So what's the current Two stroke oil favorite for

[bwalker]

No offence taken , however your in error again Ben . I was just relating information that was passed on by a very knowledgible engine builder & former Road bike Racer. The gentleman I spoke of owns & operates a Performance Shop . He builds high performance recreational & race 4-cycle & 2-cycle engines . Tests various engines with his in-house dyno . It was he that mentioned the potential performance & reliability of current FC & FD Synthetics @ leaner oil ratio's in comparison to what I refer to as FB mineral oils & bottom shelf FC synthetic oils. That yes , are 4 decades old technology , however light yrs ahead of 7 decade old SAE.30 Non detergent oil ratio's technology @ 16:1 . Again you are in error that throwing more oil into the mix to seal piston rings & provide more energy in the fuel charge is also not ancient thinking & 4 decade old science brother ! Yes Opti2 & Saber were designed to run at leaner ratios to reduce potential plug fouling , today more of a emissions abatement strategy . Anyhow , I think as a Certified Stationary Engineer , I comprehend what my associate said , within the more oil & energy is more than satisfied buy the Race fuel energy efficiency increases today . Less oil in the mix in a properly operating & tuned engine is not necessarily a liability in regards to performance or reliability !

I am a licensed Operating engineer first class(high pressure) in two states. On top of that I currently work in oil refining.... Yvonne Duhamel if he were still alive would be 80 some years old. Your living in the past and your sources are not that great.
The other thing is I would challenge to name one high performance two cycle that's used L rings that has been produced in the last 30 years.

 

[Ronaldo]

Prefer to shop local than buy off amazon plus there is a lot of mark up there and shipping cost.

I prefer to give local businesses my money as well, however, I've not found anyone that carries the Opti-2 in any type of quantity. I get free shipping on my on line orders.

Sent from my SM-G930VL using Tapatalk

 

[bwalker]

I prefer to give local businesses my money as well, however, I've not found anyone that carries the Opti-2 in any type of quantity. I get free shipping on my on line orders.

Sent from my SM-G930VL using Tapatalk

Our Ace Hardware has it.

 

[KASH]

Back to spark plugsI in the ancient days of snowmobiling the twin cylinder fan cooled sleds had a tendency to foul the cylinder farthest from the fan.We ran a hotter plug on that side.
Broken thanks for your concern about the weather in my part of the country. We are in a cold snap_37 last nite I went outside and when I stopped for a leak it was so cold I had to pee walking backwards.
Kash

 

[jellyroll]

My redmax from 2005 has the original Champion RZ7C in it i give it a quick cleaning with solvent and a wire wheel every spring might look into a new one this time since the electrode is no longer sharp and flat at the gap.

 

[North by Northwest]

Except no such magic additives exist and piston and ring designs in two cycles haven't changed in a long time. ISO EGD, the most stringent two cycle oil spec is probaly over 20 years old for instance. Two stroke development oil development has been stagnant for years.
Plus no racing form that still uses two cycles and where max HP is an advantage runs high ratios. Karts for instance use really heavy ratios of 16-20:1. Same story for the last GP bikes.

Go cart engines are dinosaur technology , but so are 2T Cycles . That's why they stopped production of 2T dirt bikes for. a few yrs . 2 much oil in the mix , could not pass epa protocols , therefore the leaner oil ratio trending . I hear that one major manufacturer (KTM) has brought back a new 2T version for the MX Open Class to compete against the 4 cycles . Anyhow do not follow dirt bike action much anymore !

 

[North by Northwest]

Yeah I’ve always liked ngk plugs. Suzuki 4 stroke 70 or 75 horse. Burnt the tip the electrode fires onto off. Didn’t run 10 minutes. Pretty odd. Just a one off. Replaced that one again and never changed the plugs again. Had some trouble with spark plugs in that engine However I’ll blame ngk for one single failed plug. Not close to enough reason to stop using them. I like them very well

I ran a Evinrude V-4 90 hp outboard for 10 yrs on Spectro , a marine grade oil very similar to Opti2 . The engine was rated for 32:1 in the late 70's . I ran it at 70:1 idled for hrs & ran wot , never a miss & optimal plug coloration . Once the Spectro was discontinued I went to Amsoil Marine Injector / Premix oil @ same ratio for another 10 ys . All this run time on NGK plugs that replaced the OEM Champions in 1980 . Sold the boat & motor 2001 to a buddy . He still has it today on a different boat lol.

 

[North by Northwest]

Back to spark plugsI in the ancient days of snowmobiling the twin cylinder fan cooled sleds had a tendency to foul the cylinder farthest from the fan.We ran a hotter plug on that side.
Broken thanks for your concern about the weather in my part of the country. We are in a cold snap_37 last nite I went outside and when I stopped for a leak it was so cold I had to pee walking backwards.
Kash

That's cold ! Yeah a lot of plug fouling issues with early generation Premix oils , even once actual 2T oils hit the market . We always ran different heat range on the pto side on Air cooled twins & on Air cooled triples the centre cylinder ran 2 ranges colder & 1 range colder on the liquids . My current Polaris 700 & 850 liquid twins run so consistent that stock plug spec are optimal unless high elevation powder riding then perhaps 1 range colder , even with new aftermarket tuned pipes & can !

 

[jellyroll]

I ran a Evinrude V-4 90 hp outboard for 10 yrs on Spectro , a marine grade oil very similar to Opti2 . The engine was rated for 32:1 in the late 70's . I ran it at 70:1 idled for hrs & ran wot , never a miss & optimal plug coloration . Once the Spectro was discontinued I went to Amsoil Marine Injector / Premix oil @ same ratio for another 10 ys . All this run time on NGK plugs that replaced the OEM Champions in 1980 . Sold the boat & motor 2001 to a buddy . He still has it today on a different boat lol.

Much prefer my current outboard it holds 18 ounces of 25w40 in the crankcase and i use a external tank for it. that 5 hp will run all day on 2 gallons.
Just a basic air cooled briggs outboard

 

[North by Northwest]

Much prefer my current outboard it holds 18 ounces of 25w40 in the crankcase and i use a external tank for it. that 5 hp will run all day on 2 gallons.
Just a basic air cooled briggs outboard

Hope you wear your hearing protection !

 

[jellyroll]

Hope you wear your hearing protection !

mine has the exhaust pipe going into the water .

 

[bwalker]

Go cart engines are dinosaur technology , but so are 2T Cycles . That's why they stopped production of 2T dirt bikes for. a few yrs . 2 much oil in the mix , could not pass epa protocols , therefore the leaner oil ratio trending . I hear that one major manufacturer (KTM) has brought back a new 2T version for the MX Open Class to compete against the 4 cycles . Anyhow do not follow dirt bike action much anymore !

Why two strokes cant pass emmissions standards has nothing to do with burning oil. It's all about unburnt charge escaping to the exhaust during the scavenging process. Has nothing to do with oil.
KART engines can be pretty advanced. Shifter carts use the latest 125 mx bike engines for instance and they're are many European makes that produce state of the art kart motors now.
KTM has solved this issue with transfer port injection. Yamaha two strokes never went away.

 

[LoneOak]

Fuel has improved with things like MTBE, isoprene, etc. These have nothing to do with using less oil in your fuel, which is what we were discussing. It's also of not that pump fuel quality has actually decreased over time given the various RFG requirements on RVP, etc.
And no offense intended but your talking ancient history. Like 4 and a half decades ago. Yea things have changed since then, but very little change in the last 20 or more years. The 100:1 products amsoil sells have been around for decades yet no serious racer uses them at those ratios. Same with Opti. Both are old technology to deal with plug fouling and deposits that existed decades ago that simply are not an issue now. Haven't been an issue since FC and GC came out really.

MTBE is not an improvement, it was a detriment and as such, has been banned/ phased out in the U.S. since the early 2000s

 

[bwalker]

MTBE is not an improvement, it was a detriment and as such, has been banned/ phased out in the U.S. since the early 2000s

It's a great improvement in race fuel where its still used to this day.
It did have issues environmental wise when it got into ground water from leaky fuel tanks. Although the root of the problem was the leaky tanks, not the Mtbe.

 

[North by Northwest]

Why two strokes cant pass emmissions standards has nothing to do with burning oil. It's all about unburnt charge escaping to the exhaust during the scavenging process. Has nothing to do with oil.
KART engines can be pretty advanced. Shifter carts use the latest 125 mx bike engines for instance and they're are many European makes that produce state of the art kart motors now.
KTM has solved this issue with transfer port injection. Yamaha two strokes never went away.

It's a great improvement in race fuel where its still used to this day.
It did have issues environmental wise when it got into ground water from leaky fuel tanks. Although the root of the problem was the leaky tanks, not the Mtbe.

Like talking to the wall Lone Oak , when Ben gets his mind set , no reasoning with him Dude ! I mentioned to him the trade off of his archiac Methology of throwing more oil in the mix to enhance engine sealing capabilities to produce more horsepower vs the higher octane more oxygenated (MTBE) Race Fuels achieving the same end game via much leaner oil ratio's with today's modern synthetic oils ! Also advised him that 2 stroke cycles have gone the way of the dodo bird do inpart to the Polyaromatic hydrocarbons that they produce to the atmosphere , wether due to scavenging effect or in his case over rich oil to fuel ratio's . He won't hear of it . Just goes around in circles with his dogma , which is in direct conflict with what engine & oil manufacturers have engineered into ( new twist ) numerous modern outboards @ 100:1 ratio's ( Yamaha 1997) & Suzuki , Nissan (2018) . Anyhow , good luck pardner you going to need it . I think Ben needs to do a serious self evaluation & try to learn to play well with others while in the sand box ! Nothing personal intended of course !

 

[North by Northwest]

Why two strokes cant pass emmissions standards has nothing to do with burning oil. It's all about unburnt charge escaping to the exhaust during the scavenging process. Has nothing to do with oil.
KART engines can be pretty advanced. Shifter carts use the latest 125 mx bike engines for instance and they're are many European makes that produce state of the art kart motors now.
KTM has solved this issue with transfer port injection. Yamaha two strokes never went away.

Allowing excessive poly-aromatic hydro carbons to enter the atmosphere is a direct conflict of interest within quality of air abatement emission control perimeters dude ! Also throwing extra oil to seal piston to ring & ring to cylinder wall sealing surfaces , is poor engineering , when better component metallurgy & coatings are available to ensure less piston distortion ( thermal growth ) & ring twisting & inherent blow by Ben !

 

[CJ1]

Go cart engines are dinosaur technology , but so are 2T Cycles . That's why they stopped production of 2T dirt bikes for. a few yrs . 2 much oil in the mix , could not pass epa protocols , therefore the leaner oil ratio trending . I hear that one major manufacturer (KTM) has brought back a new 2T version for the MX Open Class to compete against the 4 cycles . Anyhow do not follow dirt bike action much anymore !

KTM never stopped building and developing the 2 stroke. The big 3 keep pushing the 4 stroke and they have the majority of the $$$ so that is where we are at. At some local tracks they let modded 300's run against the 450 4 strokes and thats when the complaining starts. It is a shame that a kid starting out has to spend $3500 on a 4st cylinder head so he is competitive vs $2000 for a whole engine for a 2 stroke. But as usual follow the $$$. And yes I ran and raced both. I am faster on a 4 stroke but have way more fun on a 2 stroke! That is all I own now. CJ

 

[North by Northwest]

It's a great improvement in race fuel where its still used to this day.
It did have issues environmental wise when it got into ground water from leaky fuel tanks. Although the root of the problem was the leaky tanks, not the Mtbe.

Its just another case of poor engineering protocols & lack of due diligence to ensure protection of the environment (water , air or ground ) . Ben !

 

[bwalker]

Like talking to the wall Lone Oak , when Ben , gets his mind set no reasoning with him Dude ! I mentioned to him the trade off of his archiac Methology of throwing more oil in the mix to enhance engine sealing capabilities to produce more horsepower vs the higher octane more oxygenated (MTBE) Race Fuels achieving the same end game via much leaner oil ratio's with today's modern synthetic oils ! Also advised him that 2 stroke cycles have gone the way of the dodo bird do inpart to the Polyaromatic hydrocarbons that they produce to the atmosphere , wether due to scavenging effect or in his case over rich oil to fuel ratio's . He won't hear of it . Just goes around in circles with his dogma , which is in direct conflict with what engine & oil manufacturers have engineered into numerous modern outboards @ 100:1 ratio's ( Yamaha 1997) & Suzuki , Nissan (2018) . Also in Evinrude / Johnson Direct Oil Injected / Etec variable rate injection @ 80 :1 off idle to 50:1 WOT . Anyhow , good luck pardner you going to need it . I think Ben needs to do a serious self evaluation & try to learn tobpkay well with others while in the sand box ! Nothing personal intended of course !

You are bringing up two seperate and unrelated issues. Yes, you can make more HP with doped race fuels and yes more oil makes more power. One doesn't invalidate the other.
Those Yamaha outboards run much longer at 50:1 BTW and I have purchased more Yamaha outboards than you ever will given my previous occupation.
ETEC isn't remotely the same thing as it has targeted oiling no gasoline in the crankcase.
Someone this stuff is so elementary it's ridiculous and yet you still continue to come to all sorts of false conclusions.

 

[bwalker]

Its just another case of poor engineering protocols & lack of due diligence to ensure protection of the environment (water , air or ground ) . Ben !

Yes, in the use of steel below ground storage tanks.