Thinning questions

[JTM]

Here goes. I have two stands one tulip poplar, the other oak. Both planted about 25 years ago. I need to thin these. I've had the property about 5 years and been running a bush hog between the rows. Two questions: (1) Can I gird or hack and squirt the oaks I want to remove with a herbicide without affecting the adjacent ones? They're a pain to cut because they hang up in the canopy. The poplars don't. (2) For both poplars and oaks, where the bush hog can't get I have the nasties (sweet gum, privit, etc.) coming up. These are right at the base of the trees. I don't want to hack and squirt or stump treat in this case. I have been using a brush cutter on them. Can I safely hit the re-sprouts with glyphosate with effect?

 

[BIG JAKE]

You could try it,but I doubt it will be effective. Try 2-4D which an he found in brushbgone or weedbgone, and other products the higher the concentration the better. It kills elm and other weed trees nicely around here. Spray it on the leaves of what you want to kill-shouldn't hurt the grass or trees you want to keep but if you're worried try it on a small area first. Takes a few weeks to work, Call your county agricultural extension agent they may have other options

 

[bitzer]

At 25 years why would hardwoods need to be thinned? Let them compete. Nature will weed out the weak ones. You're probably past the stage now where brush cutting is no longer necessary. Let em grow. If you remove trees you may end up with a bunch of short fat ones.

 

[JTM]

You are right, as the voice of reason. My thinking is that I don't want to thin by removing every other tree, just the runts as well as the sweet gum, cedars, elm, and maple. I feel that all these unwanteds are just sucking up the resources. We have been in drought conditions for several years and I want to maximize the future value of the stand.

 

[bitzer]

I'd let em all go. I mean keep invasives out and boxelder but otherwise think diversity in species. What if a new bug pops up or your oaks get oak wilt or something? A lot of folks are pist around here for planting ash plantations years ago. Maple is a high dollar species too as long as it's nice and white. Think what happens after a clearcut and how the forest regenerates itself. You want diversity. Hardwoods need a good 75-100 years for maturity. Sometimes more. Let em grow.

 

[JTM]

I appreciate your response. It is exactly what an old mule skinner logger told me about it several years ago when I had him cut some logs in another part of the property. He just said let it be. I would like to get some saw logs out of this in the next 10 years but that may be a bit ambitious. We had these trees planted 25 years ago on family property. I become sole owner 5 years ago. I should have had thinned these about 15 years ago but I didn't know I would be here today. It just gets my goat that when people plant trees they can't envision that planting in 25 years. Of course I'm the pot calling the kettle black here. I will vent my anger on sweet gum. Of course in another 25 years it will be discovered that sweet gum produces a compound that is the cure for cancer. Oh, well.

 

[northmanlogging]

naw pacific yew beat sweet gum to it 20 years ago... cancer treatment anyway

 

[madhatte]

naw pacific yew beat sweet gum to it 20 years ago... cancer treatment anyway

And then they got over-logged in a rush to make ALL the money before the eggheads synthesized the stuff... now yews are pretty scarce, and they were never a fast grower to begin with. An interesting side note: the Weyco scientist who did most of the synthesis research was rather unceremoniously let go not long after the patent expired.

 

[northmanlogging]

yup,

they where hard to find before the research, there was a nursery in Edmonds that managed to get some of the UW starts being used in the research, they later put a few on the market, One is happily growing, albeit very slowly in the back yard.

many yeard ago, while cutting fire wood, we came across a 10'x 12" stick of the stuff, I desperately wanted to make a bow out of it, so I conned my folks into loading it in the truck with all the fire wood...

Later ma turned into a bird bath or some ****...

 

[madhatte]

I had two of the cast-off research yews in the mid-90's while I was a traveling college student. Came back after a summer job and they had dried up and died. I'll always regret killing those two.

 

[Gypo Logger]

Here goes. I have two stands one tulip poplar, the other oak. Both planted about 25 years ago. I need to thin these. I've had the property about 5 years and been running a bush hog between the rows. Two questions: (1) Can I gird or hack and squirt the oaks I want to remove with a herbicide without affecting the adjacent ones? They're a pain to cut because they hang up in the canopy. The poplars don't. (2) For both poplars and oaks, where the bush hog can't get I have the nasties (sweet gum, privit, etc.) coming up. These are right at the base of the trees. I don't want to hack and squirt or stump treat in this case. I have been using a brush cutter on them. Can I safely hit the re-sprouts with glyphosate with effect?

It's too young of a stand to do anything but a cleaning. Could you pasture it with a few sheep. They will take care of the undergrowth.

 

[JTM]

Goats would be good. I would have to find someone to lease since I am only here on weekends. I will continue to wage war on sweet gum until they are gone.

 

[northmanlogging]

I had two of the cast-off research yews in the mid-90's while I was a traveling college student. Came back after a summer job and they had dried up and died. I'll always regret killing those two.

I may be able to get a cutting going for ya if you like? they are all clones of the original from what I was told.

Sadly mine had an extra arm the was growing in a bad direction, so we lobbed it off a year ago or so...

 

[catbuster]

Goats would be good. I would have to find someone to lease since I am only here on weekends. I will continue to wage war on sweet gum until they are gone.

Goats are your friend in this situation. And you won't need as many as you think. However, if you insist on doing it the hard way, I'll outline it below...

Are they scrub sweet gum? If they are, try to find someone with something like a 400 or 500 series Stihl brush saw and have them cut them all to roughly ground level. Then spray heavily with an Izampyr compound, which is broad spectrum and does a good job with woody species. Or Picloram, which is specifically for woody stuff. You need to be careful with Picloram not to get it on the trees you want to keep. Don't use Amine 2-4D or other broadleaf killers like glyphosate. They won't do as good a job.

Cutting them before means your herbicide gets to the phloem and down to the roots faster and without having to apply as heavily to kill the whole tree.

 

[Jason Douglas]

Look into the possibility of systemic herbicides being translocated tree to tree via root grafts. Seems plausible.

 

[JTM]

That is what I want to avoid