Firewood Volume (Again)

[Woodcutteranon]

Hello Everyone...

I recall a thread about 7 years ago where a member conducted a test on how much space the same logs... rounds vs split occupy stacked in cords.

I have a dump trailer with side boards and I have a mark where four rows of 16" wood, neatly stacked, equal 1 cord.

My question is...if I neatly stack that amount in un-split rounds in my trailer, will that same wood split occupy the exact same foot print in my trailer? Or will the split wood occupy more or less space?

I know someone has first hand knowledge about this. Your answers would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance
WCA

 

[Leeroy]

Pretty sure you want to have 140 sq feet in rounds to equal 128 in split wood.

 

[dave_dj1]

The simplest way to know is take two sheets of plywood (4x8) and hold them 4' apart, stack with wood in nice neat rows, then pull the plywood sides up off letting the wood fall freely to the floor of the dump trailer. Note how the pile is and duplicate for future loads.

 

[Beetlejuice]

The simplest way to know is take two sheets of plywood (4x8) and hold them 4' apart, stack with wood in nice neat rows, then pull the plywood sides up off letting the wood fall freely to the floor of the dump trailer. Note how the pile is and duplicate for future loads.

Pardon the pun, but that is thinking outside the box.. Never crossed my mind to do something like that, but then again my trailer is 120 cubic feet, I neatly stack and put about a 20 cubic foot hump on it. Customer buys or rejects before ever gets dumped. No muss, no fuss

 

[chucker]

 

[sb47]

The simplest way to know is take two sheets of plywood (4x8) and hold them 4' apart, stack with wood in nice neat rows, then pull the plywood sides up off letting the wood fall freely to the floor of the dump trailer. Note how the pile is and duplicate for future loads.

Thats not a true measure of wood randomly thrown in a pile or in a trailer. Stacking then letting the pile collapse is not the same as thrown in randomly.
The difference between rounds and split wood is the amount of air gaps you end up with when stacked. Small rounds vs large rounds may have different air to wood ratio. Dry wood vs green wood may vary. I know I can stack a row of green splits 4 feet tall and it will shrink about 6 inches or more in height by the time it gets seasoned. It all depends on air to wood ratio. In my experience a row of rounds stacked in between two equally spaced t post 4 feet tall when split it equals about the same.
Try stacking your rounds in between some t post spaced (say 8 feet) or about a 1/2 cord. (if splits are 24") (4' x8' x24''=1/2 cord. Split then re stack in the same spot and let us know your results.

 

[turnkey4099]

Pretty sure you want to have 140 sq feet in rounds to equal 128 in split wood.

The other way around. A given pile of rounds will produce a larger pile of splits. Rule of thumb - the pile will grow by around 10%.

 

[sb47]

The other way around. A given pile of rounds will produce a larger pile of splits. Rule of thumb - the pile will grow by around 10%.

I agree, it expands because your creating more air space. Rounds have no air space, except between the rounds, splits have more air space.

 

[Beetlejuice]

The other way around. A given pile of rounds will produce a larger pile of splits. Rule of thumb - the pile will grow by around 10%.

I think this discussion hinges on dry v green.. And I do agree on air gaps and neat stacking. But if a person sells a cord , I'm a firm believer in over supply. Especially when there's a bunch of wood in the yard and saves a whole lot of time just to overfill the wood bin.. They're happy, y'all ain't out nothing but some wood, ya have a customer for next year, and no argument.

 

[Haywire Haywood]

I read someplace that a thrown cord is 180cu ft.

 

[JeffHK454]

I read someplace that a thrown cord is 180cu ft.

That's the figure I've heard also...and your sig. line makes me laugh!

 

[Haywire Haywood]

I've got the sigs turned off... I better have a look. It's been a day or three. LOL

 

[chucker]

I read someplace that a thrown cord is 180cu ft.

16" = 160 cubic feet(12.5%) and 24" = 180(14%) cubic feet , thrown in not stacked....

 

[rarefish383]

I've had the opposite with an actual test. Almost all of my wood is in the 24" to 30" range so maybe my air gaps are bigger on my rounds. I stack the rounds on the trailer just like I stack the splits. I have to load the rounds above the side boards. Then when I stack the splits back on the trailer, the load is below the side boards. All of my wood is measured to 18", and my side boards are made to be exactly 128 CF, and I still round it off a little, like a bakers dozen. But, I only sell wood to friends.

 

[Woodcutteranon]

The other way around. A given pile of rounds will produce a larger pile of splits. Rule of thumb - the pile will grow by around 10%.

I have never tested this myself but I tend to agree with you. It seems split wood would stack less efficient than round logs...therefore would take a larger footprint then when it was unsplit.

For this question, I would like to remove the seasoned vs unseasoned variable. Let's just say the rounds and splits were the same mc.

 

[rarefish383]

If you have 8-10 inch rounds you are not going to have much air space between them, if you have 24 to 30 inch rounds, you are going to have big air gaps, so size of round makes a big difference.

 

[sb47]

If you have 8-10 inch rounds you are not going to have much air space between them, if you have 24 to 30 inch rounds, you are going to have big air gaps, so size of round makes a big difference.

True, but big rounds are solid wood. It would be interesting to know if big vs small rounds have more air gaps on average.

 

[sb47]

Here is a photo of some coins on a 3x5 card.
14 quarters on one and 26 dimes on the other.
Both cover almost the exact same space on the card.
The air gaps are smaller on the small rounds but there are more of them.
I'm gonna say there almost equal in air ratio.

 

[Ted Jenkins]

Thats not a true measure of wood randomly thrown in a pile or in a trailer. Stacking then letting the pile collapse is not the same as thrown in randomly.
The difference between rounds and split wood is the amount of air gaps you end up with when stacked. Small rounds vs large rounds may have different air to wood ratio. Dry wood vs green wood may vary. I know I can stack a row of green splits 4 feet tall and it will shrink about 6 inches or more in height by the time it gets seasoned. It all depends on air to wood ratio. In my experience a row of rounds stacked in between two equally spaced t post 4 feet tall when split it equals about the same.
Try stacking your rounds in between some t post spaced (say 8 feet) or about a 1/2 cord. (if splits are 24") (4' x8' x24''=1/2 cord. Split then re stack in the same spot and let us know your results.

SB is correct on many issues here. I have hard core proof as to exactly what I am saying here, but I am not going to make a production out of the argument right now. My digital camera is an older model that is a bit clumsy so when I update it I will be more interested in the documentation. My measurements are based upon 18'' cuts with varied diameter wood. It takes about 2 1/2 pickup loads of wood randomly thrown into the pickup to make one nicely stacked pick up load. For stove wood that is small the ratios change dramatically. For wood that is a longer cut also changes the ratio. If a pickup or trailer has rounds stacked into it that ratio will range from 10 to 40%. In other words if my F 250 is maxed out with rounds which measures about 1 1/2 cords then it will most of the time produce about 2 full cords of average split wood. It is easy to understand if you think about 24 to 36'' diam rounds stacked into a truck with smaller rounds pushed into the void spaces. The load of wood is almost solid wood with no air space. Once the wood is split there is now a great amount of air space which is why the load grows somewhat after it is split. Yes after thousands of loads of wood thrown into a truck and then having to stack it so as not to make a second or third trip is not that fun. Thanks

 

[Beetlejuice]

SB is correct on many issues here. I have hard core proof as to exactly what I am saying here, but I am not going to make a production out of the argument right now. My digital camera is an older model that is a bit clumsy so when I update it I will be more interested in the documentation. My measurements are based upon 18'' cuts with varied diameter wood. It takes about 2 1/2 pickup loads of wood randomly thrown into the pickup to make one nicely stacked pick up load. For stove wood that is small the ratios change dramatically. For wood that is a longer cut also changes the ratio. If a pickup or trailer has rounds stacked into it that ratio will range from 10 to 40%. In other words if my F 250 is maxed out with rounds which measures about 1 1/2 cords then it will most of the time produce about 2 full cords of average split wood. It is easy to understand if you think about 24 to 36'' diam rounds stacked into a truck with smaller rounds pushed into the void spaces. The load of wood is almost solid wood with no air space. Once the wood is split there is now a great amount of air space which is why the load grows somewhat after it is split. Yes after thousands of loads of wood thrown into a truck and then having to stack it so as not to make a second or third trip is not that fun. Thanks

That's the best splaining I've read. Kinda like digging a hole in the wrong spot and boss says fill it in. The next question will be what do I do with the excess material?