Stihl should be ashamed of themselves.

[Vintage Engine Repairs]

I like Stihl, but they make the worse air filtration on their saws.

 

[rwoods]

I have never been accused of proper maintenance, especially when it comes to chainsaw air filters, but all of this talk about fines and the 500i made me curious - so I took a couple pictures tonight of my 500i which I have had since October 2020 and probably 50 to 75 tanks ran through it with to my recollection only one thumping of the filter against a stump last spring. Despite my dull chains and mucho dead ash dust this is how it looks tonight. FWIW from what I see either mine is tighter than most, or some folks have a dud.

Small pile inside the opal but outside the sealing area.


The filter is rather brown.



Ron

 

[bullittman281]

Good evening.

We have one of these at work. They ARE awesome!! Because of this thread I had a closer look at how ours is doing. Its sucking dust. The first big problem is the stub that the filter and cover mount on. The little bitty foam ring is NOT enough. I bet thats where most of the crap gets through. The video on the previous page addresses that. The second is if its getting though the filter it self. Thats just bad. The filter itself looks good but that may no be the whole deal. Unacceptable at this price point and intent of the saw. My fix for crap elements on many things is K&N spray oil. Its the lightest, cheapest, crappiest air filter oil. Its perfect for this problem. WD40 or similar could do the same thing. Not sure long term affects on the filter but it WILL stop if from sucking dust though the filter element. It does eliminate field cleanings though. Not gonna just tap the dust out. Our 880 runs a similar looking element and it seems fine. They mount different. My gut says the worst of it is the foam washer is not nearly thick enough. A spacer under it or a second one maybe on top of the filter as well may be the best bet.


Bullittman

 

[scallywag]

Ironbark and no never bothered ever worrying about fines getting through as I've pulled down our saws over the years with couple thousand hrs on em with zero damage from fines must be the oil we run.

Or is it the amount of oil you run?

 

[Dennisthemenace]

Or is it the amount of oil you run?

Betcha we are not the only blokes interested in Mr rogue60's answer to your question, lol

 

[rogue60]

Or is it the amount of oil you run?

25:1 mineral oil shock horror! lol
As I said never seen damage from fines myself and none of our saws got babied. tap the filter out and hit with air occasionally but we got very high hrs out of em.



That's me and dad late ish 70's yeah he loved his 090's. He was pissed when they stopped selling 090's in AU he reckons it was because Stihl wasn't making money selling new saws because the 090's go forever! lol

 

[gyp69]

25:1 mineral oil shock horror! lol
As I said never seen damage from fines myself and none of our saws got babied. tap the filter out and hit with air occasionally but we got very high hrs out of em.
View attachment 960065View attachment 960066View attachment 960067View attachment 960068


That's me and dad late ish 70's yeah he loved his 090's. He was pissed when they stopped selling 090's in AU he reckons it was because Stihl wasn't making money selling new saws because the 090's go forever! lol

View attachment 960069

That’s a great pic of you and your dad! I bet you felt like a little badass holding that 090 while cutting! Piston looks good what mix oil do you use down there? I am not trying to start an oil thread just curious.

 

[SamT1]

I had a bit yesterday evening while waiting for a customer to show up. 5 tanks of fuel since I put a rubber washer between the filter and half turn lock. It kept the stuff out from under the filter. Now just have way too many fines that I’m less worried about. I’m gonna silicone it down and order an aftermarket filter.

 

[rogue60]

That’s a great pic of you and your dad! I bet you felt like a little badass holding that 090 while cutting! Piston looks good what mix oil do you use down there? I am not trying to start an oil thread just curious.

Nothing fancy used this for couple decades never had an oil related problem/failure and a crap ton of fines don't seem to bother anything? even with high silica content timber. burns clean for the hrs no carboned up exhaust ports excellent ring seal throughout a saws life. Run it at 25:1 and tuned in 090 076 066 660 661 088 880 hard-working work saws over the years.

 

[SamT1]

Nothing fancy used this for couple decades never had an oil related problem/failure and a crap ton of fines don't seem to bother anything? even with high silica content timber. burns clean for the hrs no carboned up exhaust ports excellent ring seal throughout a saws life. Run it at 25:1 and tuned in 090 076 066 660 661 088 880 hard-working work saws over the years.
View attachment 960097

Will a 500I tune itself at 25:1? I’ve been running Stihl grey bottle at about 45:1, .9 gallons to a 2.6oz bottle. May try a tank at 2 bottles.

 

[vision976]

I had a bit yesterday evening while waiting for a customer to show up. 5 tanks of fuel since I put a rubber washer between the filter and half turn lock. It kept the stuff out from under the filter. Now just have way too many fines that I’m less worried about. I’m gonna silicone it down and order an aftermarket filter.

The video by Cotontop3 showed he placed the rubber washer under the factory foam washer, which would push the factory foam washer up tighter against the underside surface of the top of the filter, when locked in place. You placed your rubber washer on top of the filter rather than underneath it; I wonder if the washer location makes a difference in sealing ability?

 

[stihlaficionado]

The first 500i's off the assembly line had a loose fitting air filter cover.
The fix was to double the foam washer that goes between the cover & the injector housing.

there is a vid on youtube on this.

I did it on mine & it worked perfectly.

Stihl was to have fixed that in later production runs. So my question is: When did you buy the saw?

 

[user 122190]

The first 500i's off the assembly line had a loose fitting air filter cover.
The fix was to double the foam washer that goes between the cover & the injector housing.

there is a vid on youtube on this.

I did it on mine & it worked perfectly.

Stihl was to have fixed that in later production runs. So my question is: When did you buy the saw?

Or what is the Date Of Manufacture. I bought my 500i in Sept21, yet the DOM is May21.

 

[SamT1]

The video by Cotontop3 showed he placed the rubber washer under the factory foam washer, which would push the factory foam washer up tighter against the underside surface of the top of the filter, when locked in place. You placed your rubber washer on top of the filter rather than underneath it; I wonder if the washer location makes a difference in sealing ability?

My debris is coming in under the filter base. So adding a washer under the filter center stud would make that worse. I can tolerate the little coming in the center stud hole.

 

[SamT1]

Or what is the Date Of Manufacture. I bought my 500i in Sept21, yet the DOM is May21.

Bought January of 21.

 

[user 122190]

Bought January of 21.

DOM is on the sticker that is under the handle. AKA foot rest for starting. You should see the DOM just before displ: 79cc.

 

[SamT1]

DOM is on the sticker that is under the handle. AKA foot rest for starting. You should see the DOM just before displ: 79cc.

5.20

 

[vision976]

So adding a washer under the filter center stud would make that worse

OK, so the dirt/fines was getting inside the injector housing from under the base of the filter, until you put the rubber washer above the filter top, causing a little more "down pressure" on the bottom of the filter... Makes sense... Except that I looked at my 500i's filter and it appears the lower surface of the filter is actually sealed to the injector housing by a two-lipped circumfrential rubber gasket seal, that seals agains the vertical edge of the cylinder portion of the injector housing. So a little more down pressure applied from the top of the filter, shouldn't affect the sealing properties of the circular seal, which is injection-molded into the hard plastic of the lower filter housing. That circular rubber seal on my filter is an interference fit, meaning the diameter of the hole in the seal is smaller than the outside of the vertical wall of the injector housing it slides over. It takes a bit of force to slide the filter down to where it is pressed against the flat portion of the injector house.

If you had fines and dirt getting past that lower seal, then maybe the filter is/was defective. Maybe the rubber seal got hard over time, dried out from heat and just isn't doing the job it is supposed to be doing. Certainly applying a little of the recommended vacuum grease to the sealing surfaces would help it to slide home a little easier and reduce the chance of wear in the surface.

I've included pictures of the filter showing the injection molded rubber seal with the two edges, a picture of a straight edge atop the bottom of the filter showing light leaking past the molded seal and the hard plastic base of the filter housing. Last picture shows a dent in the shape of a ring in the foam washer on the stud which is supposed to seal that area under the filter top. I couldn't tell by looking at the picture you posted of the same foam washer atop the stud, that it was being compressed properly. At least I couldn't see a defined, crisp mark like on mine.

When I twist the locking nut on the stud, I can see the plastic cover bends in a little as the knob is rotated, and then springs back out when the nut goes over center.

For sure the Max Flow after market filter looks like it will solve the problem if the stock one can't.

 

[lone wolf]

OK, so the dirt/fines was getting inside the injector housing from under the base of the filter, until you put the rubber washer above the filter top, causing a little more "down pressure" on the bottom of the filter... Makes sense... Except that I looked at my 500i's filter and it appears the lower surface of the filter is actually sealed to the injector housing by a two-lipped circumfrential rubber gasket seal, that seals agains the vertical edge of the cylinder portion of the injector housing. So a little more down pressure applied from the top of the filter, shouldn't affect the sealing properties of the circular seal, which is injection-molded into the hard plastic of the lower filter housing. That circular rubber seal on my filter is an interference fit, meaning the diameter of the hole in the seal is smaller than the outside of the vertical wall of the injector housing it slides over. It takes a bit of force to slide the filter down to where it is pressed against the flat portion of the injector house.

If you had fines and dirt getting past that lower seal, then maybe the filter is/was defective. Maybe the rubber seal got hard over time, dried out from heat and just isn't doing the job it is supposed to be doing. Certainly applying a little of the recommended vacuum grease to the sealing surfaces would help it to slide home a little easier and reduce the chance of wear in the surface.

I've included pictures of the filter showing the injection molded rubber seal with the two edges, a picture of a straight edge atop the bottom of the filter showing light leaking past the molded seal and the hard plastic base of the filter housing. Last picture shows a dent in the shape of a ring in the foam washer on the stud which is supposed to seal that area under the filter top. I couldn't tell by looking at the picture you posted of the same foam washer atop the stud, that it was being compressed properly. At least I couldn't see a defined, crisp mark like on mine.

When I twist the locking nut on the stud, I can see the plastic cover bends in a little as the knob is rotated, and then springs back out when the nut goes over center.

For sure the Max Flow after market filter looks like it will solve the problem if the stock one can't.

Find any fines in the throat when you opened it up?

 

[vision976]

Find any fines in the throat when you opened it up?

No, but my saw is brand new and hasn't been used to cut anything, so no field experience to report on.