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SRT vs Ddrt

Discussion in 'Arborist 101' started by Maineiac, Dec 28, 2014.

  1. Maineiac

    Maineiac ArboristSite Lurker

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    Im curious to hear everyone's preferences between SRT, DdRT, pros, cons, etc. And also would like to know what some of the favorite climbing systems are today whether they are manufactured or homemade.

    I am an intermediate climber who has yet to incorporate a work positioning system into my repertoire. I learned tree work from on old fashioned logger. I usually just climb off my lanyard, and most of the time do not have a secondary TIP. If I do, I just use a taught line hitch, which isnt super effective for work positioning and provides no ability to ascend. I realize to take it to the next level, I need have a climbing system that will aid in ascent as well work positioning throughout the tree.
     
  2. treebilly

    treebilly ArboristSite Guru

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    I can't argue which is better as I use ddrt and haven't got into srt. I switched to a hitch climber system from a taught line and it has made life much better. Much easier to take up slack.
     
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  3. Zale

    Zale Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Don't even think about SRT until you are competent with DRT. If you can't ascend on a taught line hitch, you need to set your rope higher and not use it as a secondary lanyard.
     
  4. Maineiac

    Maineiac ArboristSite Lurker

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    I'm sure there will be a learning curve with either, I would rather start as I mean to finish when incorporating a new technique. Are you implying that I should be able to ascend using a simple taught line hitch? If so do you mean by footlocking or with a mechanical ascender? I do not use my climbing line as a secondary lanyard. I am unorthodox and probably considered unsafe by many standards (I do have two lanyards and make sure I am always tied in) but I am not always tied in by my climbing line. The only time I tie in is either to descend, or if I have to do a limb walk (at which point I always tie in high enough for me to do so effectively). The few trees I pruned this year (95% of jobs contracted are removals) I established my TIP by using a ladder and free climbing (also using a lanyard of course).

    I realize this may sound primitive and half ass to most professionals, but I was thrown into the fire a year and a half ago when my dad died and I had to go into business for myself. He didn't teach me anything (because he didn't know anything) about advanced work positioning systems or anything like that. He didn't even own a throw ball. He was a logger that figured out that there was a lot of money in residential tree removal so he just worked with the tools he had. And he made it work. But I want to take it to the next level and I am left at the mercy of youtube and these forums for my education (which I am grateful as hell to have!). I am very comfortable in the tree, and I am confident in my ability to learn new skills.

    I just want to know what various professionals have to say about the pros and cons of SRT and DdRT as well as some of the preferred gear that goes along with it IE: rope wrench, rope runner, zig zag, spiderjack, etc. Any advice, comments, etc. are much appreciated. Thanks.
     
  5. Maineiac

    Maineiac ArboristSite Lurker

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    After watching multiple videos about the hitch climber pulley and seeing it's versatility it seems that there are a lot of benefits to this relatively simple system...comments?
     
  6. TheJollyLogger

    TheJollyLogger Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Asking a good climber srt vs. ddrt. is like asking a golfer to pick one club. There's a time and a place for both.The goal is to get safely to the proper position in the tree as efficintly as possible. Having said that, I definitely advocate mastering ddrt techniques before switching to srt. Jeff
     
  7. beastmaster

    beastmaster Addicted to ArboristSite

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    It good to learn both techniques. Srt is a wonderful way to ascend tree. Using a bigshot you can shoot a mean leaner right where you need to be. I often shoot over the whole tree allowing me to climb into a high skinny crown. You can go out on a high branch tip and come off it straight down trimming from the out side a big % of the tree. Its so east to come back up you just retrace your descend up.
    Ddrt is usfull for limb walking cuz the double rope helps stabilize you. If you use a pulley you can footlock the rope.
    A double rope is safer to work off of. You barely have to nick a single rope under tension and it'll snap
    Both have there place and like any other tool be used when it'll make the job easier.
     
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  8. Hoowasat

    Hoowasat ArboristSite Operative

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    This is so true. I've had a few occasions where I've used both together ... set two tie-in points (TIPs) and worked between them.
     
  9. beastmaster

    beastmaster Addicted to ArboristSite

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    It good to learn both techniques. Srt is a wonderful way to ascend tree. Using a bigshot you can shoot a mean leaner right where you need to be. I often shoot over the whole tree allowing me to climb into a high skinny crown. You can go out on a high branch tip and come off it straight down trimming from the out side a big % of the tree. Its so east to come back up you just retrace your descend up.
    Ddrt is usfull for limb walking cuz the double rope helps stabilize you. If you use a pulley you can footlock the rope.
    A double rope is safer to work off of. You barely have to nick a single rope under tension and it'll snap
    Both have there place and like any other tool be used when it'll make the job easier.
     
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  10. TheGoodFellers

    TheGoodFellers ArboristSite Lurker

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    When coming down from your TIP if you jump though a redirect crotch... You will have more friction in your system on a drt... Soooo that's something you'll have to get use to. (the drag on a limb walks) drt is a 2 to 1 rather than srt's 1 to 1.. So comming back in you'll be working harder on drt. (Tending more slack)
    I personally have not gotten off the blakes yet.. (I use an extra wrap on top... But that's a conversation for another trend)
    I feel that starting out the only way to climb is in a dynamic system. she's for forgiving, and easy to learn. Plus you can incorporate a dog chain system to make your hitch self tending. With a friction saver its very sweet.

    Also note there is no hip thrusting your way up a tree on SRT. So you may need more gear.. Hope this helps
     
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  11. Maineiac

    Maineiac ArboristSite Lurker

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    Thank you, any information is much appreciated. I think at this point, I'm leaning toward getting the hitch climber setup and working off of that basic system, which will allow me to ascend by footlocking, hip thrusting or by way of the floating prusik (which creates a 3:1) which seems like the easiest way to ascend with that system. But I would also like to get the right gear to ascend on a single line for those instances when I am unable (or it is just too much of a pain in the ass) to isolate a single limb for a TIP. Once in the tree I will have to switch to Ddrt given that I am working off of a hitch climber, but for now, that is enough of an upgrade. As far as my SRT ascending gear goes I am thinking about the texas system because it will be relatively inexpensive (all i need is two hand ascenders, I can make the footloops out of some nylon straps) and I can also wear my spikes while ascending if need be.
     
  12. beastmaster

    beastmaster Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Do 60 percent of my climbing using a three holed pulley and the Vt on double rope Perferable 11mm.
    I find it east to footlock for short ascends. I use all biners also. This makes it pretty light to work with. I tryed a few srt methods, but settled on the yo yo usind a mini gri gri as the most practical for a day ln day out working arborist. The rope wrench was ok, and the hitchhiker might be pretty cool but I havent tryed it yet. I mostly use the same rope for both srt and double(blaze)but I have 200ft of 10mm static rope for long ascends. It makes a 80 ft+ ascend a piece of cake going streight up. Though dangleing a 100 ft up that 10mm rope it can look mighty skinny.
     
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  13. Kenneth Phillips Jr

    Kenneth Phillips Jr New Member

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    I am an old school climber myself. I learned on a prusik knot and moved to a taught line hitch. I have found that ascending is just as easy with a taught line if you use the speed version which is two rounds down and one up then the figure eight on the tale. I prefer to climb just lanyard, saddle, and spikes and set my climbing rope after I get the tree limbed off ant the top down or I've gotten the canopy raised. It just seems to be a better way to get in the tree and limb it off for a removal. Pruning I go up a large extension ladder after setting my rope with a throw ball. I've found myself to be faster and more efficient using the old prusik or taught line techniques.
     
  14. MP321

    MP321 ArboristSite Lurker

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    Ddrt and srt are both wonderful. I have been working srt 90% of the time for about 6 years. I think in many cases it is more efficient. You use legs more which gives your upperbody a little break. Srt can be more gear intensive. Consistent friction at your hitch/multiscender and redirects really make srt shine. Certain jobs i still like ddrt (small trees / wicked leaners). There is a learning curve for sure and it can feel ackward at first if you are used to 2:1 of ddrt. Good luck!
     

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