Square filing. Who has tried, and given up?

[parrisw]

Will,

There are a few options to get rid of the slop.

1) You weld shim stock to the tubing to get rid of the slop.

2) Run stringer welds the length of the tubing and grind them down until you have a tight fit. . . Or mill them off if you have a mill.

3) You drill an extra hole in your receiver and weld a 3/4" (or 5/8" or 1/2") nut to the outside of the hole, and use a bolt made into a t-handle set screw. . . Tightens her right up.

I like #3!

 

[Metals406]

I like #3!

We use #3 at the shop for all our vices. The welding tables have receiver tubes welded underneath the table. . . And the vices all have tubing and mounting plates on them.

This allows us to set our vices in various places very quickly.

 

[ronT2]

When I was learning to square file I hit myself in the nose with my filing hand so hard I just kinda gave up. Not completely but now I rarely file.

I can relate but I just kept at it.


After reading some of Andy’s posts over on the Chain Forum and watching the videos he also has posted here I decided to give square filing a try last winter. It’s been a fun and at times a frustrating learning curve but I find myself square filling more and more.

I’ve kind of settled in with a double bevel file for now. Right now my biggest problem is not getting the inside corners to intersect where I like. I can get the working corner pretty good but the inside corner intersects more toward the top plate. My guess is that I’m not getting as much of a downward angle with the file as I should.

I don’t think you’ll have much luck square filing with two hands on the file. I’ve found that I really have to steady the cutter with one hand in order to get the corner of the file in the working corner of the cutter with any consistency. You can see Andy doing it in his videos. YMMV though.

 

[WKEND LUMBERJAK]

Has any one used the Atop from Bailys?

 

[super3]

I believe I can file round pretty darn good. But I really like doing it with the saw in a vise, just feels much better that way. I'd love to have a vise mounted to my truck.

I bolt this on when going to the woods. Makes touch ups sq. or round pretty fast.

 

[redprospector]

Although square doesn't last as long as round chisel, the difference is less than commonly cited IMO.

But once the tip dulls, you have to stop using it or you will pound the tip back and sharpening takes longer.

I always bring a bag of chains when I cut, with multiples of every bar length I pack. Not saying no one sharpens well in the field, but I've only met a couple folks that actually did really good job on site in the heat of the moment.

Typically just too much going on for them to take the time to do a really good job. With me I swap in a fresh chain.

I have been told by friends in the business that studies show on the average productivity is better with swapping in fresh chains rather than sharpening on the stop, and I believe it.

Your friends may be right, I don't know for sure.
When I started out the mills were so tight I couldn't afford a bunch of chains. We called it "Po boy loggin'".
I always carry at least one spare chain, but I only use it if I hit a rock or something that really screws up the cutters. There's been a lot of times that a chain never came off the saw until it was ready to be thrown away.
As I said earlier I can touch up one on a 28" bar (about all I run anymore) in about 6 or 7 minutes. I can probably change one out in 3 minutes, but then I'd probably stand there and scratch my ass for another 3 minutes.

Andy

 

[redprospector]

I can relate but I just kept at it.


After reading some of Andy’s posts over on the Chain Forum and watching the videos he also has posted here I decided to give square filing a try last winter. It’s been a fun and at times a frustrating learning curve but I find myself square filling more and more.

I’ve kind of settled in with a double bevel file for now. Right now my biggest problem is not getting the inside corners to intersect where I like. I can get the working corner pretty good but the inside corner intersects more toward the top plate. My guess is that I’m not getting as much of a downward angle with the file as I should.

I don’t think you’ll have much luck square filing with two hands on the file. I’ve found that I really have to steady the cutter with one hand in order to get the corner of the file in the working corner of the cutter with any consistency. You can see Andy doing it in his videos. YMMV though.

The best advice I can give you on hitting the inside corner is if your file is not marking the tie strap you're not at the right angle. A lot of people worry about the file hitting the tie strap, but it won't hurt a thing.
I agree about filing with two hands. When cleaning out the gullets I like to put it in a vice and use two hands when possible. But with a 7" double bevel file I've never had much luck using two hands.

Andy

 

[redprospector]

If you happen to be one of those people who are concerned about nicking the tie straps with the bottom of the file............This may put your mind at ease.

It's not a work chain, but I did nick the tie straps with the file.
This one has several runs on it in 12" to 18" wood on a not stock 3120.

If you're not hitting the tie straps you will have a hard time matching the inside corner.

Andy

 

[redprospector]

I'm digging for video's of work chain. Here's the first one I came up with.
The rules were stock saw (right down to having the screen in the muffler), running a "work chain". The cutting edge was all that could be touched. The saw is a 372.



Andy

 

[BobL]

There's been a lot of times that a chain never came off the saw until it was ready to be thrown away.

Wow - didn't need to dress the bar once in that time? - you must be cutting jello?

 

[cat-face timber]

Log Cutters

Around here alot of the log cutters use either the square or the triangle files, the chains cut faster, but for me it would be hard to justify the cost of the files.

 

[ronT2]

Thanks for the advice Andy, I’ll give it a try.


I can’t even begin to guess how many hours go into a chain like this.

 

[AUSSIE1]

My hand round filed chisel wasn't any slower than the out of the box Husqvarna square chisel, so a hand filed square must certainly make a reasonable difference which I wouldn't have thought unless you were adding some "features".

I bought a file but haven't got around to giving it a go.

 

[redprospector]

Wow - didn't need to dress the bar once in that time? - you must be cutting jello?

Yeah, sometimes. If a bar needs dressing, it get's dressed. Maybe you're harder on bars than me. I wouldn't especially call NM Douglas Fir jello, but some of the Ponderosa Pine is pretty soft. Being this close to the White Sands, and with the New Mexico winds chains don't last too long here. I thought you guy's had abrasive wood.
That's just another unadvertised benefit to running square chisel. Since the chain cuts smoother, and actually cuts ranther than tearing out the wood you get less wear on the bar, and the saw.

Andy

 

[redprospector]

Around here alot of the log cutters use either the square or the triangle files, the chains cut faster, but for me it would be hard to justify the cost of the files.

Yep, it's definately not for everyone. If you're not making a living with a saw the only justification is braggin' rights.

Andy

 

[redprospector]

Thanks for the advice Andy, I’ll give it a try.


I can’t even begin to guess how many hours go into a chain like this.

Hahaha. More hours than I really care to think about. I keep wanting to think I'm getting quicker, but usually between 30 and 40 hours go into one of those. If I decided to sell them I'd have to work too cheap.
I only posted that pic to show that hitting the tie strap with the file ain't gonna' hurt nothing.

Andy

 

[redprospector]

This is a bone stock 7900 28" bar with work chain. These videos are all taken at between 8 & 9000' elevation. Somewhere I've got a video of a new 681 cutting this same log with the same bar & chain from when romeo & I did a comparison. But I haven't found it yet.



Sorry I don't have any of round chain.

Andy

 

[WKEND LUMBERJAK]

Bump

 

[Rounder]

I'm still filing square. . . And bought a square grinder that I have yet to setup.

I prefer square to round. . . A LOT!

I just don't like paying $10.00 a file for square.

Yeah, it's kind of a bummer when you loose a 3-corner on the hill! - Sam

 

[Gypo Logger]

Anyone who fails at sq.filing can be rest assured that the square files make the best raker files bar none. They outlast a raker file at least 6X, so the files are not a lost investment no matter how you look at it.
Gypo