Scrounging Firewood (and other stuff)

[sean donato]

Been trying to talk my wife into getting a VW diesel to replace her focus. Only thing is I want stick and she cant/doesn't want to learn to drive stick. Back in the 80 there were a few diesel options in cars and I 99% sure I've seen a diesel Ford ranger for sale, that wasn't a transplant. I really miss the vw diesel I had back in the day, turbo model with 5 speed trans, had no issues going 100mph and just sipped fuel. Sadly it was 3/4 worn out by the time I got it, and was determined that I wasn't going to pull the engine out and redo it. Should have kept it. These new smaller diesel just don't excite me, till your done buying the truck you have a $10k + upgrade for the diesel option, that buys a lot of gas. Let alone the maintenance aspect of it, added cost of def fluid and higher chances of having a system error in the aftertrestment system. No thanks, I'm ok with an ole smokey that's simple, reliable, and doesn't cost my first born to fix if something goes wrong. Besides that the masses want cheap and easy, e words will eventually prevail for a lot of people I think.

 

[MustangMike]

Gas engines are lasting a lot longer, not need stupid additives, and are much easier to start in cold weather.

There are markets for both.

When I park my truck up at the cabin (off the grid, no plug in) for 2-3 days and have to leave on a freezing cold day, I don't want any problems starting!

 

[sean donato]

Gas engines are lasting a lot longer, not need stupid additives, and are much easier to start in cold weather.

There are markets for both.

When I park my truck up at the cabin (off the grid, no plug in) for 2-3 days and have to leave on a freezing cold day, I don't want any problems starting!

Ah that's not all of the diesels, my 90 cummins would start just fine on a 0 degree day, now my second gen engine needs the grid heater on a 50* day, and near 0 you better plug it in. That's more my fault from how its been worked over then the fault of the engine. Big injectors and lots of timing advance doesn't make for nice cold weather starting. the newer diesels are much better, but nothing like the turn key and go of a gasser.

 

[JustJeff]

I see ford is dropping the diesel in the half ton. There's a place for diesels but not in a vehicle that doesn't see towing duty 300+ days a year

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[sean donato]

I see ford is dropping the diesel in the half ton. There's a place for diesels but not in a vehicle that doesn't see towing duty 300+ days a year

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Its the upcharg more then anything. You can get a max tow package with a turbo v6 that makes 3/4 of the torque of the little diesel and not loose any tow capacity in a 1/2 ton pickup. Also doesn't help that 80% of small pickup owners use them as a family car. So the tow rating doesn't matter. Just how many car seats, soccer balls, and groceries you can fit and if it gets 20mpg on pump gas. Makes everyone happy. Heck I remember when you were considered a hick if you daily drive your pickup. Times changed.

 

[Philbert]

Heck I remember when you were considered a hick if you daily drive your pickup. Times changed.

Philbert

 

[svk]

Back when, people drove pickups cause they were cheap!!

 

[farmer steve]

Also @farmer steve if you think that 6.2 pulls like a diesel are you meaning like a 95 obs furd or a modern diesel in that type of truck? If it’s the latter, The load hasn’t been heavy enough. That 6.2 is gutless just like the 5.4 and 6.8 v10 were.

The 6.2 pulls every bit as good as my previous 6.4 dsl. Green oak stacked in my 6x10 dump was every bit as heavy as my 27' camper if not more. Over the life of a gas vs diesel truck a gasser will be cheaper to own when you figure in all costs.

 

[ElevatorGuy]

We have a 3500 Silverado dually with a 6.0.
I simply don't drive enough to justify a diesel.
Would love one, mostly for down hill engine breaking in hilly situations with the RV trailer.
It's a small 27' RV bumper pull, at 4,500 pounds, so we get by pretty good.
But we very rarely drive hills.
I would love to try towing with the newer Ford 10 speed transmission.
Everything I do is pretty light duty.
Love the 2011 Silverado.
We are fortunate to have what we have with the crazy prices the days.

What I did learn buying the bumper pull dump trailer is that I overlooked tongue weight.
I have 820 pounds tongue weight empty.
Had I'd known that, and it never entered my mind to dig up that number, the additional $1,800 for a gooseneck would be a know brainer.

View attachment 921197

What’s the weight when loaded?

Been trying to talk my wife into getting a VW diesel to replace her focus. Only thing is I want stick and she cant/doesn't want to learn to drive stick. Back in the 80 there were a few diesel options in cars and I 99% sure I've seen a diesel Ford ranger for sale, that wasn't a transplant. I really miss the vw diesel I had back in the day, turbo model with 5 speed trans, had no issues going 100mph and just sipped fuel. Sadly it was 3/4 worn out by the time I got it, and was determined that I wasn't going to pull the engine out and redo it. Should have kept it. These new smaller diesel just don't excite me, till your done buying the truck you have a $10k + upgrade for the diesel option, that buys a lot of gas. Let alone the maintenance aspect of it, added cost of def fluid and higher chances of having a system error in the aftertrestment system. No thanks, I'm ok with an ole smokey that's simple, reliable, and doesn't cost my first born to fix if something goes wrong. Besides that the masses want cheap and easy, e words will eventually prevail for a lot of people I think.

I’ve never seen a factory diesel in a ranger that was built here and my family has owned 10 of them over the years. I bought my uncles 97 2 years ago and would love to swap a 4bt Cummins in it. A few have been done, one made mid 200s hp and almost 600 lb ft of twist. Tell me that wouldn’t be a blast to drive in a reg cab short bed 97 4x4!

speaking of sipping fuel, I mow with my JD 1025r, I filled it up before I started the other day. It wouldn’t take the last gallon in the jug. I went to top it off afterwards and it only took about a 1/2 gallon after running 3200 rpm mowing for an hour. My previous cub cadet had a 23hp kaw engine and a 3 gallon tank, I could cut the yard about 1.5 times before refilling. Huge difference!

 

[ElevatorGuy]

The 6.2 pulls every bit as good as my previous 6.4 dsl. Green oak stacked in my 6x10 dump was every bit as heavy as my 27' camper if not more. Over the life of a gas vs diesel truck a gasser will be cheaper to own when you figure in all costs.

Hp probably fairly close, Double the twist at a much lower rpm, I don’t see how that’s possible. The gas truck have the 4:30 rear? Maybe the diesel was running 3.31s.

Edit, The 6.4 isn’t quite double the tq but it does make peak over 2000rpm less.

 

[jollygreengiant]

I see ford is dropping the diesel in the half ton. There's a place for diesels but not in a vehicle that doesn't see towing duty 300+ days a year

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The half ton diesel market is a tale of two extremes. Ford is dropping it as it isn't selling, while GM can't make enough of them to meet demand. Apparently a half ton truck that will do 30mpg unloaded is a big seller.

 

[ElevatorGuy]

The half ton diesel market is a tale of two extremes. Ford is dropping it as it isn't selling, while GM can't make enough of them to meet demand. Apparently a half ton truck that will do 30mpg unloaded is a big seller.

Yep, I said it earlier. Gm is the only one that did it right, in-line 6! Great power, smoothness and mpg. The power stroke is good, sounds awesome deleted too but can’t keep up with the i6 in mpg. The fiat trash isn’t even in the ballpark.

 

[LondonNeil]

You can't find a small Van or truck, or big van or truck, that is petrol powered here. The really daft bit, government pushed diesel as better for reduced co2 emissions, then realised the particulates were a problem in cities so pushed dpfs on the engines, then the cars and vans etc in cities don't do runs at speed to passively regen the dpf and the active regen destroys the mileage. Result is for city users diesel costs more to buy, as much to run, more to service has the same co2 impact as petrol and still worse emissions. Well done government.

 

[JustJeff]

The automakers build what sells. Thats why you don't see automatic transmissions much in Europe.

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[farmer steve]

Hp probably fairly close, Double the twist at a much lower rpm, I don’t see how that’s possible. The gas truck have the 4:30 rear? Maybe the diesel was running 3.31s.

Edit, The 6.4 isn’t quite double the tq but it does make peak over 2000rpm less.

Both the 2017 and 2021 have 3.73 rears. If I read the codes right. Both have the 6 speed tranny.

 

[Huskybill]

My cousin decades ago was the first one to install a Detroit diesel in a six wheel international truck. Dodge was the only diesel offered then.

I still liked my one ton I converted, 350/400hp. Detroit lockers, 6 super swampers

 

[Lionsfan]

I disagree, The original attempts at the older diesels were not successful. Most people think they’re loud, slow and stinky machines. Most people view them as dump trucks, trash trucks, etc or rednecks that want to cover the world in black smoke.

Toyota won’t do it here because of our bs emissions.

Fuel savings are not the only advantage, They last a lot longer too. Until all these newer turbo gas engines diesels are much more enjoyable to daily drive too. Aside from the mileage you couldn’t beat the low end shove. I think Gm is the only one that got the 1/2 ton diesel right being an in-line 6. Time will tell.

I don't know anyone who still thinks diesel vehicles are loud and stinky. But everyone I know can use a calculator and most everyone of them can do the math and see that the initial cost of a diesel pickup isn't worth the price unless you're really racking up the miles with a lot of heavy loads. Also, why would Toyota waste their time with diesel offerings when the public loves their gas offerings???

 

[ElevatorGuy]

Both the 2017 and 2021 have 3.73 rears. If I read the codes right. Both have the 6 speed tranny.

10-4, no way they pull like that 6.4. Numbers don’t lie. I won’t dispute the 6.2 will probably stay together longer than the 6.4.

Also the fact Ford chose to not pair the 6.2 with the 10 speed shows the lack of interest in it. That might stick around for the price factor only.

 

[ElevatorGuy]

I don't know anyone who still thinks diesel vehicles are loud and stinky. But everyone I know can use a calculator and most everyone of them can do the math and see that the initial cost of a diesel pickup isn't worth the price unless you're really racking up the miles with a lot of heavy loads. Also, why would Toyota waste their time with diesel offerings when the public loves their gas offerings???

I completely disagree with your first line. One the calculator thing, probably true for most. However being a diesel fan it’s completely worth it for what they offer. Last line, are you a yota fan and own them? I do and engage in other forums. People hate the 3.5 taco, high redline, low torque, most miss the 4.0. The 4.0 which is in my t4r is a great but old engine, decent power for a heavy truck but gets sub par fuel mileage for most. I actually think it’s pretty decent for the capability of the rig, not many today can match or beat it (capability wise). I’d much rather have a torquey diesel that put down 25 mpgs or better. Then you have the legendary 5.7 tundra, still holding close with power output but again fuel mileage isn’t good. Looks like they’re gonna fix that with the new turbo v6. Traditional v8 guys will hate it for the same reasons I mentioned earlier. It’s not Toyota won’t do it because people love their gas engines, it’s simply our emissions standards suck and yota is big into the hybrid game.

 

[farmer steve]

10-4, no way they pull like that 6.4. Numbers don’t lie. I won’t dispute the 6.2 will probably stay together longer than the 6.4.

Also the fact Ford chose to not pair the 6.2 with the 10 speed shows the lack of interest in it. That might stick around for the price factor only.

Driven both I know what's what. Only got rid of the 6.4 because it was going to nickel and dime me. I have a Ford mechanic that knows more about them than the guys that make them. There is a reason he sold all his diesels and switchedt o gas.Just sayin.