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New Project:MS460. Any tips for me?

Discussion in 'Chainsaw' started by Overkill338, Aug 10, 2018.

  1. Overkill338

    Overkill338 Bars Of Stihl

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    I got this from a friend for $60 shipped. He got it to use the cylinder for a 440/460 hybrid. I've already found another oem jug in great shape, and Hyway has given me a 460 big bore which would give me 82cc.

    I havent decided whether to try it as a big bore, or clean up the ports on the oem and use a popup piston. That's where I'd like some advice from you ole pros.

    I'm going to try to make it look as new as possible. Basically I have the 25" bar and I'm building a saw for my bar haha I want something to run a 25" like my 241 handles a 16".

    I of course will be needing some parts if you have any tips about that too. Like do they still sell the badge for the starter cover? Can I get a factory dual port muffler? Are the Huztl tanks worth trying?

    Thanks in advance, I'm looking forward to getting this moving.

    IMG956240.jpg IMG956238.jpg IMG956241.jpg IMG956243.jpg
     
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  2. kenton.a.frank

    kenton.a.frank ArboristSite Operative

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    That is the least amount of a starting point I’ve ever seen! Do oem pop up with an 8 pin rim drive. It will spin that 25 like a rabid beaver


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  3. jltrent

    jltrent ArboristSite Operative

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    One tip and one I have to watch on old saws is don't put more money in it than it is worth. I refurbished a MS460 that needed a tank/rear handle (put OEM on), topend was 170 compression and several other smaller items and got the saw on a trade cheap. In the end I almost had in it what it was worth with free labor. These old saws are a money pit and sometimes it is best to part out.
     
  4. lightj12

    lightj12 ArboristSite Operative

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    I did the same thing. OEM small parts are expensive; by the time I changed all the parts out that felt were needed it came close to costing me the price of a new saw. If I were to do it over, get a parts saw or scavenge for used parts. Use oem rubber, seals, etc.
     
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  5. MontanaResident

    MontanaResident Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Or skip the OEM. Quality from China is at 1/3 or less. IMO, much of what comes from China is made for OEM, but accidently gets left on the dock, or accidently is an unreported production overrun. YMMV.
     
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  6. cuinrearview

    cuinrearview Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Please disregard this statement OP, not everyone gets his sense of humor. Lots of other good advice here though. With what you're starting with it will be very easy to get way upside down on this one if you're impatient. Personally I would shelve it and collect OEM parts when you can, keeping the cost down. Chinese parts are cheaper, but decrease drastically the value of the finished product should you decide to move on from it down the road. And if it's going to stay in your stable why not do it right?
     
  7. Overkill338

    Overkill338 Bars Of Stihl

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    I do plan to keep it, and I'm doing like you said. One piece at a time when I find them. I've got a friend that does nothing but deal in used saw parts. My Stihl tech Instructor is hooking me up with an OEM cylinder. Then, as I mentioned, Hyway has already sent me a 54mm piston and cylinder for it.

    Was @kenton.a.frank serious? It will run a 25 with a 8 pin?

    Also, it's the starting point I wanted. I was going to start with a Huztl case and build slow. Surely this is better right?
     
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  8. MontanaResident

    MontanaResident Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Sounds like this project might take years, friend or not. Better have a dealer dump bin without a lock on it close by, or years might become a decade or more.

    Try some aftermarket items. Despite the overwhelming prejudice against, they might surprise you or greatly exceed the old used junky OEM you might get free or cheap. It is that or buy a new saw, take it apart, and put it back together to get the satisfaction of 'building' an OEM saw that doesn't cost more then a new saw.

     
  9. kenton.a.frank

    kenton.a.frank ArboristSite Operative

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    It will run 25 with 8 pin if you keep your chain sharp and our oiler turned all the way up. I’ve seen tanks and most non “moving” parts aftermarket seem ok. Yes the plastic is not as durable but you can get a new tank for $30 aftermarket with most of the smalls already on it when a oem used tank may cost you $100 or more. If I’m making a saw for myself and it not being a “all OEM” shelf queen... I’m ok with aftermarket as long as it does not move.


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  10. Ryan'smilling

    Ryan'smilling Addicted to ArboristSite

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    A stock 460 with an 8 pin isn't my idea of a good time. I tried it for a few hours with a 20" bar. I'd rather drop the rakers a touch and still have nice useable torque with a 7 pin.
     
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  11. JonCraig

    JonCraig Addicted to ArboristSite

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    I’d mod the oiler for a 25”.

    On my “keeper” 046, I used aftermarket A/V buffers—they’ve been great so far. And AM chain tensioner. People have mixed results with those, but the one I got had instructions for a kind of “break-in” procedure before use. I believe I used AM brake band and flag. Meteor piston w/ Caber ring is as good as OEM in my opinion.

    But for bearings, case gasket, decomp, fuel lines, carb kit, OEM isn’t that expensive.

    If it were mine, I’d look for a parts saw (unless you really are as patient as you say you are) for the muffler, clutch, and brake stuff. Those will be $100+ buying them a piece at a time just on their own.

    Mine is a “good port timing numbers” early D-jug with the “better” coil. Pulls a 25” through hard red oak or cherry without breaking a sweat.

    I gave my father in law a rebuilt 460 w/ 36” bar as a stumper. You have to baby it just a little, and even the high-output oiler just barely puts out enough, but it certainly still gets the job done.
     
  12. dmb2613

    dmb2613 ArboristSite Guru

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    you can drop a ton of cash in that. look for another saw
     
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  13. cuinrearview

    cuinrearview Addicted to ArboristSite

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    This notion that using OEM parts takes for ever or costs a fortune is hogwash. There are members on this site that stash parts but will help other members out. Most of the OEM mechanical parts are fairly reasonable in price. The real cost can be felt when you start worrying about form instead of function. Pretty plastics are pricey if using OEM, but for me when I speak of "all OEM" I mean mechanics. I keep beating this dead horse, but i recently built an all OEM mechanically 372XP for nothing, buying and selling a parts lot. Oh, wait... It does have a meteor piston and cabers, but I don't think anyone with any experience feels they're inferior. Pounding the pavement pays off when re-building. Cheap aftermarket is the lazy way out, but in the long haul it's probably not the easiest and least expensive...
     
  14. MontanaResident

    MontanaResident Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Is a circlip mechanical? Crank Bearings a pretty much, if they fit they work, even bought at Auto Zone, are they mechanical? Since most things, mechanical too, are made in China anymore, how does being stamped or marked Stihl ensure they are not from China, and are of the highest quality? You do know that excellent quality is made in China, and used in TVs, Automobiles, medical equipment, etc.

    Dismissing all things not Stihl OEM, as junk, in favor of spending 3 or 4 times, and in this case on a junk starting point is very curious.

    Hogwash??? :)

     
  15. cuinrearview

    cuinrearview Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Circlips are mechanical. All bearings are NOT created equal. You can't buy chainsaw bearings at the 'Zone. Unless that case is cracked, broken, or the bearings have spun it isn't "junk". You're swerving way out of your lane here sir, but if you have any other questions about saws please continue...
     
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  16. Overkill338

    Overkill338 Bars Of Stihl

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    So far I got the case and plastics for $60 shipped. Got an oem jug for free. The bearings are good in it. This saw was built 5/12/2006.

    This saw will be cutting for less than $200. I have friends, business connections and a sponser.
     
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  17. MontanaResident

    MontanaResident Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Define mechanical then. As pertaining to chainsaws.

    And the mechanical circlips, how do you tell if they are OEM, or junky China made?

     
  18. kenton.a.frank

    kenton.a.frank ArboristSite Operative

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    When you speak of crank bearings, they clearly say Japan on them. I’ll take Japanese bearings over aftermarket China any day.


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  19. kenton.a.frank

    kenton.a.frank ArboristSite Operative

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    In my experience circlips it is more of the style vs the quality. Most will retain but the concern comes in with the “easy install” clips that have the end that curves into the void.

    Maybe 28 with 8 pin might be a much for the oiler, however the 460 I had I put that set up with a TSB 28 and 3/8 .050 chisel chain and it didn’t seem to mind. However I never really got a chance to bury it in 28in or red oak all day.


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  20. Hdtoolmkr765

    Hdtoolmkr765 Contra Hoarder

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    I wouldn't put any Chinese aftermarket parts in any saw. Anyone that tells you they are equal quality of OEM are simply mistaken. Some people's minds can't seem to understand that manufactured in China to OEM specs, under OEM quality standards, OEM specified manufacturing processes, engineered in Germany or US is totally different than a Chinese company that steals technology, manufactures product with the cheapest material, little to no quality control, and no proprietary engineering, they are two entirely different things. You can explain it to people, but some people just don't get it. Chinese aftermarket parts for the large majority are junk.
     

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