Yes another chain/saw question

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For the hell of it, I grabbed 2 brand new Ms271 crankcases with the adjusters still intact, and in the same position that they came from the dealer, with the brand new bar and chain properly tensioned. I assume that one of them is off a 20 inch bar/chain, and the other 18".

barpos 003.JPGbarpos 004.JPGbarpos 005.JPG
 
Generally, if you can see any damage, it is bad. I generally show the customer, and tell them to put on a new sprocket when they get some new chains, as running a new chain on an old shot sprocket will quickly damage {stretch} the chains.
I had noticed that when I first used a new chain it seemed to stretch a LOT. Read the Carrollton publication on saw chain the other day… 🤦 So I’m going to be replacing my original (2008) rim sprocket when these two stretched chains are done!
 
How about put up some better photos of your stretched chains from both side and top showing the cutters? BTW, what are you using for sharpening? Hand file, jig, grinder?
Hand file only.
Here are 2 chains. Both are stretched to the adjuster limit.
The top one is past the file limit line the bottom one has almost all the tooth left but is to the adjuster limit and still has plenty of tooth left.
The top chain is the green and the bottom is the yellow.
IMG_5317.JPG
 
That does not explain why half the adjustment is used up with all new parts and no wear has been applied.
Half the adjustment is not "used up". if the chain was tight with the bar all the way back, you would have to remove the sprocket off the crank to get the chain on and off. The bar needs to be able to go back far enough to get the chain off. And to let you use a one tooth larger sprocket. And to account for manufacturing tolerances.

The only part of the slot that counts is the part you use on your particular saw, between "all new parts" and "worn out". If the slot ran all the way to the sprocket at the end would you feel ripped off?
 
Hand file only.
Here are 2 chains. Both are stretched to the adjuster limit.
The top one is past the file limit line the bottom one has almost all the tooth left but is to the adjuster limit and still has plenty of tooth left.
The top chain is the green and the bottom is the yellow.
View attachment 950105
Might just be the picture quality, but that bottom chain looks pretty blunt to me... A couple of well focused close up pics of the cutters from above & side on would be good
 
I have been using the same chain and bar setup for many years. Same bar, same chain. But the last year or so I have been running into a new problem. When I put on a brand new chain and I adjust it I end up with half the chain adjustment already half way used up. Here is a few pics.

This is my ms362 with a brand new chain and as you can see it's already half way along it's adjustment. Im running a 20 bar with a 36RM-72 chain#3652-005-0072 and is what all the sthil dealers recommend.
View attachment 949178


Here is my MS 261 with the same issue. I also run a 20'' bar with a 26RM - 81 Part # 3686-005-0081. On this one you can see there is less then half an inch of adjustment before I run out of adjustment. It also has a fairly new bar so not a lot of bar wear ether.
View attachment 949179


By the time it stretches past the limit of the adjustment I still have over half the teeth left. I keep my chains very sharp and never run them when they get dull. I am cutting green oak and I can usually get 5 or 6 tanks of gas run before I have to touch them up unless I hit something. This is with a new sprocket so sprocket wear shouldn't be the issue. I am also cutting mostly large rounds of at least 12'' to 48'' so I'm in big wood most of the time. Is this normal? I don't remember having this issue a few years ago. Am I using the wrong size chain? What's going on here. Thanks
I'm pretty new here but as a trade mechanic, I've seen manufacturers make other chain links smaller or larger, with the outcome being the same total length. Seen it alot on sand/salt hoppers and fresh air rooftop Regen transmissions. Thought I was goin crazy the first few times the tic marks for timing were what I thought were off but after calling the rep I found out the actual link size changed just a hair thereby setting everything else off. Not sure just a possibility. Have a safe day
M
 
Might just be the picture quality, but that bottom chain looks pretty blunt to me... A couple of well focused close up pics of the cutters from above & side on would be good
I did not resharpin the bottom chain after the last use when the adjustment was gone. Yes the bottom chain is dull. No sense sharpening a chain that can't be used anymore.
 
I did not resharpin the bottom chain after the last use when the adjustment was gone. Yes the bottom chain is dull. No sense sharpening a chain that can't be used anymore.
That makes sense however from what I can see in that picture the lower chain looks to be well overdue sharpening, to the degree it would be contributing to excessive wear (chain stretch etc) which is what we're trying to establish.
Screenshot_20211222-114708.png
That chain looks to be full chisel & if that's the case it looks to need at least 0.050" filed of to get it's cutting edge back.
If that is the case & that's a fair indicator of your sharpening intervals then it may we'll be a contributing factor to your issue.
Pretty hard to say anything definitive from that pic though, hence the request for a few more (especially of that lower chain)
 
That makes sense however from what I can see in that picture the lower chain looks to be well overdue sharpening, to the degree it would be contributing to excessive wear (chain stretch etc) which is what we're trying to establish.
View attachment 950198
That chain looks to be full chisel & if that's the case it looks to need at least 0.050" filed of to get it's cutting edge back.
If that is the case & that's a fair indicator of your sharpening intervals then it may we'll be a contributing factor to your issue.
Pretty hard to say anything definitive from that pic though, hence the request for a few more (especially of that lower chain)
It's just a bad pic.
 
Hand file only.
Here are 2 chains. Both are stretched to the adjuster limit.
The top one is past the file limit line the bottom one has almost all the tooth left but is to the adjuster limit and still has plenty of tooth left.
The top chain is the green and the bottom is the yellow.
View attachment 950105
Side views please... It also wouldn't hurt to hit the cutters with a small brass brush to remove the crud so that we can actually see the cutters.
 
Side views please... It also wouldn't hurt to hit the cutters with a small brass brush to remove the crud so that we can actually see the cutters.
You haven't read all my post because all the answers you are asking have been answered. Please go back and read so I don't have to keep repeating myself. Thanks
 
Probably, but without good pics you're unlikely to get good answers... especially given that generally excessive chain stretch will be due to either oiling, sharpening, or tensioning issues (or a combination of the above)
You haven't read all my post because all the answers you are asking have been answered. Please go back and read so I don't have to keep repeating myself. Thanks
 
Some of you keep attacking my sharpening skills or saying my issue is poor sharpening or running a dull chain. I can assure you that is not the case because my issue is with all new parts not having enough adjustment. It has nothing to do with how sharp a chain is. That is a whole other issue that does not apply here.
 
Some of you keep attacking my sharpening skills or saying my issue is poor sharpening or running a dull chain. I can assure you that is not the case because my issue is with all new parts not having enough adjustment. It has nothing to do with how sharp a chain is. That is a whole other issue that does not apply here.
For the record... I have this same issue with a 361. I doubt if it’s going to be solved here because it seems beat to death.
 
I have to admit this thread has so far been entertaining- much like watching a good train wreck in slow motion. Some of the folks here are putting Much too much stress into chain tensioning and adjustment.

When I was but an innocent youngster, I worked as a landing chaser/second loader for a small gypo logger in Northwest California. We spent most of one summer logging nothing but tan oak. Why? I'm not really sure- the big timber company wanted tan oak, and we were elected to do the logging, it being their land and all and they sure as heck didn't want to do it.

Anyway, the timber fallers HATED the stuff because the bark tended to cook on and stick to their chains, slowing down the whole program. The fellers soon discovered it was much easier to have the dozer operator (they were all brothers, by the way) push the trees over with the D-8 and drag them in tree-length to the landing , usually while pushing several more tree-lengths in front with the blade, where I stood by with my trusty 60's vintage Homelite 66 Super Whiz gear drive with 42" bar and Oregon #16 chipper chain, ready to buck off the root wads, lop the limbs and buck into log lengths after everything had been skidded a quarter mile through the mud and grit. The fellers were getting paid truck scale, so it was a win-win for them.

So, you got half a dozen 24"-36+" diameter tree-lengths and what ever the cat skinner could push about every 15 or so minutes, while also attending to getting the trailers down and hooked up, making out trip tickets,filing the chain (only had one, and it was about shot- gypo operation, you understand), mixing gas, cutting chokers (which were by now completely embedded into the afore-mentioned root wads) and making whatever repairs that couldn't wait until later.

I was the only chaser, and we were averaging a million board feet per month. Suffice to say, you looked for every possible way so shave a second or two, and chain adjustment was one of them. One of the biggest time savers was to remove the adjusting screw and bar stud, and dispose of them in an environmentally appropriate manner, iE: chuck 'em into the brush.

Thereafter, when the chain needed tightening, you loosened the bar nuts, slipped the screwdriver end of your bar wrench into the bar slot and levered the bar out slightly, as necessary to snug up the chain. took perhaps 1-2 seconds, compared to futz-ing around with the adjusting screw, and also eliminated a lot of tightener travel issues. When you ran out of bar slot, then it was time to do something about it, like beg and plead for a new second hand chain that had been thrown away down at the sawmill. This was one of the many hacks you learned in order to have a fighting chance of not getting buried alive.

50 years later I still do it that way.

Hope this was helpful....

Pete.
 
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