Yes another chain/saw question

[4CornersPuddle]

Porosonik, great tale of what we had to put up with at times in the logging woods. You bring baack memories to me of my felling career starting nearly 50 years ago-summer of 1972.
I recall tightening my chain on my old 924 Homelite when the adjuster screw fell out and was lost just as you related. I'd stay in the woods camp for many days before going to town for grub, saw repair, whatever else I didn't have in camp. So I often had to be resourceful to keep working.
We now have a tanoak floor in our home. I'm glad I didn't have to log it as you described!

 

[dozi]

To summarise...

when the saw was new, everything fitted and adjustments were within spec

now with 100s of hours on the saw, BUT with new sprocket, bar, chain, its out of wack.

if ALL of the swapped parts are OEM sized then adjustment logically should revert to as new

 

[HarleyT]

To summarise...

when the saw was new, everything fitted and adjustments were within spec

now with 100s of hours on the saw, BUT with new sprocket, bar, chain, its out of wack.

if ALL of the swapped parts are OEM sized then adjustment logically should revert to as new

It ran a while on the old shot sprocket, so it could be part of the issue.

 

[J D]

Some of you keep attacking my sharpening skills or saying my issue is poor sharpening or running a dull chain. I can assure you that is not the case because my issue is with all new parts not having enough adjustment. It has nothing to do with how sharp a chain is. That is a whole other issue that does not apply here.

I don't think anyone was attacking your sharpening technique (with the exception of that 1 post a few back) rather just querying it as a possible factor. There are questions posted here every week where the OP is adamant their sharpening/tension/technique/etc is beyond reproach & more often than not that ends up not being the case... so forgive us for being sceptical. A few decent pic's with a brief explanation would clear things up nicely & allow things to move forward.
With regard to "not having enough adjustment on an all new setup" that half inch of travel is not uncommonly stingy. As previously stated there has to be enough room to fit a bigger rim & still have enough bar travel to put the chain on. Stihl have always had shortish slots & it doesn't seem to be a particularly common complaint. What is less common is to have a 20" chain stretch by an inch (ie more than half an inch of adjustment will compensate for) before the cutters are worn out... So by my reconning you should be looking to either address whatever is causing your excessive chain stretch, or accept it as part of how you run your saw & compensate by running either a larger rim or shorter chains

 

[BrettS]

No that is the bar off the very first ms290 I bought 20 years ago. I guess you could say I hold on to useless things. lol
It is the only bar that the bearings went out on in 20 years of cutting firewood. That bar has hundreds of hours on it. It's been hanging on a nail in my shop for years. I guess I should throw it out. I have a bunch of worn out chains still hanging on the wall as well that need throwing out.

Same here, but the bars could make good knives.

 

[LoneOak]

It ran a while on the old shot sprocket, so it could be part of the issue.

Again I'm calling H.... S...! Worn/Shot - Rims or Spurs DO NOT S-T-R-E-T-C-H CHAIN! This is folk lore, wife's tale, myth, fake news! And this myth is busted!

But before that, a re-cap; for how I run my rims. Does it look worn or shot to you? At this point, it will be flipped before the saw is used in my next tree job. YES! You can flip rims just like you flip bars!


Fresh Chain hot off the roll!

Clapped out chain vs new!


No monkey business!! Both chains are stretched tight!

 

[LoneOak]

One whole 1/2" of stretch! Over the new chain!

Again....Worn or shot spurs and rims will not stretch or damage chain! Myth Busted!

 

[sb47]

View attachment 950305
One whole 1/2" of stretch! Over the new chain!
View attachment 950306
Again....Worn or shot spurs and rims will not stretch or damage chain! Myth Busted!

I tend to agree with you. I've been running drives till they are completely shot for many years and never had an issue with excessive stretching. And I still don't. My issue is the starting point on a new chain being half way gone before I even start. I'm still doing everything the same as I have for years. If the worn drive was an issue, it would cause binding and there would be a noticeable drag and the chain wouldn't spin as freely. It seems everyone is obsessed with how I'm sharpening or a worn drive and they are not addressing the problem I have with new parts and the starting point adjustment being half way gone at the start.

 

[LoneOak]

I tend to agree with you. I've been running drives till they are completely shot for many years and never had an issue with excessive stretching. And I still don't. My issue is the starting point on a new chain being half way gone before I even start. I'm still doing everything the same as I have for years. If the worn drive was an issue, it would cause binding and there would be a noticeable drag and the chain wouldn't spin as freely. It seems everyone is obsessed with how I'm sharpening or a worn drive and they are not addressing the problem I have with new parts and the starting point adjustment being half way gone at the start.

Have you always "only" purchased one type of chain from one manufacturer? Something to consider is that things can change from time to time, even for one type of product from one manufacturer; Processes, materials, tooling. And even tough you only buy one type of product from that one manufacturer, they may have had something change; and had to change something in the process, or supply of said product.

My best guess is that you were buying an un-popular type of chain that previously was not apart of a pre-stretching process until all old stock/supply was used up. Now a new loop of the same old chain has a new process in its manufacturing.

 

[HarleyT]

That rim looks pretty dang rough. Have you ever replaced a rim?
If so, why?
The bottom drive links sure show it.

 

[LoneOak]

That rim looks pretty dang rough. Have you ever replaced a rim?
If so, why?
The bottom drive links sure show it.
View attachment 950308

Have I ever replaced a rim? Yes, hundreds of them. I have been running saws since 1992.

Why? If you look at the arrow in the picture below, it points to an area that I use for reference when judging rim wear. When it reaches the point at which it becomes a knife edge that is when I chuck them, because to me, that is when they are worn out!



The bottom drivers show what?
Normal wear from being spun around a bar @50 ft/sec for 100 hrs?

By the way, a chain will usually survive through an Avg. of 4 rims. At least by my Standards of Operation.

 

[Okie]

I've been watching this thread and I'm not sure if the problem has been solve. I was wondering, if a person could just drill a new hole (3/16?, 1/4"?) at the right position on the bar to accommodate a half used chain? Use the original tensioner hole until it's maxed out. Then switch to the new one.

IMHO;
I have not read all this thread but;
The answer to your question is frankly NO.
If you can put a new correct size chain on the bar and sprocket in question and all operates smooth this lets you know that you are just trying to use a chain that needs throw in the TRASH CAN.
Stretched chains can ruin other things fast.

 

[MesquiteFreak]

I have a slightly different idea of tightening my chain, I saw or read this somewhere and looked it over and switched to this way because now I think it's best. What it is, is finding the chains tighten when the bar is on the lowest possible position. Because if the bar moves up for any reason it only makes the chain more loose. We're if you tighten it for when the bar is in the upward position and the bar lowers it only gets tighter. I cut with my saw equally with pressure on the top as the bottom. With my saw set up with the bar in the lowest position I don't feel the need to gorilla torque the nuts holding the bar in place because if it moves a little it's no biggie.

One last thing have you checked your crankshaft to make sure there is no play? Or any bearing the clutch rides on? I'm thinking that might cause things to not be the same.

I'm sorry if this has already been asked, there is so much to this thread already but did you happen to compare the old chains and the new chains?

 

[501Maico]

Could someone have switched your drive with one less tooth. This thread is very Twilight Zoneish so figured I would ask.

 

[dave ensign]

sb47

There is nothing wrong with your saw or your sharpening/operating. The amount of travel of the adjuster is designed to allow the use of both seven and eight tooth sprockets, 325 and 3/8 chain, an endless variety of bars, and the average amount of stretch over the life of the average chain. You are not starting with only half the intended adjustment. You are starting (if all new parts) with enough adjustment to get full use of your chain based upon the makers specifications. When everything or most things, (sprocket, chain, adjuster and bar) reach a level of ware, you have reached the limit of adjustment. As I stated earlier if I had a pile of half used chains, I would try an 8 tooth sprocket.

 

[PV Hiker]

Here is my two MS261C-M chainsaws. These are Version 2 models. One with 3/8" and the other with.325" rim sprockets. Look at where the bar is. I believe on both the chain is off the bottom of the bar (loose).

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..

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And here is a image of the 3/8" rim sprocket with the chain tensioned. * Notice it seems to match the adjustment position near the same as yours.
.

 

[MMG]

Here is my two MS261C-M chainsaws. These are Version 2 models. One with 3/8" and the other with.325" rim sprockets. Look at where the bar is. I believe on both the chain is off the bottom of the bar (loose).
View attachment 950444View attachment 950445
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.View attachment 950446.

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And here is a image of the 3/8" rim sprocket with the chain tensioned. * Notice it seems to match the adjustment position near the same as yours.
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View attachment 950447

Stop it! All these pics of super clean saws is making me crazy. None of my saws look like that even after a clean em!

 

[PV Hiker]

Stop it! All these pics of super clean saws is making me crazy. None of my saws look like that even after a clean em!

HaaHaa!! They start off looking nice and slowly they gain personality and maturity.

 

[dozi]

https://blog.stihl.co.uk/when-to-replace-chainsaw-chain-sprocket-or-guide-bar/

 

[LoneOak]

https://blog.stihl.co.uk/when-to-replace-chainsaw-chain-sprocket-or-guide-bar/

HA HA, that is funny! post a blog from a manufacture who wants to sell you things!! Of course they will recommend that you replace "Wear Items" at the slightest sign of wear. That's how they make money!