to hear what the pro's had to say about this. At my current use I reckon my saws will last me for eon's, so if a little more oil is good then I would be keen.

    Also, on the 435 - is there anything I can do to it to improve it without changing it too much - I don't want to run it harder than it should and risk killing it too early. From what I have read it is an entry level Husky saw and a decent saw - I like it but anything to watch for?
     
  2. Weber_Steaks

    Weber_Steaks ArboristSite Lurker

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    I bought a Husky 440 last fall and love it, i am not mixing anymore....i buy cans of True Fuel, its about $6.50 a can and that is enough for about 2 tank fulls....

    There are a lot of benefits to this #1 no more mixing gas /oil.
    #2 truefuel is PURE gas, and high octane.
    #3 Truefuel has NO engine killing Ethanol in it
    #4 it contains a fuel stabilizer, so its safe to keep gas in tank up to 6months...
    My saw starts easy, runs strong, no smoke and loves this fuel, for those that use their saw occasionally, i would definitely give it a try, comes in a steel can with screw on cap...( no gas cans leaking fuel vapors)

    Sent from my Galaxy S6 using Tapatalk
     
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  3. husqy254xp

    husqy254xp ArboristSite Lurker

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    Thanks for the reply but at £45 for 1 litre I think I will stay well clear of it! It appears it is not readily available here in the Britain. £43 will buy me 37 litres of petrol!

    We can buy ethanol free petrol in Britain (well you can around where I stay) so I don't need to worry much about that but I could see the benefit.
     
  4. Weber_Steaks

    Weber_Steaks ArboristSite Lurker

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    Hey, if you can buy Ethanol free fuel where you live, you are lucky and really do not need to buy the true fuel.....ethanol burns hotter and attracts water, thats why its bad on small gas engines, over time, ethanol based fuels will destroy rubber gaskets, seals etc and all sorts of issues over time, its a slow killer....

    As far as extra oil, i ran a craftsman saw with a richer oil to gas ratio for 4 years ( by accident) and it ran fine, just a little smoke at startup until it warmed up but i wouldnt go too far, maybe an extra tablespoon at most per gallon of gas on a 50:1 saw? At most, you may have some oil leak from carb

    Sent from my Galaxy S6 using Tapatalk
     
  5. ATH

    ATH Addicted to ArboristSite

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    I have been very happy with Amsoil Sabre...started using it after I read a lot of good things about it.

    I've also heard a lot of good things about Echo Red Armor and probably would have been using that all along, but can't find it locally, so I went with Sabre and haven't looked back.

    If you want to waste several working days worth of hours, just do a search for which 2 cycle oil in the chainsaw section below. It has been discussed, discussed, then more and more.
     
  6. Mustang71

    Mustang71 Addicted to ArboristSite

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    We just finished an oil discussion in the firewood forum and here we are again another one. I use echo oil. The one with the stabilizer in it since I don't cut every week or month. I run 40:1 in all my saws with no issue. I also run ethanol free gas. 50:1 is probably fine for all saws now a days but for the exta pennies I'll take the insurance of a little extra lubricant. I used to run 50:1 with whatever oil was cheap and 87 octane gas with out any issues. Therefore I feel my method now is much better and should be issue free.

    A saw in perfect condition with a sharp chain is fine with normal mix but what about those times when you have been cutting all day and the chain is getting dull and you are running the saw harder than you should. Cheap out on the oil and you will be doing a rebuild. Just my oppinion.
     
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  7. Ted Jenkins

    Ted Jenkins Firewood by TJ

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    My experience has always been that a small % of ethanol is a very good thing in pure gasoline. Nothing will destroy a motor quicker than pure gasoline under certain conditions. Those conditions could be in a moist environment as an example. One drop of water in a carb will shut it down and ruin a carburetor with corrosion and possibly cause the engine to seize from incorrect fuel ratio. With a 6 to 10 % ethanol in gas almost all motors will be well served with perfection reducing problems that are related to moisture. Ethanol in race conditions at high altitudes is hard to beat. The timing can be right on the very edge of detonation because it burns so cool. What oil that is used is also a big factor. I have never liked full on synthetic, but many like it very much. So a consistent balance of of good oil with the proper ratio and adjustments will make a saw last longer than most could imagine. The ratio of oil and fuel with the right ratio of fuel mixture is a big big factor in how hot or cool the saw runs. From my pro days ethanol always came in at 110 octane which proved very useful. Saws in general are low low performing engines that can take a wide range of abuses and keep on running. When I go cutting I often cut for a few weeks at at time and my built in clock often is a six gallon jug in that when my jug is empty then it is time to pack up and go home. For those who like ketchup on their hamburgers, Ok if a little ketchup is good then how about a whole bottle. No the idea is a good balance of good oil good adjustments good ratios good fresh gas and good wood to cut. Thanks
     
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  8. Little Al

    Little Al Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Why when you buy gas in litres the same as we do where I live do you mess with tablespoon's of oil if you have one of the graduated oil measure in the cap of your mix oil marked in milli litres (ML ) 20 ,25, or 31.25 Ml's of oil per litre of Gas with give you 50 ,40 ,or 32/1 mix ratio
     
  9. Benjamin S Pendleton

    Benjamin S Pendleton ArboristSite Lurker

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    Amsoil sabre oil mixed 100:1. Been running it in my saws for over a year even in the 120 heat of the summer with no problems. It's cheap with no smoke and the saws run better.
     
  10. Little Al

    Little Al Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Be aware that despite their advertising " BLURB" if your saw has problems oil related they will NOT aid you any way financially
     
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  11. Benjamin S Pendleton

    Benjamin S Pendleton ArboristSite Lurker

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    I did have a bg86 blower replaced under warranty due too a bad crank bearing and I was running 110 octane leaded racing fuel at 100:1. However I don't give a crap about the warranty as my stihl saws never give me problems. I usually buy slightly used at a fraction of the cost and run them until they fall apart.
     
  12. husqy254xp

    husqy254xp ArboristSite Lurker

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    Thanks for all the information. I will go into my local Husqvarna shop and see what they have on offer. I will look out for some of the above products.
     
  13. ATH

    ATH Addicted to ArboristSite

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    I stick with 50:1 even when using Sabre. It is not that much extra money for the protection.
     
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  14. Duce

    Duce Addicted to ArboristSite

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    There is always someone running 100:1 in these threads. Like you, will pass on that. I know a Amsoil dealer, owns trucking and logging business, and it makes him shake his head.
     
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  15. Mustang71

    Mustang71 Addicted to ArboristSite

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    I must be slow... either I missed it or no one ever answered the question of what's the benefit of 100:1 over manufacturer recommendation. Idc how good it is and what the company said you can run your saw at. How does it benefit you and how does 40:1 or 50:1 hurt your saw?

    I don't think it was ever answered because there's no logical answer.
     
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  16. Benjamin S Pendleton

    Benjamin S Pendleton ArboristSite Lurker

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    I would never recommend running 100:1 with any oil other than amsoil. They tested their oils to exceed all manufactures minimum lubricicity at that ratio. That being said using less oil means lower costs and no smoke when running. I have seen first hand 2 stroke motors siezing up with to little oil. However I have never had any problems with amsoil 100:1 even in the 120 degrees of summer I have here in the sw.
     
  17. Little Al

    Little Al Addicted to ArboristSite

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    It's a known fact that a more oil to fuel ratio within reason tuned correctly will make more power& increase the life span of the kit the Us & their emissions legislation was a lot to do with the minute oil amounts to qualify on the EPA rules this suited saw makers as the needed repair or replacement sooner = more sales There are the 100/1 believers & the the other end of the scale & it will never be resolved the only fact I can state is that running 2 smoke motors in a good few forms for the last 57 years at ratio's no further north than 35/1 I have never had an engine with oil related problem so each to his/her own belief but I'll stick to the low /mid 30's/1 fuel oil mix
     
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  18. husqy254xp

    husqy254xp ArboristSite Lurker

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    I might not be an expert on small 2 stroke engines but what I am proficient in, due to the nature of my engineering business is machines, engines (big engines), lubricity, metallurgy, understanding how materials act and react together.

    What I would say is that generally I would follow the 2 stroke mix ratio given by the manufacturer on any 2 stoke engine, if I were to ignore these recommendations it would be to increase the oil slightly. The oil is a total loss lubricant and by reducing the volume in the fuel you are generally going to reduce the ability for the oil to coat and protect the bearings, cylinder etc. The biggest issue with a reduced volume of oil is the ability to coat all the necessary parts in a film thick enough to offer adequate lubrication.

    We are sold a lot of snake oil additives and things these days and the jury is still out on their ability to make a marked difference, hopefully for the better, on wear and tear of engines and gearboxes and diffs etc. But I don't think any of us would condone the use of less engine oil in our car engine or gearbox, but use a good additive to make up for that.

    If someone offered to me for sale a saw that I knew had been run on less oil than recommended I would walk away from it.
     
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  19. Benjamin S Pendleton

    Benjamin S Pendleton ArboristSite Lurker

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    I will say this, amsoil has had sabre oil on the market for a very long time. They have not removed it from the market after all that time because they did such extensive testing to make sure their product was going to provide adiquite lubrication even at such lean mixtures. All I have to go on for myself is that I have been using this 100:1 mixture in my saws blowers hedgers running both premium and 110 octane fuel in the dead of summer with temperatures even exceeding 120 degrees Fahrenheit and have not had any issues. I have pulled apart saws and found no abnormal wear. My saws run better and it costs me less money. I will never go back to conventional oil at this point.
     
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  20. ATH

    ATH Addicted to ArboristSite

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    While I do run 50:1, Amsoil really doesn't have much motivation to "lie" about 100:1 being an effective ratio.
    *It is not much more than anything else on the market, so it is not more expensive at 50:1 than other brands.
    *They are selling less oil when people use 100:1 instead of 50:1.
    *They will quickly develop a bad reputation if small engines running their oil start seizing up...so I can't imagine they would label it for that if they weren't confident it works based on having torn apart engines for comparative testing.
     
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