Pricing for Danger/Risk

[lsylvain]

Hey folks. I haven't posted on here in a decade or more I'm sure. I'm down here is FL and do a lot of palm trimming. My question is this.

How are you pricing for the increased risk of one job vs another job that may take the same amount of time to complete. i.e. for my example, would be the height of a palm. Basically it takes me 1/2 hour to trim up a single palm regardless of height, until they get above the 40' mark. A 20' tree has less danger factor, you can see the whole trunk and look for problems and so on. A 40' tree you have more stem to worry about, you can't tell for sure if the stem has decay, you get above the canopy of other trees and wind becomes an issue, and so on.

Just wondering how other people put a dollar amount on danger.

 

[EchoRomeoCharlie]

I am not a professional climber. I do it on the side. But, here's my answer:

Yes, I price my jobs based on a multitude of factors and risk is definitely one of them.

 

[Ted Jenkins]

I do not do much climbing for a number of reasons. At the moment there is no money in climbing and it is easy to hire climbing people. I do not need to bring trees down because there is an abundance of wood already down. Pricing however is a big deal and should not be overlooked. It will make or brake many arbor related businesses. More difficult more dollars pretty simple. The whole point of being in business is dollars. Any reason to get more dollars then more dollars. No one can buy nice saws, new trucks, pay climbers, get good groundies with out it. Any excuse to get more dollars then get them. Thanks

 

[BC WetCoast]

More time more money. Higher risk trees usually take more time

 

[GilksTreeFelling]

Definitely increased price for higher risk. Percentage of increase is determined by risk, ie is their alot of targets, is the tree sketchy, is it wet and or freezing, is the home owner on the ground trying to tell me what I should be doing, did the home owner already try and fail taking it down, am I fixing/finishing what a hack or other unqualified person screwed up etc

 

[lsylvain]

I'm asking more about how people calculate the price increase, not if they charge more. I'm also not really referring to the risk of property damage so much as personal safety and balls. Think of it this way, you are trimming two identical trees, same amount of work in an open field. The only difference is one tree the first branch is at 25 feet, and the other tree the first branch is at 50 feet everything else is the same.

The first tree basically anyone can toss a ladder on the tree run up and trim it, the second one takes some stones to climb, or you need a 50' bucket. Say you have a 50' bucket, it would take the same amount of time to trim the smaller tree as the taller tree. How do you determine how to charge for those two trees?

 

[EchoRomeoCharlie]

First, I know it's a hypothetical situation, but no one should be dumping branches 25ft up while standing on a ladder. Using a ladder for ease of entry to a tree, fine, but get off the ladder before trimming anything but suckers.

I don't personally see a difference in the scenario you described. I would charge the same. 25, 50, or 100ft doesn't make much difference to me assuming a solid tree all the way up. Climbing is climbing(generally speaking).



As for how I would price a job that was the same amount of time but IMO more risky to me? It's purely by feeling. I don't have a spreadsheet with risk factors that I check off and multiplier values assigned to them. If I feel the tree is sketchy, I bump the price up according to my feeling of sketchiness.

 

[GilksTreeFelling]

I'm asking more about how people calculate the price increase, not if they charge more. I'm also not really referring to the risk of property damage so much as personal safety and balls. Think of it this way, you are trimming two identical trees, same amount of work in an open field. The only difference is one tree the first branch is at 25 feet, and the other tree the first branch is at 50 feet everything else is the same.

The first tree basically anyone can toss a ladder on the tree run up and trim it, the second one takes some stones to climb, or you need a 50' bucket. Say you have a 50' bucket, it would take the same amount of time to trim the smaller tree as the taller tree. How do you determine how to charge for those two trees?

the only time I use a ladder is to gain access to a tree, I don't work from it with the exception being if I am securing a brace on a hazard tree that has failed and needs supporting before removal.

height of tree r climb is not relevant for me, once your in the tree as long as your TIP is solid and your gear is safe cutting at 25 is no different then 50'. if its in an open field and a relatively healthy tree the risk is minimal to me as the climber * trust your skills andgear*. id calculate my hourly costs(wages, insurance etc) plus equipment percentage ( wear tear, consumables, etc) then add a profit margin(20-50%). now if that 50' is stretched out over utilitys, roads, houses etc then I start calculating risk factors and percentage for risk, I also would be looking at ways to mitigate risk, such as utility sleeving, flagging crews for traffic control, crane etc which will also increase price per job as well as minimize risk of injury/property damage.

 

[Philbert]

Yes you have more 'risk', but your insurance company is not charging you more.

You say that both jobs take the same amount of 'time', but you really need more time to 'assess' the more complicated jobs.

The real factor, IMO, is that the riskier, more complicated jobs required a higher level of 'skill' and 'experience', even if no additional, or specialized, 'equipment' is required.

You would expect to pay more for a brain surgeon than a school nurse handing out BandAids. You would expect to pay a Nascar mechanic more than the guy at the local quick oil change place. Same thing for lawyers, trim carpenters, etc.

I highlighted certain words to take your question beyond 'risk'. It's really about hiring a more qualified, experienced professional for a more technical task. Think about what you would pay to hire a more experienced employee to do those types of jobs, versus basic labor. 25%? 30%? Maybe calculate the additional time you spend assessing the situation, and additional preparations, even if you do them quickly 'in your head'. What do the 'better' tree companies charge in your area?

Philbert