Hand file. Time to quit

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maowwg

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So I hand file my chain

Looking down from above, top plate starts out as a 4 sided shape with a new chain and eventually approaches a triangle as the teeth are filed back further and further.

When is it time to quit and replace? Obviously when the first top plate on a chain becomes a shrinking triangle it’s probably time to quit. But I’m wondering if one should call it quits materially sooner? Is there a rule of thumb? Are you risking breaking off teeth under normal conditions or can you go right up to the first triangle shape without danger or consequences? (None of my teeth are exactly the same so one or two will be triangles before the rest)

i.e. If you retire your chains with 25% of that 4th side of the top plates still In place are you being smart and reasonable or wasting 25% of the life of the chain?
 
If you are down to a triangle- you have had your monies worth!
Some chains have a "witness" mark on the top plate to guide the correct angle, much past that, or even close to hitting that and the chain is done.
Down to a triangle- you are cutting a narrow kerf and can lead to binding the sideplates in the cut, plus the "guts" of the tooth is gone and they can snap off during the cutting action of normal chain use.
 
So I hand file my chain

Looking down from above, top plate starts out as a 4 sided shape with a new chain and eventually approaches a triangle as the teeth are filed back further and further.

When is it time to quit and replace? Obviously when the first top plate on a chain becomes a shrinking triangle it’s probably time to quit. But I’m wondering if one should call it quits materially sooner? Is there a rule of thumb? Are you risking breaking off teeth under normal conditions or can you go right up to the first triangle shape without danger or consequences? (None of my teeth are exactly the same so one or two will be triangles before the rest)

i.e. If you retire your chains with 25% of that 4th side of the top plates still In place are you being smart and reasonable or wasting 25% of the life of the chain?
Many chains have a witness line scribed on the tail end of the tooth, presumptively for file guidance, but also a pretty good spot to chuck the chain and get a new one. For the record its nearly down to a sharp point were the width of the tooth would drastically start to shrink...

Personally, I don't round file anymore, but with chisel grind its a little shy of that witness mark however the teeth start breaking off, when this happens its for sure time to chuck em
 
I hand file and use Stihl chain only - if a scrapbin rescued saw comes with a different chain when the time comes to replace that chain I get a loop of Stihl made up.
I file to the Stihl witness mark and then maybe another two or three times. By then the rakers have to be taken down so low to get a decent cut and the width of the top plate is too narrow - time for a new chain.
 
Many chains have a witness line scribed on the tail end of the tooth, presumptively for file guidance, but also a pretty good spot to chuck the chain and get a new one. For the record its nearly down to a sharp point were the width of the tooth would drastically start to shrink...

Personally, I don't round file anymore, but with chisel grind its a little shy of that witness mark however the teeth start breaking off, when this happens its for sure time to chuck em
Ah, the witness line, the chain is just reaching it's golden years, still cuts fine......
 
I was going to start a thread, but a little different question, so here is a semi high jacking of this post. I have a chain that is really getting down there. It seems like it just does not want to get sharp. I used a grinder and still have problems. I finished grinding and then too the hand file to it. I noticed no matter how much more angle i put on the grinder , the file does not want to file the very top of the cutters (teeth). Is there a time when the chain just does not like to stay sharp? I had it pretty good, and just then I hit the raker guide that I left on the log and dulled it again and now it is really down there. It still cuts, but not anything like a new chain. I have decided to just hand file after every other tank unless I get a diamond blade for my grinder or I hit metal.
 
I was going to start a thread, but a little different question, so here is a semi high jacking of this post. I have a chain that is really getting down there. It seems like it just does not want to get sharp. I used a grinder and still have problems. I finished grinding and then too the hand file to it. I noticed no matter how much more angle i put on the grinder , the file does not want to file the very top of the cutters (teeth). Is there a time when the chain just does not like to stay sharp? I had it pretty good, and just then I hit the raker guide that I left on the log and dulled it again and now it is really down there. It still cuts, but not anything like a new chain. I have decided to just hand file after every other tank unless I get a diamond blade for my grinder or I hit metal.
I've got a 33RS Stihl chain on one of my 038s, it's about done, I'll take you a picture but it might take a few days, still cuts fine.

I'll even touch it up with the file so it's pretty looking for you guys
 
So what I hear people saying is take it down the whole way and throw them out when the the fourth side (opposite the side plate side) is exhausted. I’ve never done the progressively shrinking triangle routine. I think your asking to break off teeth at that point.

But I hear people talking about breaking off teeth like it’s no big deal. What actually happens when you break a tooth off in the cut? Does it just come out of the bottom of the saw in the chip stream? Bounce off your cutting chaps or maybe lightly nick your leg if you’re wearing flip flops and gym shorts like all the nuts on YouTube?

I.e. Is the risk of breaking teeth even a real risk? I just assumed loose bits of sharp metal are a bad thing to be avoided when I started the thread. Doesn’t sound like folks are concerned.
 
I was going to start a thread, but a little different question, so here is a semi high jacking of this post. I have a chain that is really getting down there. It seems like it just does not want to get sharp. I used a grinder and still have problems. I finished grinding and then too the hand file to it. I noticed no matter how much more angle i put on the grinder , the file does not want to file the very top of the cutters (teeth). Is there a time when the chain just does not like to stay sharp? I had it pretty good, and just then I hit the raker guide that I left on the log and dulled it again and now it is really down there. It still cuts, but not anything like a new chain. I have decided to just hand file after every other tank unless I get a diamond blade for my grinder or I hit metal.
"get the gullet" lotta times the round file will sorta walk up and leave you withe a negative rake on the top plate, it will still cut, sorta, but not nearly as aggressive, that our you need to hit the rakers a little better. File when the saw is dull, not just for every tank or whatever, Hell I cut 4-6 hours a day and I've gotten a week out of a chain before (its rare... cause I still find dirt now and then)
So what I hear people saying is take it down the whole way and throw them out when the the fourth side (opposite the side plate side) is exhausted. I’ve never done the progressively shrinking triangle routine. I think your asking to break off teeth at that point.

But I hear people talking about breaking off teeth like it’s no big deal. What actually happens when you break a tooth off in the cut? Does it just come out of the bottom of the saw in the chip stream? Bounce off your cutting chaps or maybe lightly nick your leg if you’re wearing flip flops and gym shorts like all the nuts on YouTube?

I.e. Is the risk of breaking teeth even a real risk? I just assumed loose bits of sharp metal are a bad thing to be avoided when I started the thread. Doesn’t sound like folks are concerned.
you likely won't notice teef being broken, worst case one gets stuck in the wood and manages to take a few more with it. You should be wearing eye protection when running a saw so that would be the only soft squishy bit that would even remotely be in danger of broken teeth.
I have had every tooth on one side of chain come off in a single cut... not good... that damned tree tried to kill me as it was.. but I did manage to cut it up even with only one side working, I didn't really notice until I started limbing and it just wasn't doin the job...

Its a lot like getting hit in the face by something bigger and harder then you... teeth come out in pieces and you don't notice for a little while until its dinner time and it hurts like a MOFO for some strange reason... or if you whistle.. that can be pretty damned bad lol, cold air across a bunch of freshly exposed and frightened nerve endings...
 
I’m usually swapping chains long before I worry about breaking teeth and filing depth gauges too strategically. Sometimes I’ve sectioned up over a hundred trees and sharpened nearly 30 to 40 times. Teeth get messed up one way or another at some point and I’m spending more and more time filing and grinding than I want. At $25-$30 a loop, I feel like I get my money’s worth long before I’m milking the last bit of life out of it. Just my experience.
 
I’m usually swapping chains long before I worry about breaking teeth and filing depth gauges too strategically. Sometimes I’ve sectioned up over a hundred trees and sharpened nearly 30 to 40 times. Teeth get messed up one way or another at some point and I’m spending more and more time filing and grinding than I want. At $25-$30 a loop, I feel like I get my money’s worth long before I’m milking the last bit of life out of it. Just my experience.
Good thread.........well......better than an oil thread anyway.
I care for the Jonsered /Jonsereds saws for three brothers....all work the same.....and all have a number of saws....a saw comes in for repairs and the chains are filed way down to the point where teeth are missing. I do the repairs and put on my own B&C to test the saw, then put the original B&C back on. Those boyz sure get they're money's worth out of a chain!!! Myself.... I give it up a little bit earlier than that. But they all cut a good bit of wood and are good hand filers so I don't find fault. So IMHO it all depends on how much you want to spend and/or how good you are at chain filing /care. As long as good chips are being produced your saw is happy.......not matter how long the tooth.
 

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