Oak Wilt and tree trimming

[Kneejerk Bombas]

Seems awfully naive to believe wilt is vectored ONLY by one certain beetle family, Nitidulidae @ one small window of seasonal opportunity. Logic dictates that window is much larger and the possible vector sp. much broader. Anytime insects smack into your windshield susceptible trees are in danger.

I think it's the presence of the fungal pressure pads that is the limiting factor. You need those spores. Once the bark gets loose, the pads dry up, they become less attractive to insects.

 

[TheJollyLogger]

I see what you mean about the house and its proximity to the tree. Open grown trees don't get too tall, but did you notice the diameter of the tree? Do Oaks grow that fast in Texas? Based on Oaks I've cut, I've not seen trees that size (30"DBH?) less than 80 or 100 years old.

It's possible the tree was there when they built the house and they used extrodinary care to preserve it during construction because it was located so perfectly to frame and shade the house. Perhaps it was a healthy small to medium sized 30 or 40 year old tree at the time. I've seen 4 to 6 inch diameter trees 30 or 40 years old.

We definitely have a longer growing season and faster growth rates, but I've learned not to use trunk diameter as a reliable age estimator, especially in residential areas. There are just too many variables, sprinklers fertilization practices, competition or lack thereof. I saw a great example of this east of Houston. Two customers of mine built their homes the same year about 35 years ago. One had an arborist come out and select about 30 or so prime oak specimens and cleared the rest of his 5 acres. His neighbor just cleared enough for the house and drive. The differences in the trees was amazing. The trees on the first property were almost all 40+ " dbh, 60-70 ', straight and symmetrical. The second house probably averaged 20" dbh, and not nearly as tall. Driving up you never would have guessed that all the trees were the same approximate age. Jeff

 

[Ed Roland]

July 1 (or at the latest July 15) is the real "safe day" because that is what the research has found. Anything else, is winging it.

It is not "winging it" to understand the April - July recommendation refers to the fact vectoring beetle populations are highest during this period. Don't you reckon the fungal spore mats might be active before April and beyond July? How is it that NO other insect could possibly vector oak wilt?

:msp_confused:

Is there any research to indicate anything contrary to what every State's Extension and DNR (in addition to USFS) publishes?

From the extension research links you posted: "insects" (plural) and "susceptible all growing season" and "avoid wounding the trees throughout the growing season".

 

[unclecrash]

Im sorry im with the rest of the guy's who said don't touch it . I watched the guy across the street kill his oak and it was late july augest when he cut. The friend down the street I cut the old ladies lawn,I told her donot let the guy your husband know's cut the low limb on the oak on her property line that it may kill it and sure enough it took out half the tree. Now she is out every day having to pick up dead wood. my friend cuts for a living his Dad was Head of the county tree cutting for 40 years and Im going to take his and his late father's knowledege as they and 3 other companies who all said not to cut on it til the freeze and it has kept my tree alive. I took out a bunch of suckers which you could touch from the ground with my long weed whip pruner and it has come back from 2 years ago or is it three maybe more I will check the other thread with the pic's in it. And can tell when it was in decline.

 

[unclecrash]

Both you and the utility have rights here that need to be respected. As ATH states, it is most commonly agreed upon that we are past the critical stage for insect vectoring of Oak Wilt. The utility likely has a written easement, which gives them right to trim (or remove) the tree, whenever they see fit. If they can, they might delay the trimming to suit your desires; or they might not. Your best bet is to be courteous and polite, ask them to take as little as possible, and to sanitize their equipment before starting.

I probably deal with this exact issue a half dozen times a year...If I can, I will make concessions to make the homeowner happy. They are customers, after all. I have never gave up on a tree that needed to be trimmed, and we've trimmed them all. Sometimes we have to get the police involved.

Please remember that the utility has the right, and the responsibility, to keep the power lines clear of vegetation.

PS, you're not helping your cause by giving phony information and being a general A-hole.

Get your fact's straight i NEVER GAVE ANYONE PHONY INFO. I gave the dumb $#%^ what he asked for owner's name and phone #A hole. It is not my job to lead him to the door to get my father's signature or # Like I said I think his little paper that he brought mean's diddly squat when they do not do it through proper channels. And two I was not rude to the tree cutter. So further more you think any of these local companies give a damn about making or trying to make it look good not the just cut straight up and that is it. They are not going to sanitize there stuff and go out of there way. They sure are not going to seal the wounds, not a chance or they would have done the oak's across the street. I have seen a lot of crew's at work first hand and Im not too impressed with what I have seen. Split limbs on the one down by the lady's house I cut. Limb's in the house next door not picked up which I put back on the other property which the fell from. And I hate to say it the Company that is cutting is a very large well known company. And Im sure glad you are not trying to cut my tree's cause you likely would have had a big problem

 

[unclecrash]

It is not "winging it" to understand the April - July recommendation refers to the fact vectoring beetle populations are highest during this period. Don't you reckon the fungal spore mats might be active before April and beyond July? How is it that NO other insect could possibly vector oak wilt?

:msp_confused:



From the extension research links you posted: "insects" (plural) and "susceptible all growing season" and "avoid wounding the trees throughout the growing season".

There just playing a guessing game with the bug's and mold spore's. just like they want to do with the tree. Well it might be alright but if it die's oh well you have to foot the bill to cut it down. I will take the gamble on not cutting it.

 

[unclecrash]

Look at the house and the overall location. That house has either a garden level or walk out basement, so with a six to eight foot overdig they are within 5-6 feet of the stump. The house is a classic 60's style tract home. The tree is around 50-60' tall, with a growth pattern that suggests it never had any competition from other trees. So based on location and growth pattern, I sure can't say it predates the house. And that is not a hundred year old house. Jeff

I think I can find out when the little old lady I mow her yard get's home. Her sub was built I believe before my section of sub. She is 92 and I think moved in in the 60's and might remember how big the tree was then. I can tell you in 78 the tree was almost as big in trunk size but the canopy just gets bigger and bigger. I believe the lot is 120ft across the front. And the canopy is middle of the drive and is over the next house in pic. The house is on the highest ground around here my yard falls off to the swampy lands, no walk out. When we moved in in 78 the swamp was all cedar it has all died and turned over to maple and oak mostly.

 

[unclecrash]

That tree is a lot bigger than some of you think, the picture doe's not do it justice. The trunk at 4ft up is 11-1/2 feet around.

 

[ddhlakebound]

I will get a picture of her she is looking alot fuller than in the picture in the link. I think she was putting her energy into all the new growth in the middle of the tree.She is getting fruit for the first time since I lived here in 35 + years. She has had a few random acorns on her before but this year with the humidity and all the rain I looked up and seen more acorn than ever. I bet the deer used to lay under her and gourge in the day, before the sub was established. I know of another big one about her size that they just punched roads through and was just driving around and saw 9 deer just grazing and laying under it feeding. Well I don't know the age for sure but it really does not matter as she is a beautiful old oak and that is what sold my mother and Father on the land and house. I know there are a few other real big one's a round this area which they recognized as being the biggest in the area and historic. Thank's Dave

This post, in combination with the earlier pic, has me thinking your Oak may have more problems than you realize. Heavy mast production from a declining tree is often representative of a last ditch effort to carry on the species. IE, putting all the available energy into seed production, rather than root, foliage, or dynamic storage growth.

Fertilizing it was probably not the right thing to do, as the reasons that the tree was declining were not addressed, and a dose of NPK ferts forces foliar growth which makes you feel better about it's appearance, but does not give the tree what it really needs. (balance between the roots and shoots, and growing conditions which will allow it to revitalize itself.)

 

[unclecrash]

Well what are you going to do when you do not have thousand's of dollar's to throw at a tree, you going to do the best you can with lot's of water and a mild fertilizer even if like you say is true. Im tending to lean toward's it wasn't doing good because the last few year's have been hot and dry. I have been watering as much as I can. And if you say is true and I know the tree is putting all it's energy towards fruit which would give me the sense that the companies should not even cut on oak's this time of year for that reason alone. It don't need anymore stress by having to heal and make fruit.

 

[ddhlakebound]

Well what are you going to do when you do not have thousand's of dollar's to throw at a tree, you going to do the best you can with lot's of water and a mild fertilizer even if like you say is true. Im tending to lean toward's it wasn't doing good because the last few year's have been hot and dry. I have been watering as much as I can. And if you say is true and I know the tree is putting all it's energy towards fruit which would give me the sense that the companies should not even cut on oak's this time of year for that reason alone. It don't need anymore stress by having to heal and make fruit.

Mulch the root zone, remove competing turf in as much of the crz as you're willing, core aeration and refill w/ compost, mycorrhizal fungi treatment. None are difficult or expensive, and all will benefit the tree. Have not seen the base, so mulch and no turf may already be done.

I'm in agreement on no trimming now. Looks close enough to the wires that it'll be getting trimmed one way or another at some point.

These pics do look quite a lot better than the previous one.

 

[unclecrash]

To mulch the root zone would be my whole front yard. LOL I think I could remove some grass around the trunk and mulch there. Any preference which kind of mulch to use. And how do you do core aeration what size drill and depth,and how far apart do you grid the hole's, assuming you fill it with the mulch again. Thank's Dave

 

[unclecrash]

That pic of tree in decline was may 25 2011 at end of year I took off three or four huge limbs. it came back a bit in 2012 with just your basic fertilizer for the lawn spring and mid summer. I then prunned a lot off the lower hanging limbs winter of 2012. Gave it a fert in spring 2013 and first time she got any amount of fruit since I have lived hear in 1978. I few years she had very very few acorns I could count them on my hands and toe's No joke. This year I see a lot more fruit. Will see this fall when they drop unless the squirrels get them first. Here is what I don't get I have watched them cut the line's for years now for some reason this is the first time they did NOT clear the bottom line for cable. Has me wondering because they have alway's took care of it around here.

 

[TheJollyLogger]

http://www.arboristsite.com/attachments/homeowner-helper-forum/310745d1377129737-photo119-jpg

Based on this pic, I would have let the line clearance guys make the three cuts to 2" minus branches they needed to clear the lines, and gotten on with my life. After all, since it's "300" years old, I'm sure it's been through worse... Jeff

 

[stltreedr]

I don't think the pic from page one is even the same tree as the pics from page 2. Page one sets on the left corner of a 2 story house, page 2 looks like it is on the right side of a ranch house.

 

[stltreedr]

I just looked again and I'm 100% sure these aren't the same trees. The last post on page 2 has a picture of the "revived" tree, after fertilizing under drought stress. It shows a car to the left of the house... precicely where there is a ton of landscaping and another house in the "declining" tree pic from page 1.

If I had to guess, I would say that the tree from page 1 is firewood now. Am I missing something???

 

[TheJollyLogger]

I think maybe he shot that pic from his house, and your seeing the house across the street. I don't know, with his attitude I'm over it. Jeff

 

[unclecrash]

Geez now Im a liar or you guys are stoned. The pic's are both the same tree the bad one with the glare is standing at the top of my driveway looking up through the canopy towards the house on the left in first pic. The second is from down at the bottom of driveway at the powerline's looking up at the canopy. My tree isthe first one that doe's not go over the line's the tree that appeears to go over the line's is the house on the left again. My tree none touches the line's lower portion is about 4ft away no way any of the little limbs could hurt the line. You would need a tornado to rip it off and heave it over to them to take it down. Or the tree to fall and then there would be a mess.

 

[unclecrash]

Here are a few more. In first pic you can see where they scalped the side of his maple, I would be more concerned about that big top heavy lead hanging over the top of the line's then my 1/4inch limb's that are between 3 to 5 feet away on the lower one's and the upper one which is about 10 feet above the line and just making it to the line and all small stuff with no weight to them.

 

[Houston Tree]

I think that Tree Trimming of large oak trees will not make them wilt regardless of the time of year. I have done major trimming during all times of the year. A healthy tree appreciates the trimming. Especially when you thin out the crown of all dead wood and sucker limbs. You may want to seal the large branches that are trimmed to keep bugs and fungus out. You can spend extra money on tree sealer or you can just grab a paint of leftover paint from the garage and paint the cuts. Some of the more important things to me is to make clean cuts without tares. I like to use black paint wen requested to seal the tree. I think it looks the nicest. Look around to all the neighbors, do they have trees being affected by fungus or bugs? it doesn't mean that if you don't see it happening to other trees it won't happen to yours. Also, most electric company contracted tree trimming companies dont care about doing whats best for the tree. You are not the customer they are trying to keep happy. All trees have something very important to keep close attention to when trimming off limbs. Where the limb is attached to the tree there is tissue that does not need to be harmed. Cutting through the tissue is the best and easiest way to hurt a tree. Look at the limb where it connects to the tree. You will notice a roundish area right where it connects. That is the tissue. It is best to cut the limb after the tissue and allow the tissue to stay connected to the tree. This is the best way to trim without hurting the tree. Regardless of the time of year. Also I like to water a tree really good after I trim. We are mainly performing so the only experience I have is down in the hot south. All trees need water. Especially in the summer. There are numerous ways to water trees but the most important way not to water is putting the water directly close to the trunk. The best in my opinion is to drive a metal pipe deep in the ground about half way between the trunk and the edge of the crown, and then shove a water hose in the hole and put the water on super trickle. drip, drip, drip. Also tree fertilizer spread on the ground and watered in is also very good after a major trimming. I like to feed my trees. Food and water, it helps fight off all kinds of threats.

Hope my two cents helps. I'm new to this site but I have a lot of knowledge I want to share and I hope I can learn a thing or two here also. Good luck with those tree scalpers. They can be ruthless at times. Your smart be standing you ground and telling them they aren't trimming them.