511A Grinder - Improvements / Tweaks?

[Philbert]

Chain Positioning Stop

I started a thread on cheap, Harbor Freight grinders: http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/hf-chain-grinder-thread.268303/
and one on a similar looking Oregon mini-grinder: http://www.arboristsite.com/community/threads/oregon-310-mini-grinder.283691/
where I noticed that the chain positioning stop ('dog', 'pawl', etc.) on the 310 grinder was positioned much higher than the others. This resulted in the cutter being forced down into the chain holding vise, in addition to keeping it from sliding back. My only concern on that grinder was clearance for the motor.

Then I started thinking about my 511A (back to this thread), and wondered if the stop could be raised to hold the cutters down better on this grinder. There is certainly enough clearance for the motor. Both the 'chain stop' and its support post ('chain stop holder') are pretty simple, and could be fabricated out of either flat steel, or some 'U'-shaped channel.

I took some approximate measurements on my 511A, and a Tecomec Speed Sharp grinder (similar to a 511AX) and found the stop length about 1-7/8 inches long; the support post height about 2-1/4 inches tall, and about 1 inch wide on both of these models. On a Tecomec Super Jolly (similar to Oregon 109179 hydraulic grinder) the stop is about 3/8 of an inch longer; the support post about 3/4 of an inch taller; but slightly narrower (about 3/4 of an inch).




Not sure why they are different, but I'm thinking that if I can swap in the longer/taller stops it should hold the cutters better on my 511AX. If it works, replacement parts from the manufacturer would be easier than making them.

Philbert

 

[Philbert]

Tecomec Super Jolly vise for comparison. Taller support post and steeper angle of chain stop is apparent. Approximate dimensions in post above.


Philbert

 

[brian99574]

I have the tecomec jolly hydraulic grinder. It replaced a Oregon 511A. The hydraulic model is definitely faster. Other wise the clamp is better on the jolly but everything is about the same. Done 100's of sharpening on the Oregon and just wanted to try another grinder. I recommend either one.

 

[redoakneck]

Looks like shortening the cutter stop on the 511 may help prevent the cutter from raising up in the back??? Might try cutting a 1/2 inch off the end and see if pulling on the left side of the chain pulls the cutter down and tighter while clamping.

Easier for me to pull down on the left side of the hanging chain, than to use a dowel to push the cutter down and clamp at the same time.

 

[lambs]

Looks like shortening the cutter stop on the 511 may help prevent the cutter from raising up in the back??? Might try cutting a 1/2 inch off the end and see if pulling on the left side of the chain pulls the cutter down and tighter while clamping.

Easier for me to pull down on the left side of the hanging chain, than to use a dowel to push the cutter down and clamp at the same time.

I push the cutter down and back with my right hand while I start to tighten the cam with my left hand.

 

[Philbert]

Twins!


(Just like that Arnold Schwarzenegger / Danny DeVito movie).

Philbert

 

[Philbert]

Frankengrinder!



Pretty direct swap. Had to bush out the mounting bolt slightly, due to the narrower width of the taller support post (bolts were same length - vises are different thickness).

Philbert

 

[rd35]

I push the cutter down and back with my right hand while I start to tighten the cam with my left hand.

Me too!

 

[Philbert]

I Have the Clearance, Clarence!


Taller support post and longer stop mounted on 511A. Also tried it with the grinding wheel completely removed. Could be an issue when the wheel is completely run down?

We'll see!

Philbert

 

[Nine6Teen]

Hi ... newb here ... go easy on me.
Can someone explain how and why it is necessary to slightly adjust the chain stop length when you switch over from the right side cutters to the left side cutters ? and what is the definition of right side versus left side cutters, and does it matter if you do either side first ? thanks

 

[Philbert]

Initial Results/Impressions . . .

I push the cutter down and back with my right hand while I start to tighten the cam with my left hand.

Me too!

This has been mentioned a few times in this thread. Trying to avoid having to do that.

I tried it with a test chain: STIHL, .325, .063, 62 DL bumper drive links, very similar to those I have been sharpening lately. Ground Left and Right cutters, chased gullets on both sides, adjusted the depth gauges (L and R separately): all the things I would normally do on a grinder. Very positive results. The taller post/longer stop seems to be hold the cutters more securely down. This has especially been an issue grinding depth gauges, because they are at the front of the cutter, and the chain vise essentially holds the drive link in front of the cutter being sharpened, not the cutter itself. So if the cutter's heel was going to tilt up, that would be the time.

I am going to check with my dealer about buying replacement parts for the taller post/longer stop and will post any part numbers and prices here that I can find. Some guys might want to make these parts on their own.

Philbert

 

[Philbert]

Can someone explain how and why it is necessary to slightly adjust the chain stop length when you switch over from the right side cutters to the left side cutters ?

These are 'semi-precision' grinders, so there is some error in them. Depending on the model you have/use, there is a procedure for centering the vise so that the R and L cutters are ground to the same length. This should be in your owner's manual, and is mentioned in several A.S. threads. Even then, it is just good practice to assume that there will be some difference, and to compensate for that with your work methods.

There is also a difference in the depth that the wheel grinds for R and L cutters, because the edge of the wheel touches each at a different part of it's circumference. Again, good work methods compensate for that (see bottom of this reply).

what is the definition of right side versus left side cutters . . .

As the operator is holding the saw with the bar and chain mounted correctly, the cutters on the right side are the right cutters, and the cutters on the left side . . . (well, you get it now).

. . .does it matter if you do either side first ?

Up to you. In my experience, with my grinder, the cutters on the L side tend to get ground off a bit shorter. So I do all the L side cutters first, then the right side - because I can always adjust the stop to take off a little more off the R, but hard to put metal back on if they come up shorter!

I grind the L cutters first. Then I do a 'test' cutter on the R side; stop the grinder; hold a sharpened L cutter back-to-back with my test R cutter; and adjust the chain stop to match length. Then I eyeball the depth of grind, and adjust that, if needed (usually 1/4 to 1/2 a turn) to match. Your results may vary.

Philbert

 

[redoakneck]

I have been try to find a compact florescent bulb to replace the dim dino bulb, doesn't look like they make one. Back to using a different light source.

 

[lambs]

I have adjusted my grinder to get the cutters the same length but it almost doesn't matter. One side or the other is always damaged and needs to be ground away. Then I just sharpen the cutters on the other side and adjust depth gauges on both sides to the cutters.

I use the plastic template to measure cutter length but the Stihl depth gauge tool works well too.

 

[Moparmyway]

I have been try to find a compact florescent bulb to replace the dim dino bulb, doesn't look like they make one. Back to using a different light source.

I think LED would give you a better chance at getting something to work ........... dont think there is enough room for a CFL

 

[Moparmyway]

Initial Results/Impressions . . .




This has been mentioned a few times in this thread. Trying to avoid having to do that.

I tried it with a test chain: STIHL, .325, .063, 62 DL bumper drive links, very similar to those I have been sharpening lately. Ground Left and Right cutters, chased gullets on both sides, adjusted the depth gauges (L and R separately): all the things I would normally do on a grinder. Very positive results. The taller post/longer stop seems to be hold the cutters more securely down. This has especially been an issue grinding depth gauges, because they are at the front of the cutter, and the chain vise essentially holds the drive link in front of the cutter being sharpened, not the cutter itself. So if the cutter's heel was going to tilt up, that would be the time.

I am going to check with my dealer about buying replacement parts for the taller post/longer stop and will post any part numbers and prices here that I can find. Some guys might want to make these parts on their own.

Philbert

So..........
the taller support post (by about 3/4") and longer stop (by about 1/2") are working to secure the chain better while grinding.

I will be making a support post and stop out of some scrap metal I have laying around, and just looking to confirm my rather crude math-e-matics that I gleaned from your pictures.

As usual Philbert, great work and super pictures !!!
Thank You !!

 

[Philbert]

So..........
the taller support post (by about 3/4") and longer stop (by about 1/2") are working to secure the chain better while grinding.

Yeah; seems to push the cutters down as well as back. Just make sure that you have clearance with the motor all the way down, and a worn-to-the-limit wheel mounted.

This probably works with a long list of Oregon and clone grinders. If you make a bunch up, you will have lots of friends around the time of the next 'Xmas Giving' thread!

I checked in with my dealer and am waiting on a price for the entire support post/spring/chain stop assembly. It appears to be Total/Tecomec part number TMK 00200334 'Chain Hold Kit'. I was waiting until I received one (assuming the price did not make me gag), and verified the dimensions, before suggesting this to others, but there is the number if anyone else is interested.

Philbert

 

[lwhaples]

I have a Efco grinder and after reading this thread,I'd like to Thank Mr Philbert for starting it. Lots of good info being shared.Will be trying some of the tips to get a better cutting chain.

 

[Philbert]

I have a Efco grinder . . .

Is it basically the same, aside from cosmetic differences?

Thanks.

Philbert

 

[Nine6Teen]

These are 'semi-precision' grinders, so there is some error in them. Depending on the model you have/use,

I got the Oregon 511AX, which I was thought was the top of the line. paid over $300 ... but sounds like from reading through many of the above posts, that's it's an average machine, that could use some improvements, especially with the vise.