Stihl 045 AV Rebuild.
- Thread starter Vintage Engine Repairs
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Ah I’m not planning on changing any of the oil drive setup, or were you just interested to see how this one was setup?
I was not initially planning to either, but based on the above and depending on the serial number I am wondering if I should.
If the oiler spur is enough to throw out the bearings ... hmm.
Honestly I’m still lost as to what you guys are really on about! I have read and re read and still can’t make sense. Long and short, if I replace something it will be like for like lol
do me a favour and just explain in laymen’s terms exactly what you guys are chatting about?
There was a design change part way through the 1115 series with the oiler spur gear.
From what I can tell without reading the actual service note, the original was geared wrong. This causes an imbalance on the crankshaft causing the seal to fail.
Edit: I am trying to locate a newer 045 IPL that might detail this change for its version.
As mentioned, there is no "larger" or "smaller" case per se. Just a different bearing and bearing seat in the later case (of the two earlier style cases) which in turn determines the oil pump spur gear type,
I thought I explained all of that in post #11, but I'll jump back in to hopefully provide further clarification.
I'd like to see that service note.
There is a different spur gear for each type of oil pump drive assembly on the 1115 series. Actually there are several different types depending on other variables in the oil pump drive type variations over the years. In simplest terms, one is pin driven by a pin through the spur gear cover washer which engages the the spur gear at one end and the drive sprocket at the other to drive the oil pump when the clutch is engaged. The other is spline driven by an extended, splined shaft on the rim drive style clutch drum -- typically found on 056's. 045's used the pin drive system for both types of drive sprocket setups. Each type required different considerations as illustrated below.
Here are the typical 056 setups (including the spur gears).
Here are the typical 045 setups (obviously excluding the spur gears).
The typical 1115 oil pump assembly as pictured in an early IPL including the early style spur gear. The washer is critical to protect the oil seal from the pin in early gears which had holes all the way through, (and later ones that may wear through), allowing the pin to rub against the seal causing eventual failure. It is also present on the rim drive setups as a simple thrust washer between the spur gear and the seal/bearing.
Here are the typical 045 setups (obviously excluding the spur gears).
The typical 1115 oil pump assembly as pictured in an early IPL including the early style spur gear. The washer is critical to protect the oil seal from the pin in early gears which had holes all the way through, (and later ones that may wear through), allowing the pin to rub against the seal causing eventual failure. It is also present on the rim drive setups as a simple thrust washer between the spur gear and the seal/bearing.
As you can see, that may or may not be the way to go depending on the history of the saw and who may have worked on it along the way. Too many possibilities for incorrect parts to already be installed on these things by uninformed mechanics due to so many design changes throughout their history.
As far as your thread being derailed, I'm just trying to keep the flow of information accurate for everyone's sake.
Thank you both for the clarity, I’ll add some pictures when I take it apart and go from there!
@PogoInTheWoods @CausticUC
I quickly popped the clutch off to have a look. I probably found why the saw was sold - the pin between the washer, gear and clutch drum must have sheared off and it wasn’t oiling.
It looks like there was only ever 1 pin, even though there are two holes?
So if this good or bad setup / prone to failure?
my 020 has a sprocket recess that the clutch drum fits into to actuate the oil pump, seems like a better solution than a tiny pin.
I quickly popped the clutch off to have a look. I probably found why the saw was sold - the pin between the washer, gear and clutch drum must have sheared off and it wasn’t oiling.
It looks like there was only ever 1 pin, even though there are two holes?
So if this good or bad setup / prone to failure?
my 020 has a sprocket recess that the clutch drum fits into to actuate the oil pump, seems like a better solution than a tiny pin.
I’m not Pogo or Caustic, but only one drive pin is used on that 045. Also, there’s other issues.
You’re missing the thrust washer that goes right at the bearing/case. Revised part number for the updated washer (larger OD) is in the technical bulletins.
Pump drive gear looks like a -7501 using that separate -8000 brass spacer, so it’s for an 056 only... the -1006 gear is what you want for that 045.
Take a picture of the back side of the OP drive gear when you get a chance. Is there any melted plastic or wear inside your OP cover from binding?
You’re missing the thrust washer that goes right at the bearing/case. Revised part number for the updated washer (larger OD) is in the technical bulletins.
Pump drive gear looks like a -7501 using that separate -8000 brass spacer, so it’s for an 056 only... the -1006 gear is what you want for that 045.
Take a picture of the back side of the OP drive gear when you get a chance. Is there any melted plastic or wear inside your OP cover from binding?
Thanks mate, you got a PN for the piece I’m missing?
Hopefully that's all that's wrong with it!
That pin is simply a 2.5 x 15.8mm needle roller and a replacement can be fashioned several ways. The original part # shows NLA when searched, but a local dealer may well still have a bag of em in a drawer somewhere.
The all important thrust washer is indeed missing (at least in the pic) and that early spur gear's pin hole goes all the way through the gear allowing it to rub directly against the oil seal in the absence of the washer. Bad. Later spur gears were molded differently to minimize that possibility, but continued wear still allowed the pin to eventually protrude. That washer must be present. 0000 958 1404 is the current and only active part number and is the larger 30mm washer. It is also a backorder item domestically. (I happen to be waiting for one myself.) May be an available item for you regionally or could be scavenged from a later 1115 series parts saw.
The correct spur gear depends entirely on which bearing and seal are installed. As previously mentioned, there were several variants and all could be made to function to some degree or another, but the correct components are required as a complete assembly from the thrust washer on out to the clutch drum for reliable operation. As pointed out, that spur gear would appear to be a perfect example of the wrong part being applied and why replacing parts "like for like" on these particular saws isn't necessarily the most reliable way to ensure the correct parts are being used as replacements.
1115 007 1006 is the part number currently listed for the spur gear -- and not necessarily the correct one for your saw.. Take a pic of the bearing and seal as well as the backside of the spur gear and the cover. That will help us narrow it down for you.
Wow, thanks, still perplexed, but will take the pictures you mention and go from there
That oil gear with the pin can’t be pushed all the way through and damage the seal, the back is almost totally closed off with just a tiny little hole.
could that be why there is no washer present, as it was never added on this variant? I can see how it could wear through over time though!
The washer was used on all variants. Also, post the serial number of the saw.
It’s an aussi saw, will it still be useful?
Yes.
Excellent - 3834448
Do these pictures show any info on what you guys were looking for. I tried to get the numbers / text in.
Yes, your OP gear is good to go with the 30 mm OD washer. Part number never changed, classic Stihl engineering blunder...
That’s an early 045 series, you can tell by the oil pump, and probably has a 50mm top end.
That’s an early 045 series, you can tell by the oil pump, and probably has a 50mm top end.
Ok great! So someone pinched it off this saw originally? Unless they never put it back on after taking it apart to check why it wasn’t oiling?
I wonder what else went!
I’ll call the stihl dealer in the morning for PN 0000 958 1404
So this washer goes on first behind the oil pump gear?
I have this brass spacer that’s not in the IPL, any idea why it’s there and not “there” (in ipl)?
You need to download an 045 IPL.
That said, I’ve never found an 045 IPL with your old 031 type oil pump shown in it though...
Also need to go to the “Beg for manuals” thread & ask Mr Ray Benson for the 045 & 056 tech bulletins for the latest upgrades, there’s a lot of information to catch up on.
Good luck with the restoration.
That said, I’ve never found an 045 IPL with your old 031 type oil pump shown in it though...
Also need to go to the “Beg for manuals” thread & ask Mr Ray Benson for the 045 & 056 tech bulletins for the latest upgrades, there’s a lot of information to catch up on.
Good luck with the restoration.
Thanks mate I have the 045 ipl but not the updates, I’ll grab them from Ray as advised
