Vintage Homelite 450 and SuperXL

[user 181829]

I am in the process of putting my father's 2 vintage Homelites back in service and hit a snag.

I started with Big Red (the 450) which I had used for over 5 years after he passed it on to me nearly 20 years ago. It sat for well over 10 years with old fuel so I expected it to have some challenges. I ultimately replaced fuel line/filter , spark plug and rebuilt carb with no significant evident problems found. I put off replacing the impulse line because it was a little more teardown (airbox removal) to do so. When I did pull it, the line *seemed* a little soft but not cracked/etc. The thimble going into the crankcase was in good shape, but I replaced the line itself on principle.

Throughout the the whole time, the engine was fuel-starved in the extreme, firing/running only with a manual prime, and then only occasionally *seeming* to run on fuel *drawn* from the tank. I finally checked the vacuum leak-down on the impulse and the fuel pickup side of the carb with no leakdown detected. I have not gauged the compression but there *feels* to be plenty of compression by starter-cord-pull and it *does* run pretty strong while the prime fuel lasts (5-20 secs depending on choking).

I could not feel any impulse pressure/vacuum by placing my finger over the line and now with a vacuum guage I also don't see any pulsing when I turn it over.

The only unexpected behaviour I detect with the vacuum tester is that I get either open-circuit (no vacuum held) or fully-closed (immediate and full vacuum holding) at the impulse line. Without the intake/exhaust ports sealed I shouldn't expect any vacuum to hold? It is as if the impulse line in the crankcase is sometimes jammed against something, sealing completely?

Li'l Blue ran well with nothing more than fresh fuel... I can't cross-check impulse-line behaviour with it since it does not have a line but gets it's impulse through channels in the case/boot. I haven't "load tested" this one yet, but unloaded it runs/responds very well.

I was planning to gift Old Red to a friend but now suppose I will pass Li'l Blue on instead.

Anybody with more experience troubleshooting these vintage workhorses have any ideas?

- Steve

 

[Roanoker494]

Put a dob of grease on the impulse line, seal the line with it. With the spark plug installed, pull the cord. If it sucks the grease in, or blows it out, you have impulse signal. Even if you have impulse the line could be soft and sucking closed when installed on the carb. Are you sure you installed all the carb diaphragm and gaskets correctly. It is a rookie mistake to make but, after 15 years of working on saws, I actually just done it myself. Also, make sure your inlet needle lever is set correctly. Run both adjustment screws in and back them out 1¼ turns. I pulled on a old Stihl 051 for a half hour before realizing I left the needles fully seated.

 

[user 181829]

I haven't done the "dob of grease" test yet, but see the unequivocal results it should give. A vacuum guage on the line shows nothing. I replaced the (40 year old?) line with a new one from a set from Leon's. I double-checked as I installed the diaphragm and gaskets that they could not be inverted... and then after installed did a vacuum test which suggested (intake and impulse) that they were closing and sealing. I did triple check the 1.25 turn on the needles... I've done that one (wrong) before!

I definitely need to check the inlet needle lever again as I may misunderstand it's proper function/setting... though I *did not* adjust/manipulate it.
I am prepared to check case seal next, as much as I hate that. I've been reluctant for at least the reason that I haven't been able to find replacement seals if they *do* show leaky.

 

[Marine-piper]

I just finished 2 450s and the one thing you didn't mention was if you replaced the carb boot behind the carb mounting plate. Now there are 2 styles of 450s with 1 having a plate you can remove from inside the airbox and the other needs a deeper teardown. If you can remove the carb, plate and fiber backer you should be able to reach the impulse nipple.

Homelite enthusiast in training [emoji879]

 

[user 181829]

sweet! That machine sure looks familiar! I did pull the airbox to inspect the nipple and bought a new boot which I haven't installed, the old one *looks* fine, but I wanted to be ready if I dig that deep again. I'm scared that I have a case/seal leakdown problem, so I guess I should bite the bullet and pull the airbox and exhaust so I can seal and do a proper test. Especially if the "daub of grease" test fails as I expect it to!

Even if/when I get it running I'll probably be looking for a new home/owner for it. It deserves another 40 years of good use/maintenance. I was cutting all my own firewood *off property* until about 10 years ago when I had to take down a *mighty* cottonwood in my courtyard which has provided a dribble of good wood (splitting down what was probably 10 cords of rounds up to 4' diameter). Since then I've been doing utility brush clearing/pruning on my 1.5 acres... mostly elm and russian olive and getting nearly enough for my 1-1.5 cords/winter consumption. I also built a passive sunroom on my southside with a rocket-mass heater which both reduces total consumption, increases my comfort, and consumes small-diameter "twigs" that don't even *need* a chainsaw!

I really appreciate all the support here and will try to keep everyone updated as I go another round or two with it.

If I didn't mention it in an earlier post, my dad purchased big-red in 1979 while in KY for a summer (after his early retirement from the USFS) helping his sister put my Grandfather's 40 acre hobby-farm back to rights. He hadn't brought his SuperXL, so bit the bullet and bought this one.

- Steve

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Does anybody have any idea of how low you can go on compression and still have a Super XL that will run? Mine has about 110 or so and I can't get it to hit a lick and some of our members here say that 110 is plenty. I've checked everything else I can think of but still can't get it to start..I have another Super XL that starts and runs great but it has a bunch more compression.

 

[SAWTECH1]

Does anybody have any idea of how low you can go on compression and still have a Super XL that will run? Mine has about 110 or so and I can't get it to hit a lick and some of our members here say that 110 is plenty. I've checked everything else I can think of but still can't get it to start..I have another Super XL that starts and runs great but it has a bunch more compression.

I would think 110 would be enough to start the saw. I would check spark, timing....etc

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Back when I first tried starting the Super XL I think I remember checking the spark and just putting a bit of fuel down the sparkplug hole and it didn't hit. One thing I'm sure I didn't check was the reed valve assembly. I thought I had a spare piston/cylinder outfit but when I looked the piston wasn't a match to the cylinder. Both were new but there was about 1/8" play between the piston and cylinder.

 

[SAWTECH1]

Yes thats true also check for spark. the coil may have expired over the years of sitting,

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Yes thats true also check for spark. the coil may have expired over the years of sitting,

I think I did but it sure won't hurt to check it. I've kinda moved away from some of the older saws for awhile since I acquired a bunch more to get running. I'm supposed to get another truckload of saws tomorrow morning to fix. I just mess with them when the weather isn't too cold..

 

[SAWTECH1]

I think I did but it sure won't hurt to check it. I've kinda moved away from some of the older saws for awhile since I acquired a bunch more to get running. I'm supposed to get another truckload of saws tomorrow morning to fix. I just mess with them when the weather isn't too cold..

I know the feeling of getting more to do than my fair share. Do you know of anyone who might have Mccollugh parts?

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I know the feeling of getting more to do than my fair share. Do you know of anyone who might have Mccollugh parts?

What model of McCulloch?

 

[SAWTECH1]

What model of McCulloch?

I have a 1-70 and a 640 to work on. Could use any help, or manuals you may know of.

 

[a. palmer jr.]

I have a 1-70 and a 640 to work on. Could use any help, or manuals you may know of.

I've never had either of those so probably wouldn't have any parts. The manuals can be had in the "beg for manuals" thread here on AS.

 

[SAWTECH1]

I've never had either of those so probably wouldn't have any parts. The manuals can be had in the "beg for manuals" thread here on AS.

Thanks for checking. Have you worked on any Mccullogh saws from the 1960?

 

[SAWTECH1]

I've never had either of those so probably wouldn't have any parts. The manuals can be had in the "beg for manuals" thread here on AS.

Thanks again

 

[a. palmer jr.]

Thanks for checking. Have you worked on any Mccullogh saws from the 1960?

I've worked on a few oldies. I think I used to cut with a 1-42. I've worked on several 10-10s and variations of that, like the 700. Some of those old saws I wish I had back. I have a box of parts to an old Mac 10-10 but I don't think I have enough parts to put together a saw. Eventually one will come along though..

 

[a. palmer jr.]

My "truckload" of saws that I was supposed to get was only 6 saws, a Husqvarna 435, a couple of Craftsman plastic saws, two EZ Homelites, and a couple of others I can't remember, nothing too impressive but I'm just gonna see if I can fix them then return them to the owner. There was several others over there but I can always go back and get them if I run out of something to do...

 

[thenne1713]

Does anybody have any idea of how low you can go on compression and still have a Super XL that will run? Mine has about 110 or so and I can't get it to hit a lick and some of our members here say that 110 is plenty. I've checked everything else I can think of but still can't get it to start..I have another Super XL that starts and runs great but it has a bunch more compression.

I know Husqvarna says MIN=120, but start w/ Basics= Plug wet/dry after cranking x2-x3 with switch=Off; Good spark w/ Plug out? Results= 2 of the 3 basics... What are they?

 

[a. palmer jr.]

My old Lawn Boy mower has run for years with around 90 compression but it's quite different from a Husqvarna chainsaw...