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Wrist Rocket and 1.75mm Line?

Discussion in 'Recreational Tree Climbing' started by SteveSr, Nov 27, 2016.

  1. SteveSr

    SteveSr ArboristSite Guru

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    Hello,

    For the record I am NOT a tree climber and don't even play one on TV! I do a lot of volunteer trail work removing hung and hazard trees with a griphoist. For trail work there is usually a lot of underbrush and a lot of obstacles which makes using a regular throw bag a dicey proposition. Ideally we are trying to get the griphoist rope 40-70 feet up in a tree, usually on the lowest branch.

    We have already tried some experiments with 50# fishing line and a Daisy wrist slingshot. After about 2 1/2 hours of messing with invisible (in the tree) fishing line we managed to complete our first line set. I am hoping that there is an easier way.

    1. What are your thoughts on using the small 1.75mm Zing-It line and either a small throw bag or fishing weights? Any idea of the heights that we could reach with an appropriate sized weight and a Wrist Rocket type of slingshot? We would like to avoid the Big Shot type of setup due to the excess weight that has to be carried out into the woods let alone the cost.

    2. What are your thoughts on using one of these collapsible storage cubes for playing out the 1.75mm line? Will this work or is it still likely to get tangled since it is so light? One of our BIG issues with the fishing line test was the line getting tangled with twigs and such on the ground.

    Thanks,

    Steve
     
  2. benjo75

    benjo75 ArboristSite Operative

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    Richard Mumford has a video where he is sitting on his deck experimenting with a small slingshot. He even found a way to mount it to his foot to use in the tree. I'll look for the youtube link and post it later. You would need a small weight. I think the smallest throw weight I have is 6 oz. With the right size weight you should be able to reach 50 or 60 ft pretty easy.

    I use a cube for my line. It pays out just fine. Most of the time. When you miss you would need to flake it back into the cube before re firing or it will inevitably pick up some debris. A lot of folks lay down a small tarp to put their gear on and flake their throw line on. Maybe a 8x10 tarp. I don't use a tarp. I usually hit my target first or second time by hand. I did have an episode last week in the woods where I had more trouble than I've ever had trying to get an SRT line through 2 pine tops. I fought with it for quite a while. I had a birdnest in my throw line 3 times which required complete disassembly. I was about ready to throw it away.
     
  3. benjo75

    benjo75 ArboristSite Operative

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    Its called... "Altered a Hyperdog slingshot for foot mounted throw bag placement". It's a ways down his list of vids. I can't seem to copy the link on my phone. His channel is Richard Mumford. I think he is a member here. He invented the SAKA knee ascender and lots of other tools that have really helped us climbers out. His channel is full of useful info.
     
  4. SteveSr

    SteveSr ArboristSite Guru

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    Thanks for the link to Richard. I started sorting through the videos but it is getting late. Looks like I might not get much real work done tomorrow!
     
  5. benjo75

    benjo75 ArboristSite Operative

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    No problem. I just counted and it's about 192 videos down.
     
  6. TheJollyLogger

    TheJollyLogger Addicted to ArboristSite

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    I always feel like these threads should be titled, "Is there a way to become an expert with a throw line without actually practicing?"

    The main reason a Big shot is the size it is is to launch a 10- 16 ounce weight. The reason you need a weight that size is to counter the weight of the throw line. Coming up with a small cheap method of putting a small weight 60 plus feet in the air where you want it doesn't solve your problem, unless you're squirrel hunting. There is a reason none of the arborist suppliers sell wrist rockets, or crossbows, or any of the other idiotic cheats guys have come up with over the years... They Don't Work!

    The cheapest way to reliably set a line where you want it is to practice. If you will commit a half hour a day for two weeks, you'll be amazed at what is possible. Start at 20'. When you can hit that 9 times out of 10, move up to 30, and so on. By the end of two weeks youll be hitting a 70' limb consistently.

    As far as setup goes, a tarp can be helpful in an underbrush situation, but the most important thing is to have the discipline to reset after every miss. Whether your using a bucket, cube or tarp, reset everything so that a good throw isn't wasted.
     
  7. hatchetation

    hatchetation New Member

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    I'm confused. Are all cheats idiotic? Just the cheats that aren't commercially available? The ones that don't work? The ones that make the job any easier than a rubber-coated throw ball?

    I've had great luck with 25# Spectra fishing line (P-Line Hydrofloat), in hi-viz green, with a 1oz egg weight. Can either be deployed straight off the factory reel, or using a small spinning reel mounted to the wrist rocket.

    The spectra line is very low-stretch, and is pretty slick. 1/2 oz wasn't enough to reliably get the line to return to ground. 1 oz does a pretty good job.

    I do a lot of climbing in forests with dense underbrush, and find the slingshot to work in a lot of situations that would be difficult with a throw bag.

    There's a good example of an similar idiotic setup here:

     
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  8. TheJollyLogger

    TheJollyLogger Addicted to ArboristSite

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    What the he'll good is a 25# line 70' up in a tree? Tie a 3/4" bull rope on and see how far you get.

    My main point is that mastering a throw line is not some mythical unattainable skill. It just takes some dedication and practice, just like every other skill in this business.
     
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  9. tylerbeach3

    tylerbeach3 fellimbuck spiltn'burn

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    Always with the most common sense facts!! Thanks jolly!
     
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  10. TheJollyLogger

    TheJollyLogger Addicted to ArboristSite

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    I'm not making this **** up, or a genius or something, just been there done that. Believe me, if a wrist rocket worked, we'd all have one. Nobody wants to drop 150 on a Big shot... until they've used one...
     
  11. tylerbeach3

    tylerbeach3 fellimbuck spiltn'burn

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    Nothing better than a big shot I know. It is fun to experiment though... that's how the big shot was invented. What do you think about crossbows?
     
  12. benjo75

    benjo75 ArboristSite Operative

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    I use my BigShot regularly. Yesterday I was between a house and a fence. Only about 5 ft between the two. Had to set a line about 80 ft up a Pine. The only way to throw by hand was straight up. No way I could hit my limb that way. Got it on the 2nd try with the BigShot. Was using a trigger. The first time I went all the way over the tree. 2nd time was perfect.

    Tylerbeach3 , I think a crossbow would be too powerful for me. Not sure how you would adjust the power. There's very few trees here in Arkansas that are over 100 ft. In my area anyway. I can hit 80 ft by hand pretty easy if I have room to throw. I have marks on my BigShot as to the distance. It's close enough for me. With my BigShot I can clear several 90 ft trees with one shot. Plus I regularly work around wires so I don't want to overshoot sometimes. Plus the neighbors don't like your throwbag landing on their room at daylight.
     
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  13. tylerbeach3

    tylerbeach3 fellimbuck spiltn'burn

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    Lol that makes sense.
     
  14. TheJollyLogger

    TheJollyLogger Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Guys have been playing with wrist rockets, crossbows, potato guns, etc. For years. There's a reason they haven't caught on. They Don't work well. There's also a reason the wheels on your truck are round. Use a Big shot once, and you'll stop looking for another method. Spend a couple hours with a guy that can throw, and you'll realize practice is a cheap solution.
     
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  15. tylerbeach3

    tylerbeach3 fellimbuck spiltn'burn

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    I know what you are saying and agree. If we all had thought that things are as efficient and effective as they are ever going be there would be no ingenuity or genius or invention at all. I think we can all look back in history when humans thought they were as good as they be... always room for improvement. What about setting line with drones or remote control helicopters? Not trying to play devil advocate, I DO know the big shot is the best we have now...
     
  16. benjo75

    benjo75 ArboristSite Operative

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    A drone with a camera would be a cool idea. I feel I would loose my drone pretty soon though. Then I would have a drone in the top of a tree with 200 ft of throw line all wrapped up in it. There are some air powered launchers that work pretty well. And some that use 22 caps of different loads. I'm always open to something better. That's why I climb SRT and not spur and flipline. That's why I use a tree brake instead of wrapping the trunk. I'm always thinking of better and easier ways of getting something done. But I'm usually reinventing the wheel.
     
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  17. TheJollyLogger

    TheJollyLogger Addicted to ArboristSite

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    Oh, we'll go ahead and play with this a little more. Keep in mind setting a line is a very small, yet crucial part of tree work in general. This is a problem that has been pretty much solved. The best advances in the last decade have been in climber comfort, safety, and ease of access. SRT, and new devices to make the climbers job easier are great.
    Getting back to line setting techniques, the one forgotten aspect that even the Big Shot falls short in is line control, meaning what happens after the shot, or throw. A good thrower keeps the line running through his hand, and can control the weight after the throw, isolating a limb, or redirecting the weight around the trunk. So in theory, yes, a drone could be the next step, and probably will. Of course, it will have plenty of drawbacks as well; twigs, thick growth, etc. The biggest challenge, of course, is it's solving a problem that doesn't really exist.
     
  18. tylerbeach3

    tylerbeach3 fellimbuck spiltn'burn

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    Well said
     

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