and thats why we have the 2nd.... as Brandon said... Just get a shot gun. a deer slug works wonders to un**** your mindset...
What to do about persistent poachers?
- Thread starter Kdawg
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I've had at least 6 vehicles towed from my property (I have a book with the plate numbers, dates, vehicle descriptions, and names in it, but it's packed for moving) and I have yet to have one person retaliate in any way, shape or form. That includes trash dumpers that the EPA thoroughly screwed over.
People will try to push you, to see how much resistance you put up. Put up no resistance and they will walk all over you. Word will spread thru their friends and they will walk all over you.
I have heard from more than one person to beware of the crazy guy that lives (at my address) because he doesn't take sh*t from anyone.
If you want to live your life getting walked on, more power to you. It never appealed to me.
In the (good?) old days here in the UK the game keepers used to carry a couple of cartridges with the lead taken out and refilled with salt, which they would discharge at a poacher’s backside as he clambered over a gate. To escape. They also had trip wires to set off cartridges but maybe these could be employed to fire a bright yellow indelible paint over any passerby.
Just do not forget where you have put them!
Just do not forget where you have put them!
And get a Lawyer on retainer
My county sheriff told me that is someone parks on my property illegally, I can take possession of his vehicle. I can prevent him from taking it with him, or have it towed away and impounded. Check your local regulations.
Ignorant, petty people will usually not be dissuaded unless you can legally remove money from their bank in civil court. You can't fix stupid and you can't rearrange someone's thought process.
My son and I caught a guy stealing stuff from my property. We hurt him really badly, then tied his feet and hands with duct tape and threw him on a pile of garbage. Called the local PD. For the grace of God, I wasn't arrested.
I got a half hr lecture by a female cop about 'equal force'. The gist if it was.....you can't do anything more to someone than they physically did to you. So grounding and pounding the guy was supposedly a 'mistake' on our part.
Kevin
You make some good points, but I still like hearing your story!Ignorant, petty people will usually not be dissuaded unless you can legally remove money from their bank in civil court. You can't fix stupid and you can't rearrange someone's thought process.
My son and I caught a guy stealing stuff from my property. We hurt him really badly, then tied his feet and hands with duct tape and threw him on a pile of garbage. Called the local PD. For the grace of God, I wasn't arrested.
I got a half hr lecture by a female cop about 'equal force'. The gist if it was.....you can't do anything more to someone than they physically did to you. So grounding and pounding the guy was supposedly a 'mistake' on our part.
Kevin
Here in the UK the response has to be reasonable and proportional which I think is reasonable and ultimately if it ends with serious injury or death, you have the jury to hear the evidence and decideIgnorant, petty people will usually not be dissuaded unless you can legally remove money from their bank in civil court. You can't fix stupid and you can't rearrange someone's thought process.
My son and I caught a guy stealing stuff from my property. We hurt him really badly, then tied his feet and hands with duct tape and threw him on a pile of garbage. Called the local PD. For the grace of God, I wasn't arrested.
I got a half hr lecture by a female cop about 'equal force'. The gist if it was.....you can't do anything more to someone than they physically did to you. So grounding and pounding the guy was supposedly a 'mistake' on our part.
Kevin
That's pretty much the same here only they call it 'equal force' and it varies state to state. In Texas you can pretty much do what you want to an intruder breaking into your home....police will turn away, usually. However, you can't set up booby traps and/or 'torture' them for like hrs on end. You can kill them or subdue them with force. Other states are similar, but in some eastern states, you cannot shoot or attack an intruder unless you've tried every reasonable way to retreat or leave your dwelling. So if they back you into a corner, threaten your life/your family, you have no exit and you have access to a handgun, you're allowed to use it. Yeah, seriously.
Then there's the 'castle doctrine' or whatever they call it....wherein your domicile is your castle and nobody is allowed to enter without permission...except the cops of course. That's been really tested recently where people have shot perps through a closed entrance door. Pretty stupid really, as you should identify the intruder. Could be a neighbor or relative....somebody you know. In the heat of things, it's easy to get scared with somebody at your door late at night.
Kevin
You are assuming that they actually have money in the bank....chances are they won't, and unless you can secure a lien on their property you won't get any sort of financial award from the court.
It doesn't take much to usually hurt these kinds of people financially. Even a low dollar/no dollar settlement can destroy their credit further and leave them angry for yrs to come.
They apply for a job or try to get credit for something and there it is, unresolved.
Kevin
damaging a car/truck on your property that is not yours will get you in trouble - having towed away no. any stands you find, you may remove and do what ever with. installation of any device that would cause personal or vechile injury is verboton( implies premeditation) as well as sabotaging a stand to the same end. I fully understand the good old boy routine with the local LEO's, go upstairs from them. Post a notice in the section of the local or state paper/journal that is for official notices with the description of property provided by the taxation authority to the effect that the land is posted ( this puts pressure on the local enforcement agencies)
First off, Hope everyone is fairing better than average and thanks for your support on this issue.
Quick update to the persistent poacher saga:
Took the advice to get into drones and got an EVO 2 640T and a DJI Mini2. Have logged many many hours and getting the Part 107 license soon. Both of the drones can be anywhere on my 400+ac in minutes and this spring I caught 2 turkey poachers while on general patrol. The usual suspects. ruined their hunt for sure and I/the drone got flipped off for it... hahahahah The neat thing about the infrared camera drone is that I can see not only the poachers, but the deer too. Enough detail to see how many points on the rack even when bedded down. It has been pretty neat to watch the movement and behavior of the areas animals this summer. porcupines, coyotes, deer of course, turkeys, bobcats, a fisher cat most likely, etc. I know where they are, where they sleep and what their movement patterns are like. Another cool application will be to document when poachers drive deer pre-dawn off of a wide swath of land toward their properties... turns out that is illegal and up till now difficult to document.
Also took the advice to get pay hunters. Just finishing about 9 or 10ac of food plots away from the road and bristling with cameras both decoy and real. The pay hunter group has decided on being conspicuous to signal their claim on the hunting with blinds up already, etc.
Posting the property as a requisite for getting game wardens to write tickets will be solved by publishing a no hunting notice in the local papers with the legal description and boundaries from the deeds. apparently that is the best legal way to do it in NY and no poachers can mess with the signs and have an excuse. I'll still post the boundaries along the road and along the property line with the known poacher family. purple paint on that boundary as well. why not.
There are several well known trails to move through my property that have been there for generations. Having identified them, I have cameras up there too. Most of them come through very rugged "pinch points" that are not easily walked around.
The fine for poaching is basically a slap on the wrist or $200 which is much cheaper than the hunting lease. So I have civil suits mostly pre-written that can be filed within the next week after they get caught by game wardens or documented on the property where I will sue for the full amount of the lease each time they show up. Maybe that will get their attention finally.
Few other defenses in the works in way of electronic proximity detection by a variety of methods that can differentiate human from animal and for which I can call in drone support. more on that later if it works out.
I guess poaching for 5 years had me pretty upset already, but poaching my best dog on my property has kept me pissed off since it happened with action taken to defend the property effectively moving forward. I'll keep you informed. Thanks again for all the advice. If there are other thoughts or ideas let me know.
Quick update to the persistent poacher saga:
Took the advice to get into drones and got an EVO 2 640T and a DJI Mini2. Have logged many many hours and getting the Part 107 license soon. Both of the drones can be anywhere on my 400+ac in minutes and this spring I caught 2 turkey poachers while on general patrol. The usual suspects. ruined their hunt for sure and I/the drone got flipped off for it... hahahahah The neat thing about the infrared camera drone is that I can see not only the poachers, but the deer too. Enough detail to see how many points on the rack even when bedded down. It has been pretty neat to watch the movement and behavior of the areas animals this summer. porcupines, coyotes, deer of course, turkeys, bobcats, a fisher cat most likely, etc. I know where they are, where they sleep and what their movement patterns are like. Another cool application will be to document when poachers drive deer pre-dawn off of a wide swath of land toward their properties... turns out that is illegal and up till now difficult to document.
Also took the advice to get pay hunters. Just finishing about 9 or 10ac of food plots away from the road and bristling with cameras both decoy and real. The pay hunter group has decided on being conspicuous to signal their claim on the hunting with blinds up already, etc.
Posting the property as a requisite for getting game wardens to write tickets will be solved by publishing a no hunting notice in the local papers with the legal description and boundaries from the deeds. apparently that is the best legal way to do it in NY and no poachers can mess with the signs and have an excuse. I'll still post the boundaries along the road and along the property line with the known poacher family. purple paint on that boundary as well. why not.
There are several well known trails to move through my property that have been there for generations. Having identified them, I have cameras up there too. Most of them come through very rugged "pinch points" that are not easily walked around.
The fine for poaching is basically a slap on the wrist or $200 which is much cheaper than the hunting lease. So I have civil suits mostly pre-written that can be filed within the next week after they get caught by game wardens or documented on the property where I will sue for the full amount of the lease each time they show up. Maybe that will get their attention finally.
Few other defenses in the works in way of electronic proximity detection by a variety of methods that can differentiate human from animal and for which I can call in drone support. more on that later if it works out.
I guess poaching for 5 years had me pretty upset already, but poaching my best dog on my property has kept me pissed off since it happened with action taken to defend the property effectively moving forward. I'll keep you informed. Thanks again for all the advice. If there are other thoughts or ideas let me know.
The part about your dog still Makes my MAD boil. It has been a while since I read this thread but, People of this nature have earned any and all you can pin on them. The money and time you are investing could be considered JUSTICE if all works out. One hates to be the bad ass in life and if you care to know : I am rooting for you.
Bill G
ArboristSite King
I just ran across this thread. I have not had time to read it all but it sounds like you have dealt with some similar issues that I have had to deal with. I did see some give you advice that was wrong and will land you in court on the wrong side of the law.
Definitely keep us posted. The drone idea is a really good one. When they are turkey hunting, wait until a tom walks in to them and use the drone to run it off. That will put a smile on their face for sure
Bill G
ArboristSite King
It may put a smile on someones face but it will put your drone on the groundDefinitely keep us posted. The drone idea is a really good one. When they are turkey hunting, wait until a tom walks in to them and use the drone to run it off. That will put a smile on their face for sure
True. I'm operating under the assumption that it can be done with the drone remaining at a safe distance. Otherwise, wait for the poachers to get set up before daylight, then swoop in and flush the birds off their roost and push them in the opposite direction. The sound of the birds coming off their roost will likely generate a response.
Yeah, I rather imaging that using a drone to bug guys with shotguns loaded for turkey just wouldn't end up too well. They might even enjoy the drone hunt better than the turkeys. Drones might even be easier to bring down than tom turkeys.
Better off using the drone to catch them on your property and having them arrested in the act. It could be felony property damage if the drone is expensive enough and they are recorded damaging it giving them real jail time esp if prior arrests or trespasses are enforced.
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