Chain for Australian hardwood

Which chain would you recommend for blue gum(eucalyptus) hardwood? I usually cut green wood, but yesterday some dry stuff. Currently using a Shindaiwa 488 with 18 inch bar and windsor semi-chisel chain. It doesn't cut real well in the 20 inch dry stuff, but maybe that's expected.

joe.snow said:

Which chain would you recommend for blue gum(eucalyptus) hardwood? I usually cut green wood, but yesterday some dry stuff. Currently using a Shindaiwa 488 with 18 inch bar and windsor semi-chisel chain. It doesn't cut real well in the 20 inch dry stuff, but maybe that's expected.

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In my humble opinion- only having cut your native trees where they grow over our side of the ditch- you might be asking a whole lot of a sub 50cc saw with 18 inches of .325 chain buried in 20 inch dry Gum.
The Windsor is a good of an option you might find in .325. you will have to be bang on with your sharpening and make sure the oiler is keeping up.
Also be prepared to let the chain cut at a fairly relaxed pressure, rather than dogging in and lifting the rear handle.
Then keep an eye out for a good Stihl 066.

Bob Hedgecutter said:

In my humble opinion- only having cut your native trees where they grow over our side of the ditch- you might be asking a whole lot of a sub 50cc saw with 18 inches of .325 chain buried in 20 inch dry Gum.
The Windsor is a good of an option you might find in .325. you will have to be bang on with your sharpening and make sure the oiler is keeping up.
Also be prepared to let the chain cut at a fairly relaxed pressure, rather than dogging in and lifting the rear handle.
Then keep an eye out for a good Stihl 066.

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Yeah 50cc definitely struggles in our hardwood, but gets it done slowly. All the videos i see on youtube are people flying through soft pine.

There is only one way to cut Euc and that is with a slow moving 404. You do need 80 CC or more to do it. Thanks

Ted Jenkins said:

There is only one way to cut Euc and that is with a slow moving 404. You do need 80 CC or more to do it. Thanks

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This is interesting, I’ve cut Aussie firewood for person use for a few years and like the .404 chain but I’ve always had it on my 066 saw. What do you mean when you say slow moving? I’ve usually had high revs on to keep the chain cutting fast, am I doing it wrong?

Na, you're not doing it wrong - unless your saw is out of tune for that area. When cutting, a saw should be used at fully open throttle. Anything else can cause overheating and perhaps other problems.
I'd have to say that using what most people seem to call 'chipper' chain is a good option. It won't blunt as quickly as semi-chisel. But go easy on the amount of hook and easy on those rakers. Having said that, I haven't done any serious cutting for a long time and things may well have changed.

Hopefully we'll get more info on what folks are using these days, and how they are sharpening it, as the thread evolves.

Semi chisel as you mentioned is fine.
Its just tougher, so keep the chain sharp, use the hardwood setting for the rakers if you have the option, and let the saw get thru it at its own pace.

most people think our chains are dull when they see us cutting aussie hardwood, especially if its dry, but it just takes time.

already good info in the posts above from kiwi's and aussies.

3/8 will be fine, you will put firewood in the trailer just fine.
In an ideal world the slower chain speed of the more durable .404 helps keep the edge on the chain longer, so you cut more wood before sharpening.
3/8 and full throttle on your saw will be fine, just let it cut at its own pace, and keep the chain sharp, if it dulls, sharpen it, no waiting till you finish the tank etc, just do it when it needs it.
Have fun, enjoy the warmth when your burning it.

joe.snow said:

Which chain would you recommend for blue gum(eucalyptus) hardwood? I usually cut green wood, but yesterday some dry stuff. Currently using a Shindaiwa 488 with 18 inch bar and windsor semi-chisel chain. It doesn't cut real well in the 20 inch dry stuff, but maybe that's expected.

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I use full chisel chain on all my working saws, semi chisel just cuts too slow for my liking, you will have to sharpen more often with full chisel in dry HWD, slow reving chainsaws with 404 chain just cut slow, a higher chain speed will always out perform a slow one, unless of course it's a harvester with massive depth set rakers.
Stihl full chisel chain would be my recommendation for some one new to the game

Bwildered said:

I use full chisel chain on all my working saws, semi chisel just cuts too slow for my liking, you will have to sharpen more often with full chisel in dry HWD, slow reving chainsaws with 404 chain just cut slow, a higher chain speed will always out perform a slow one, unless of course it's a harvester with massive depth set rakers.
Stihl full chisel chain would be my recommendation for some one new to the game

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I've only used semi-chisel(.325). If i'm cutting 95% of the time clean green eucalyptus will the full chisel be a better choice than semi chisel?

Ted Jenkins said:

There is only one way to cut Euc and that is with a slow moving 404. You do need 80 CC or more to do it. Thanks

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You don’t need .404, you don’t need 80cc+ and you don’t need slow moving.

Also should mention i was using the Stihl 2 in 1 sharpener, however it only really sharpens the top of the tooth and not the gullet. It doesn't give that big hook like on a new chain. So i started hand filing down into the gullet and then back towards the tooth to give a big hook.

joe.snow said:

Also should mention i was using the Stihl 2 in 1 sharpener, however it only really sharpens the top of the tooth and not the gullet. It doesn't give that big hook like on a new chain. So i started hand filing down into the gullet and then back towards the tooth to give a big hook.

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This was my same experience last year before dropping all jigs and filing guides and just going free hand.

joe.snow said:

Also should mention i was using the Stihl 2 in 1 sharpener, however it only really sharpens the top of the tooth and not the gullet. It doesn't give that big hook like on a new chain. So i started hand filing down into the gullet and then back towards the tooth to give a big hook.

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When cutting dead dry euc, you dont need much hook, just a sharp cutter, bigger hook only ends up being dulled quicker, and takes a bit more to bring it back, and you might find on a smaller saw, it will load up and stall or bog the saw too.
less hook, and the tooth is more durable, and will still cut well, round the front of the rakers too after hitting them with the 2 in 1, helps smooth out the chain too. And just hit the gullet free hand, leave the top of the tooth how the 2 in 1 leaves it for now.
I use the basic file guide as when cutting I get too tired to free hand after a few hrs on the saw.
As previously mentioned.
Keep the chain sharp, and enjoy your cutting, it will take longer, as its hard wood, but some eucs are pretty easy to cut, and others have their own rockwell hardness all of their own.

trains said:

When cutting dead dry euc, you dont need much hook

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Absolutely! Too much hook will cause the saw to jump all over the place and cause totally unecessary wear on numerous components - mainly the bar, chain and operator, but other stuff too! You don't need much at all! Also you can wind back from 35 degrees on top to 30 or less. That will save your bar from undue wear. Your chain will move smoother and faster and everything will be happier Trains also mentioned not delaying between sharpens. Good advice. As always, it's the chain cutters that do the work. Get them right and your sailing!

You don’t need and don’t want a big hook, but your interpretation on big hook is relative - new Stihl chain doesn’t have big hook. It’s at 60 degrees, thats a general profile that works ok across the board, however in very hardwoods I have found around the 70-80 degrees is a better place to start when you consider sharpness and longevity.

Hook to a certain degree is important for a self feeding and well cutting chain. I have tried everything from 50 degrees to 80 degrees and all work well, the less of an acute angle the slower the cutting but longer lasting the tooth. The problem with the 2 in 1 is that it takes all hook out and the tooth actually scrapes the wood rather than cutting it and that’s where your issue is. My experience is you’ll never get a nice self feeding chain with the 2 in 1. I have tried every 2 in 1 on all but 1/4” chain and the results are the same, no self feeding, poor geometry and poor cutting results. Stihl recommends 60 degrees for their chain, here in Australian woods 70-80 degrees is an excellent start to go from. Then from there you can increase or decrease the angle depending on the wood you’re cutting.

Here is a video of a saw filed with the 2 in 1 and this wood is incredibly soft yet it’s still struggling to cut..

it requires constant dogging in and constant pressure. This wears the bar and chain out quicker, works the powerhead more and is less efficient. The quicker you learn to freehand file the better off you’ll be - that’s just my experience.

this is an example of what what your 2 in 1 will start to do to your tooth, the red line is where it’s at after the 2 in 1 yet the green line is closer to what it should be



2 in 1 file results..


compare that cut to this one: hand filed, the saw is less powerful (260 rather than 034) and wood is far far harder and it self feeds and loads the powerhead as it should and cuts faster.No pressure at all.

Vintage Engine Repairs said:

learn to freehand file the better off you’ll be

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Yes, a good hand sharpen can be excellent! Funny I should say that 'cos I'm actually waiting on a pretty fancy grinder to come over from WA at the moment. But that will be used to reset chains from errant customers. Important chains will always get a final hand sharpen.

Here is some Carlton chain, that works fine in hard dry euc.





here it is in use before the picture above was taken.

trains said:

When cutting dead dry euc, you dont need much hook, just a sharp cutter, bigger hook only ends up being dulled quicker, and takes a bit more to bring it back, and you might find on a smaller saw, it will load up and stall or bog the saw too.
less hook, and the tooth is more durable, and will still cut well, round the front of the rakers too after hitting them with the 2 in 1, helps smooth out the chain too. And just hit the gullet free hand, leave the top of the tooth how the 2 in 1 leaves it for now.
I use the basic file guide as when cutting I get too tired to free hand after a few hrs on the saw.
As previously mentioned.
Keep the chain sharp, and enjoy your cutting, it will take longer, as its hard wood, but some eucs are pretty easy to cut, and others have their own rockwell hardness all of their own.

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Exactly, here in SE N.S.W near the coast the timber is dirty and any serious cutters in wood over 2 foot use 404 semi and 660s or 395s, with no where near the " beakiness" of tooth as shown in a couple of recent sharpening vids. Note that I said serious, if it's only half a day of firewood it doesn't really matter how much sharpening is required, but if it is all day, 5 days a week it will be 404 semi and 90cc saws and hand filing.
By the way, just my opinion but I reckon those 2 in one things are too aggressive on the rakers in dry hard Oz timber

joe.snow said:

I've only used semi-chisel(.325). If i'm cutting 95% of the time clean green eucalyptus will the full chisel be a better choice than semi chisel?

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Ive tried chisel in green gum, and there wasnt much difference between chisel and semi as far as speed, but overall, I will often be cutting dead bits as well as the green bits, and over the day of cutting semi wins over chisel.
sure chisel might cut cookies quicker with timed cuts, but overall when cutting what needs to be processed and put in the trailer, my preference is for semi chisel.

When I get an 881, I will happily run .404 chipper chain, but will keep the 3/8 on the 660 for now.

Dennisthemenace has some good advice from years of experience and getting it done.

To the O.P, keep it sharp, loose the 2 in 1 and just use the basic file guide, and enjoy your time out cutting, dont forget to clean the air filter too .
Just wait till you cut some dead dry redgum, your filters will love it .............

The first one is from a bloke far more knowledgeable than me about redgum and ironbark etc, the second is 46RS by me for green silvertop ash,ie not terrible hard. Still it is a bit aggressive, trial and error is the way to go eh